Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings - updated 11/5/24*

ArthurDayne

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093267#Comment_122093267

I am reading this and I am trying to see what the logic is here.

You are bemoaning the concept of refugees (genuine or otherwise) passing through safe countries to reach another country. OK.

So your view is that only the safe neighbouring countries or first safe country of arrival should be hosting refugees. Is that a fair interpretation of your views?

If so — why are you bringing proportionality into the equation? If you think refugees shouldn't be travelling through one safe country to another, then by definition the neighbouring/closest safe countries or countries with the best travel links to the origin state would be disproportionately affected?

And in reality, this is more or less what does happen. In the European context, countries like Poland had to take in a pretty vast number of Ukrainians — while Italy, Greece and other countries bear the brunt of migration from the south and the east. But allowing these countries to bear the disproportionate burden of coping with the issue is proving to actually be counter-productive to effective tackling of illegal migration.

murpho999

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093267#Comment_122093267

I disagree with practically every point you make.

People are travelling here to make a better life for themselves just like the Irish did in the last couple of centuries.

You, despite what you claim, do not know the circumstances they faced to make them leave their home country. It's not always as clear cut as war.

They can't all go to the one country, and countries like France or Germany , despite their large size cannot cope with them all and they already take in a lot.

Following your logic, Ukrainians should really only be in Poland.

An asylum seeker travelling through another country to get to a destination is not wrong and they may have various reasons to choose a different country, such as language, connections already there, opportunities etc.

This does not make them tourists as you claim.

The fact is the vast majority of them just went to improve their lives. They've shown they have get up and go and most will not be the type just expecting to rely on state handouts.

When given the opportunity they will work, and contribute to society.

However, posters like you just refuse to hear or see this. Claimingh they're from the third world , which doesn't exist any more is just ignorance. People claim they're here to sponge off the state or are dangerous unvetted criminals.

As if the whole Irish people are vetted or don't commit crimes.

Last month an innocent Croatian , who is complete entitled to be here was murdered by 2 irish lads but this hardly gets mentioned.

The terrible attack last December in Parnell Square was stopped by an immigrant.

But now we have rough loudmouths, in places like Newtownmountkennedy, draping the Irish flag disrespectfully around them, screaming at Gardai and even screaming out prayers in hateful manner to show their culture. Same people intimidating construction workers going to work. The other day a video was circulating of a violent man, stopping his pick up in the middle of NTMK screaming at foreigners to get the "f" out of his town and now even this morning numb-skulls protesting outside Simon Harris's family home.

That's not the Ireland I want and I don't see how anybody can praise that. This is also not the fault of asylum seekers.

However, posts like seen here and the xenophobic (which is exactly what it is ) comments here and online are feeding into that spiteful group thing and any dissenting voice like mine offering an alternative view gets shot down by insults, or labels or saying you're part of the problem.

This is also symptomatic of the biggest problem facing this country at present which is housing, which the governments,we have elected over the last 40 years have made a complete mess of. If housing was more affordable and accessible for Irish people than it is now then I don't think we'd have the same reaction to asylum seekers that we see at present.

That and health and cost of living is the biggest issues facing us not immigration as the media would have you believe.

I'm actually one who thinks that countries are enriched by immigration and when you look at successful countries you see it built by immigration.

Anyhow, no doubt very few will agree with my points and will continue to scapegoat people who are trying to improve their lot, which is a normal human behaviour, so I'll back out now as there's just no point in continuous back and forth arguing with people who do not want to listen to other viewpoints and lack basic respect and dignity for fellow human beings.

eggy81

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093094#Comment_122093094

It wont make any difference what they do ultimately if you project this issue far enough down the path it’s on now without some form of enactable plan. If 100,000 or do keep arriving, keep having to be paid for and keep getting shoved into developments shoehorned into remote towns and villages all over the country at the expense of tourism and all the other resources it takes to accommodate them then this only leads to one place ultimately. Massive civil unrest.

boetstark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093411#Comment_122093411

But this isn't really about who shouts the loudest or has the biggest social media following.

Surely most rational people can see the knife edge the country is on.

This isn't conspiracy or gaslighting. Health system is broken , housing is well gone beyond broken at this stage. Law and order less said the better. By every metric ireland is not in a good place at present and our political class are beyond useless.

I have over 20 years financial and Economics background and I honestly believe we have dark Economic days ahead. 61% of current GDP is FDI based. That's 4 times EU average. We are up to our necks between Troika bailout and Covid relief monies. A rational and responsible government and electorate would use current tax take to secure all our futures.

But what are the government, cheered on by some of the public and NGO's doing. Inviting more people into a country that is breaking at the seams.

What is so difficult to realise and understand this situation. It's not lies or far right bulls#it , it is where ireland is currently at.

eggy81

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093502#Comment_122093502

Yes. Because if you go around asking Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael voters they were all for the two of them going into government together after the last election. I suppose at least it kept Sinn Fein out.

rgossip30

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093536#Comment_122093536

Any migrant that comes here looking for a better life should be allowed to remain . Migration is the rock on which we stand we need more to solve our problems .

Spanish Eyes

Another Covid type outbreak and lockdown would solve the mass migration issue everywhere. The previous one didn't last long enough.

That is said half joking, whole in earnest BTW.

tobefrank321

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093569#Comment_122093569

There's 8 billion people in the world. Perhaps 2 billiion want to come here. You ok with that?

