Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings - updated 11/5/24*

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228028#Comment_120228028

Is there such a thing as "controlled immigration"? If only 5000 people decide to move to Ireland in 2023, we are not in "control" of that figure. If 42,000 move here in 2024, we are not in control of that figure either.

The sham / fiasco known as Brexit was supposedly all about controlling immigration from the EU and we all know how that ended. The idea that we can control immigration seems a bit of a fallacy - there are way too many variables involved that are outside the reach of the government. It would be like thinking you can control the birth rate or the marriage rate or how many people take a holiday abroad or how much people spend on leisure activities in a year.

Strumms

Italy has called for more money for Africa, Hungary wanted more walls and France said the EU should help fight poverty and terrorism around the world, as well as combat global warming to see fewer people on the move.....

Ladies and gentlemen I give you.. the EU

So Italy wants the working man and woman of the EU to bail Africa out by throwing more of our hard earned cash at them hand over fist , indefinitely just in the hope they dont come.

France think the EU and its citizens are not only a charity but a global one. 'Global giveaway'

Hungry say... " fùck it, we look after our own... WE the citizens of the EU member states created this wealth , these resources, we should be putting it back into the EU... for the citizens who worked to earn it, create it "

I'm with them ^^^

The EU is rapidly becoming the FUMU.... fùcked up mad Union... with no sense of loyalty or self purpose... an absolute derogation of duty and responsibility to the wellbeing, welfare, safety and dignity of its member states and their citizens....

It's doomed , we are doomed...The way things are going.

Close the borders...

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228302#Comment_120228302

The protests are being organised by nutters who want Ireland to leave the EU.

Rational thought wouldn't be on the list.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228377#Comment_120228377

It’s not irrational to look at leaving behind, a relationship that is bullying, negatively impacting your wellbeing and compromising your safety.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228377#Comment_120228377

I remember clearly that one of the main themes in the Brexit referendum was how leaving the union would allow the UK to "control immigration" from the EU. As we can see, the whole thing has descended into chaos, the UK isn't in control of anything and there are huge labour shortages across many sectors.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228404#Comment_120228404

Once they get rid of the window lickers, I can see them reapplying for membership.

They committed economic suicide on the basis of abject lies.

It's no surprise the loons organising these protests are affiliated with the likes of Farage.

That man is just a dangerous parasite.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228414#Comment_120228414

I’m glad you feel like you can speak for every irish citizen, some level of debate :)

‘the rest of us are grand ‘ ? We ain’t,

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228430#Comment_120228430

We are not leaving the EU. Tell HQ they are wasting their time.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228432#Comment_120228432

Not presently, but we are walking into a shîtstorm that is changing the very fabric of society and the ability of this country to maintain fairness, safety and standards and quality of life for is citizens.

“We declare the right of the people of Ireland to the ownership of Ireland and to the unfettered control of Irish destinies, to be sovereign and indefeasible.”

That’s pretty unambiguous….

when we have zero ability to determine the democratic values and direction and destiny of this country… it’s simply undemocratic… democracy isn’t simply the ability to ‘elect’….democracy is governance based on the will of the people.

we need a refugee policy that doesn’t throw our wellbeing out of the water….

the only manner of achieving it… limit it.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228468#Comment_120228468

We really aren't. Again we are NOT leaving the EU.

Hermann does not care about you nor does he care about Ireland.

Run Forest Run

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228468#Comment_120228468

Boggles is correct in a sense.

We would only consider leaving the EU, if it was glaringly obviously that the project was falling apart... we would be one of the last rats to leave the sinking ship, because our leaders are such spineless feckers!

But I could definitely see a few other nations considering their options over the next decade. We'll be paddy last to get the memo! We're not leaders, we're very clearly followers.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228487#Comment_120228487

Nope, that's not why I am correct at all.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228487#Comment_120228487

We are again… ‘not presently’

the project while not falling apart, it’s failing it’s citizens to a dangerous degree…. If there is still a constant stream of people arriving from every war torn, poverty stricken region throughout the world..the EU has no safe working future.

don’t forget, already the Ukranian situation has and is a catalyst for people elsewhere… “ hey, we want in, we want some of that “.. Africa being one region.

