Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings - updated 11/5/24*

tom23

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121499423#Comment_121499423

Id wish he would stop loving me so... its killing me.

malinheader

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121499884#Comment_121499884

The question again was why won't the Arab countries take Palestinian refugees. It was in reference to maybe Ireland ending up taking some.

By the way I am in no way trying to defend Israels actions.

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121498100#Comment_121498100

Is there any clear indication there will be a large number of Palestinians coming our way?

https://www.infomigrants.net/en/post/52504/will-the-hamas-attacks-trigger-a-new-migration-wave-to-europe

The European Union Agency for Asylum (EUAA) says that there is no cause for panic. The agency told InfoMigrants that historically, Palestinians have only represented a very small share of international protection applicants in the EU+ countries (fewer than 1% each month in 2023).

"It is far too early to speculate on the possible protection needs that might emerge because of the current conflict, also due to the physical realities of Gaza," EUAA head of communication Anis Cassar told InfoMigrants on Wednesday.

jackboy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121499910#Comment_121499910

The reasons Arab countries won’t take them is not really relevant. What is relevant is that our sycophantic virtue signalling politicians would put us at the front of the queue to take them and this would be done with no planning.

duck.duck.go

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121500022#Comment_121500022

The last time we seen Middle Eastern cities flattened to the ground like Gaza is now, was in Syrian where cities were flattened by Russian bombings with result being millions of Syrians being driven into Europe

Theres historical precedent for ya

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121500065#Comment_121500065

Yeah but previous Israeli bouts of 'mowing the lawn' in Gaza have not seen mass exoduses of civilians AFAIK. I'm not aware of significant numbers of Palestinians moving out of the region as yet in response to thye current turmoil and it's going on a while now.

duck.duck.go

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121500101#Comment_121500101

I don’t think any previous Israeli grass moving outings have resulted in anywhere this much destruction

Unless the Arabs step in and rebuild there be nowhere for most of the population to live

NIMAN

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121499708#Comment_121499708

But us taking them in wouldn't be helping Israel?

And I don't see how this country could take in any more refugees, no matter the number. We are simply full, no room. If we have to take in another 10k or 20k, where are they going to live?

duck.duck.go

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121500116#Comment_121500116

Good point

malinheader

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121500116#Comment_121500116

This is not strictly true. I have heard on numerous occasions certain people who welcome everyone how many will be enough or how many more can Ireland realistically give safe shelter too.l stand to be corrected but I have never heard anyone even in government give a number of any sort. So probably never ending.

Mr. teddywinkles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121498487#Comment_121498487

Dont forget throwing us out of our homes to make room too. Ya have room in your bed too dont ya

tom23

Michael Martin said we would take in circa 200k ukrainians…

NIMAN

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121500859#Comment_121500859

Yet the government ran out of all possible accommodation when they got half way to that number.

Gen.Zhukov

Did you know, that of all the Ukrainian's that have moved here from other EU countries (Govt recently admitting it is 1 in 3) could have been legally told to return to the country they first received their temporary protection in, but weren't

What does our lot do - Hello, welcome. Come on in, where did you come from...Belgium?...ah that's grand, just sign here for your €220 + child benefits, + accommodation + med card +,+,+

The figures that have been reported over the last months of new arrivals have varied from between 600 and 800 per week. I'd say it's nearer the the 800 but I'll go with 700 as an avg

That means of the 700 p/m arriving, 233 p/w came from other EU countries (3rd country) and could have been refused temp protection in Ireland - 233 x €220 pw = €51,260 pw

I did an exercise extrapolating that out for just 8 weeks adding €525 pw (75 p/d) for accommodation. The exponential growth rate after 8 weeks was 700% and was at a cost of €6.25m that was unnecessarily spent - This could well have gone on for at least a year which would amount to a huge figure

It's a criminal waste of money by the Govt imo, as they simply did not have to take people from 3rd countries. They're talking about gender quotas in there - any chance they could try for IQ quotas instead, y'know try to get avg above 85

The secondary arrivals situ was discussed on the radio this morning - 11mins in

https://www.rte.ie/radio/radio1/clips/22334560/

aziz

To pay for this whole shambles

you are going to have to get up 3 hours before you go to bed

tikka16751

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121501210#Comment_121501210

The majority of them are gone back to Ukraine for Christmas holidays. I think they are back before the 5th.

tom23

Pretty shocking. Then again letting someone off a plane after they’ve flushed their travel papers and passport down the toilet is also shocking. Would love to know what the end game is here. I could ask the Department of ‘integration’ but they will just quote international obligations.

I’ve said it already, but I pretty much think we are donald ducked.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121501742#Comment_121501742

Well whatever the intention (which with nothing official to counter it, seems to be the dilution of concepts as nationality, sovereignty and independence in favour of an EU superstate where countries are reduced to provinces/counties where citizens have no say at all by design), the result has been to completely overwhelm already struggling and inadequate services while simultaneously discriminating against the natives and inviting anyone with a sad story or ambitions of better prosepects to come try their luck.

With news yesterday that the EU has signed off on commencing Ukranian accession talks, before long the 100,000 currently here will be made legitimate migrants and thus our responsibility for as long as they wish to remain - assuming McEntee doesn't give them all Irish citizenship in the meantime anyway which I wouldn't put past her based on previous performance.

Everyone laughed at the UK but they were right to be suspicious of the long-term outcome of the "project". The EU should never have mutated beyond the EEC trade body it started as. It's never been a grouping of equals, common interests, or shared identity (we saw that particularly during the Financial Crisis when the needs of Germany were put ahead of all others, particularly the 2nd-tier nations including ourselves) and this is the result - although it was obvious really when we were made vote again because we didn't give the "correct" answer to the Lisbon Treaty the first time.