Do you think unlimited immigration is good? Where will they live? Simple question. Tents in Dublin city centre maybe?

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093519#Comment_122093519

🤣🤣🤣

Two referendum questions one on care one on the status of the family in the constitution. With a voter turnout in the low 40s percentage wise and you are assuming this implies what exactly about immigration?

Who do you think is deluding themselves?

MrMusician18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093524#Comment_122093524

Maybe you have to use broad terms because there are so many. Even the accommodation document produced by dcediy refers to ngos as a collective.

rgossip30

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093479#Comment_122093479

Great post .

Tenzor07

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093389#Comment_122093389

Did you add 2+2 and get 5 there?

Patrick2010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093479#Comment_122093479

For those who say nobody here is suggesting we should have open borders

MrMusician18

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093536#Comment_122093536

It's not the Ireland you want but it's the Ireland we are getting because of complete inaction that has allowed this problem to fester.

And the only reason we see such scenes now is that because when reasonable voices raised legitimate questions, they were shouted down as racists.

The consequences of that is that they are turning now to actual racists because the centre would not listen to them.

TokTik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093147#Comment_122093147

Let’s take the most high profile death in the med. 3yo Alan Kurdi. Family were living happily in Turkey, had an apartment, older siblings were in school, father had a job as a waiter. Father decided it was too expensive to get his teeth fixed in Turkey so decided to get to U.K. to get them done free on the NHS. Was that a desperate situation?? His aunt in Canada spoke of her guilt because she wouldn’t send the money to her brother to get them done in Turkey.

Patrick2010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093569#Comment_122093569

And another one for those who say nobody here is suggesting we should have open borders

tobefrank321

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093479#Comment_122093479

So living in tents in Dublin city centre because we simply cannot accommodate them, makes the world a better place?

Have you even asked yourself what these tent dwellers do when they need to go to the toilet, or eat or anything else? The sanitary conditions are already appalling, and will lead to infectious diseases. You think this is acceptable?

No-one is looking for a wall to be built.

bloopy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093569#Comment_122093569

How many?

tobefrank321

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093625#Comment_122093625

Sad if true. For me that 3 year old's death was symptomatic of a broken system where people risked their lives in unsafe passages, encouraged by people who say "come to Europe, we can accommodate you no problem". Its a broken system which has cost the lives of tens of thousands, particularly women and children. Its a Darwinian struggle where only the fittest, often males, survive.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093618#Comment_122093618

You might answer the question then...

ArthurDayne

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093575#Comment_122093575

The interesting thing there though is that Covid travel restrictions did actually accidentally present the most effective strategy for reducing migration to OECD countries collectively in modern history. Permanent and temporary migration plummeted in those years. In all the time that Europe has debated migration and the coming and going of various right-leaning and left-leaning governments who have all failed to find the solution — the pandemic restrictions were the only thing that actually really smashed migration flows.

I often wonder sometimes, when you look at its effectiveness alongside the views of those who genuinely seem to believe that migration presents the genuine downfall of European civilisation, is the pandemic-style protocol not something they would like to see done again when it proved more effective than anything done before?

Tenzor07

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093652#Comment_122093652

There's existing public order laws there already, don't need a draconian crack down on protests which in a Democracy everyone is entitled to do so…

twinytwo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093479#Comment_122093479

Im not sure if this is a serious post or not?

rgossip30

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093627#Comment_122093627

You dont recognise sarcasm . Sunny Disposition wants an open border .

Ukranian student get better grants than Irish !! https://gript.ie/watch-td-says-ukrainian-students-can-get-free-accommodation-but-irish-dont/

TokTik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093536#Comment_122093536

Tell me you only watch RTÉ without saying you only watch RTÉ.

The Parnell Street attacker was stopped by an Irishman and a French student. The Brazilian guy hit the Algerian on the head with his helmet as the other 2 were holding him down. The knife was gone at this point.

twinytwo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093702#Comment_122093702

While Im all for doing something about the current situation, closing the border is in no way a viable option. It literally cant be done. The British army could not do it back in the day. If people really want to get across it they will. Plus, this would cause a whole host of other problems.

gerogerigegege

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093502#Comment_122093502

No community can say no to this.

Peaceful protests don't work.

Ireland is full.

No more are welcome in my view not even one.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093661#Comment_122093661

Not the question I asked. I never mentioned laws or any response. I think you are dodging since 2+2.

My question is simple: Do you agree with protests outside politician's homes?

Spanish Eyes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093656#Comment_122093656

The effect on the economy (stupid) would override any other factor including a citizen's quality of life. So unless it happens in the event of a Covid like pandemic, I doubt it will be a deliberate act to quell migration in the future.

The restrictions did work though regarding all movement, and unwittingly in the case of mass migration.

prunudo

i see the latest media or government spin is to try to dilute the impact of the issues in Newtown. Seemingly majority of social media was from US and the trouble makers were brought in by taxi.

Well thats interesting, because I can tell you, the community is very angry, particularly with the authorities and Simon Harris with disregard for what is going on. The only outsiders who arrrived to cause trouble were the public order unit.

Also while I don't agree going to protest outside TD's houses, can the politicians stop with the faux outrage, they didn't give a **** about how the public order terrorised the streets of Newtown last week.