DebDynamite

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228132#Comment_120228132

There are asylum seekers in the hotel just out of shot in that pic of the “single, military aged male” type though. Don’t think it was too much of a stretch to suggest more were being bussed in.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228535#Comment_120228535

The story is complete bollíx, but here you are. 😂

Patrick2010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228570#Comment_120228570

You post here a lot with “clever” one liners but can you clarify if you believe in open borders or if we should have any limits on who we take in?

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228653#Comment_120228653

Thank you.

I'll answer with a question. Do you think Ireland should leave the EU?

Hamachi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228302#Comment_120228302

In your head it may seem like a bit of a ‘fallacy’ but there are quite a few developed nations that successfully control migration. Australia, a country in which I’ve lived for a while, does a pretty good job of controlling migration. Japan is also extremely particular about whom they admit, albeit with a indigenous demographic issue that they need to address urgently.

It’s a highly anomalous thought pattern to suggest that because X people ‘decide’ to move to Ireland in any given year, they simply must be admitted. In your head, Ireland has no agency over whom we choose to admit. That’s evidently not the case. Migration can be successfully controlled by a visa system targeting skilled labor, robust border control, and implementing conditions such that this country is an unattractive prospect for spurious asylum claims. This is also pretty elementary stuff..

The Brexit and leaving the EU arguments are a red herring. There are very few posters arguing that position as you’re well aware. Again it’s a tactic to deflect from the discussion at hand, which is how to handle the extraordinary volumes of asylum seekers that this country is currently experiencing.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228678#Comment_120228678

Oz is an island in the middle of nowhere which doesn't have a union with dozens of other countries.

But even still.

In 2018, it was reported more than 60,000 foreigners are living illegally in Australia, and by 2021 it was reported that increased to more than 100,000

The Brexit and leaving the EU arguments are a red herring. There are very few posters arguing that position as you’re well aware.

There is a hell of a lot more than you would think. Some of them try and control it but the mask eventually always slips.

lmao10

Wanting Ireland to leave the EU just shows a complete lack of knowledge in every area.

Hamachi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228712#Comment_120228712

So in 2021, illegal migrants constituted < 0.4% of the Australian population. That’s a pretty successful approach to controlling illegal migration. Thanks for the data.

Boggles, given the blatant dishonesty in which you’ve engaged in this thread, you’ll forgive me if I don’t place much faith in your critique of other posters’ motivations.

Bobtheman

Finally the Irish state decides to get its act together on migrants

However this whole controversy is a spin off from 30 years of trying to create a functional housing market.

I made it clear that I see taking in Ukrainians as absolutely essential to a democratic Europe.

Fuck it - its the right thing to do.

As to the rest a lot are not really refugees and time we had orgainiztion

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228678#Comment_120228678

How would you go about controlling emigration from Ireland.....what laws would you pass? It's the exact same problem in reverse. The anti-immigration lobby think it's as simple as passing new laws, when there are numerous variables involved that are totally outside the remit of any government.

It's virtually impossible to 'control' things like the rate of population growth or how many people are living in the country at any given point.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228570#Comment_120228570

What about the claim of protesters holding Swastika signs, you of all people should not be trying to accuse anyone of spreading misinformation.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229208#Comment_120229208

Again, I claimed no such thing.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228843#Comment_120228843

I wonder do the Irexit loons explain to their supporters that there will be no dole or foreva homes if that were to happen? Of course they don't.

Hamachi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229115#Comment_120229115

It’s absolutely not the same ‘problem’ in reverse and the fact that you’ve drawn that conclusion shows, once again how utterly devoid of logic you are.

There is no need to control emigration from Ireland, nor is there a need to legislate around it. Why?

Because Irish people aren’t initiating spurious asylum claims or destroying their documentation en-route. Instead, they tend to migrate legally, oftentimes bringing sought after skills to their destination country. Indeed, I was once such a migrant for a portion of my life, bringing my STEM skills to Australia and a neighboring EU member state.

The fact that you conflate migration of this nature to asylum seeking demonstrates willful ignorance.

Patrick2010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228666#Comment_120228666

No

Patrick2010

And your answer?