This, plus the polarisation of debate on platforms like Twitter, and the one-sided commentary in most of our media has led us to a situation where those who warned about this were shouted down, marginalised or belittled but here we are in 2023 - a country struggling to provide even basic services to its native citizens and legitimate migrants, with growing discontent and social unrest becoming the norm (dismissed as "far right" in a country that even a cursory look back at our history of the last 2 decades would show is a laughable accusation), and a future where we will face ghettoisation and cultural discord/clashes, reduced supports for even higher taxation than we pay now, and the inevitable and far more serious problems we've seen in the UK, France and elsewhere in Europe.

But then, we've never really done long-term thinking in this country. Whenever we've been "threatened" with making our own decisions we've handed away that responsibility ASAP - first to the Church, then to the EU. To be fair, we're only at this "self-governance" 100 years anyway so it's not surprising that we are still obsessed with nonsense like GAA/county rivalry (which is played upon by the politician to divide and conquer repeatedly), or parochial/immediate self-interest. Far too many can't see beyond their own front gate or immediate family and those who can are denigrated by a begrudgery that is still thriving.

No wonder then we're ripe for being taken advantage of. It's cause and effect really and we've passed the point of no return I fear.

Will_I_Regret

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121501954#Comment_121501954

You need to get in to politics and set up your own party. Before the next election, ideally.

Elmer Blooker

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121502183#Comment_121502183

There will be so many Independents elected to the next Dail they will form quite a powerful bloc so effectively will be a party in all but name.

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121502358#Comment_121502358

There were more than enough 'rural independents' in the current Dail to form the third leg of the current government in place of the Greens (and prevent the passage of some of the environmental legislation that rural Ireland so dislikes) but they did not come together to make a coherent offer to FF and FG so there was no real choice in the formation of the government.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121502183#Comment_121502183

Well I probably couldn't do much worse than this guy..

https://m.independent.ie/business/government-very-uncomfortable-leaving-asylum-arrivals-without-accommodation-says-simon-coveney/a1760629299.html

“It's something that I and the Government are very uncomfortable with, and it motivates us to work harder to try and find solutions for people who are coming here seeking international protection,” he told reporters on Friday.

If only he and they were as concerned about Irish homeless and native citizens as well who are struggling to keep or find somewhere eh? We're only the people whose interests they are actually obligated to support after all.

But then never forget that this is the same man who was crowing about adding an extra million people to the population by 2040 a few years back, and a friend an admirer of the late Peter Sutherland who was all about globalisation and the EU project.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-20465440.html

When you look at the comments from Varadkar, Coveney, Martin and even Phil Hogan at the end of that article, it's no wonder that FG have led us down this path in the last decade. This is all part of the (2040) plan of more people, more integration with Europe - it's summed up nicely by this line in the article actually :

Yet, his critics say, he was the face and defender of big business and integration at the expense of ordinary citizens, taxpayers and nations, a charge he vehemently denied.

Hmm.. I don't know. That seems almost prophetic to me given where we are now and the (FG-led) Government's track record over the last decade. All part of the (2040) Plan as I said above.

Not much in that plan for the rest of us though.

Independents are independent.

They are by no means a cohesive force, urban, rural, left wing, right wing, communists, lunatics, local parish campaigners, varied opportunists to name a few different kinds in there.

Half, maybe! have any interest in actually being in government at all.

Loafing Oaf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121502411#Comment_121502411

But even if a group of them form a pact to support a FF/FG government and don't actually become ministers or anything, that will give them leverage over specific policies if they choose to exercise it

Strazdas

A lot of posters seem to think that all Ireland has to do is elect a right wing government, pass a few new anti-immigration laws and the refugee crisis will be "solved". It won't be - the refugees will keep coming anyway (as the UK and Italy have discovered this year).

The refugee issue is a huge problem facing the West and will continue to be - you can't just make it go away somehow and cease to be a problem by thumping a table and passing new laws.

MagicJohn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121501954#Comment_121501954

Superb post, that's it in a nutshell really.

There is one fly in the ointment so to speak - Orban, he very much shortened the timeline of the war in Ukraine during the week.

The money tap has dried up for the Ukrainians.

My prediction is it ends late next Year with a defeat for them.

And then the fun starts...

We could have a perfect storm of collapsing Corporation tax revenues due to the Pharma sector contracting - Already Pfizer's share price has done a nosedive.

New flood of Ukrainians coming here due to a defeat of the Zelensky regime.

jack of all

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121502737#Comment_121502737

Sure we should all just lie down and die so. We could make a start on some sort of remedy by ensuring our elected government would stop being so wasteful of taxpayers money and make some effort to put Irish citizens first, afterall they are elected to represent us, not some randomer from Algeria/ Georgia/ *insert name of any sh*thole country here*.

fran38

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121501954#Comment_121501954

Long time lurker on this thread. I dont comment because what i read i agree with generally. But i had to stick my head above the parapet & just say that the above post is where we are at & where we are going. Unless the National party of the Irish Freedom party gets their act together & give us a realistic option voting wise , we are goosed.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121502885#Comment_121502885

There are no simple solutions. Thinking all the Dáil has to do is pass an anti-refugee law and the following morning the refugee crisis is over would be a delusion. Refugees would still keep coming here no matter what. By all means tighten up the asylum laws considerably (i.e. with the people from Albania and Georgia you're speaking about) and speed up the whole process but passing laws is not going to make the refugee crisis simply go away.

Luxembourgo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121503152#Comment_121503152

So why haven't steps been taken to speed up the process?

Takes 18 months to process a claim on average, and there has been no investment in more staff or resources to reduce this.