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229359#Comment_120229359

You have your answer.

Open borders is part of the deal.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229277#Comment_120229277

I think you'll find that the 'Ireland is full' guys don't even want migrant workers from the EU, never mind refugees or asylum seekers. Witness all their attacks on the EU and describing Leo Varadkar as "an EU lapdog".

Patrick2010

Fair enough, so you believe anyone who turns from anywhere should be given accommodation

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229400#Comment_120229400

That's ambiguous phrasing and overused (thanks, US Republicans). Ireland certainly still has control over its borders.

Sounds like the EU still needs to invest in better preclearance protocols for EU-domestic flights though.

thomas 123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120227919#Comment_120227919

You said to me only a couple of days ago when presented with statistics from 2021 on migration that that maths were too simple and therefore incorrect(according to you)…

I did not claim my post was of statistical value, it was merely a note to support my opinion that immigration of all sorts clearly has an impact on housing for everyone.

It seems to me you disagree with any examples or data that don’t support your own opinion yet fail to provide examples or data to back up your own thoughts.

thomas 123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229222#Comment_120229222

“Ireexit loons” do not make up a statistical majority of the population who want more control of migration.

Have you any statistics or examples of them boggles or is that something I’ve to Google also?

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228485#Comment_120228485

Always amused by the hypocrysy of Hermann Kelly making a lot of money from his job in Brussels

Patrick2010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229568#Comment_120229568

I work for a company that has workers from India,Russia,China and various Euro countries that all came here on work visas. No problem at all with these, get on well with them all,it’s the chancers turning up from the likes of Albania,Georgia etc I have a problem with,so I’m far right?

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229115#Comment_120229115

Indeed. All these "close the borders" posts dont say what will happen to Irish people who wont be able to emigrate to EU, UK, US.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229580#Comment_120229580

Huh?

In the context of the EU our borders are open, it's part of the deal.

TBH any migrants from the EU in my circle have worked hard for their accommodation and overall lifestyle, most of them being home owners.

Similarly friends and family who have migrated within the EU or the UK or even further a field.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229651#Comment_120229651

Those are as bad as the open borders rhetoric

Open! Closed!

That's just too ambiguous for the seriousness of the discussion and I dread pickets and placards all blasted with that language on it.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229601#Comment_120229601

it was merely a note to support my opinion that immigration of all sorts clearly has an impact on housing for everyone

Well no, your claim was very specific.

Ukrainians asking to rent in an area they have no chance of gaining accommodation in.

You used this as an example of Ukrainians taking houses of Irish.

Which in your example they clearly are not.

Patrick2010

We weren’t discussing the EU as you know, do you believe open borders from outside the EU?,

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229581#Comment_120229581

Of course we do, even within the EU we have more control because we are not in Schengen Area.

Again though we are doing okay, we are the only citizens on the planet that have a right to work and live in both the UK and the EU.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229651#Comment_120229651

That doesn't have any consequence to people who rarely leave their house, let alone village.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229694#Comment_120229694

I was certainly discussing the EU, I know this because I asked you a very specific question which contained the phrase EU.

I think you are trying to say we have open borders from outside the EU.

We clearly don't.

Think about it for 5 minutes.

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229694#Comment_120229694

Close the borders means close the borders as far as Im concerned

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229717#Comment_120229717

Blow up the airlines and skuttle the ships.

I'll email Donald see if he will build us a wall.

thomas 123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229689#Comment_120229689

Lol - so an area that it’s extreamly difficult to rent in will not be impacted by more people trying to rent in it? Is that what your saying? The problem is so bad, so why not?

Is that actually what your saying essentially?

if it’s not please correct me and make your position absolutely clear.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229721#Comment_120229721

He's on to domes now.

I wish that was a joke but he's really, really desperate for free minutes on the news.

Patrick2010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120228653#Comment_120228653

I didn’t mention the Eu,you did

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120229732#Comment_120229732

Your the one who said they had no chance of renting their because of their miniscule budget.

I'll put it to you this way, you go to an auction with the intention of bidding on a item that has a reserve of 10k.

Your max budget is 5k, it sells for 23k.

Did you effect the price?