Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings - updated 11/5/24*

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122523136#Comment_122523136

So you are the open borders fella that the mob have been looking for?? They will lynch you!

Apologies, I complete misread your intentions. Please keep posting, I want to see this play out. 🙂

Yvonne007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122522875#Comment_122522875

It's actually alarming that I genuinelly have heard people talk along those lines.

Bravo 😁

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122523142#Comment_122523142

How would that equate to large numbers of people being impacted? The existence of tent cities involving homeless asylum seekers along parts of the Grand Canal is clearly wrong and should not be happening, but direct impact on the 1.5m people living in the greater Dublin area would be negligible.

amykl_1987

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122523171#Comment_122523171

There is a significant cost involved in the longer term

Applications have to be processed, presumably they are all also claiming welfare of some kind

Healthcare is also provided. Which impacts on availability of healthcare to those living here

Eventually they end up in hotels etc and that's huge money

sekiro

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122523148#Comment_122523148

First, I may have to decline your request to "keep posting" as I simply do not have the time to spend all day on the internet arguing with strangers. LOL.

Why would they lynch me? It's pretty obvious that bringing in thousands of working age men from all over the world is going to be brilliant for Ireland. Think of all the taxes they are going to be paying!

Look at Dundrum in Tipperary for example. A crummy little village with only 200 people living there. Now the population will soon be more than double that number! Wonderful news for the people there!

Even better when you consider that the new arrivals will be entirely dependent on the state. That's going to be good Irish business people getting all that taxpayer money and becoming richer than they could have ever imagined! Brilliant stuff.

Sleepy little Dundrum is going to be a lot livelier for sure, and that's a good thing! The local ladies will be especially pleased as there can't be many options in a place that small. Over 200 eligible bachelors right on your doorstep. Fantastic stuff.

ArthurDayne

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122522875#Comment_122522875

Ah, very good. Irony, humour, sarcasm — full marks on each count there. It is unfortunate however that logic, sense and actual relevance to anything I have said is missing.

Just another post, like many on here, where it doesn't really matter what anyone says — just always bring the conversation back to faux victimhood of being called a racist and assert that anyone who doesn't align completely with the roulette of constant complaint and alarmism on here can only invariably be someone who thinks that there is absolutely nothing to worry about.

You ask me "what are you on about" when in your last post — and again in this post — you make references to me calling people racists, which is nonsense. You also make references to me saying "there is nothing to worry about and everything is going to be OK" despite me never having said this or alluded to it.

And for reasons that I am clearly not intelligent enough to understand, people seem to rush in to give your post thanks — despite it being a complete tangent which doesn't in any way actually address anything I said or accurately identify any stance I take.

Geuze

Here is data on AS applications during May 2024.

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/web/products-eurostat-news/w/ddn-20240820-1

We received the most, even though we are on the far west edge of the EU.

Geuze

Here is data on UKR refugees, June 2024:

https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/en/web/products-eurostat-news/w/ddn-20240809-1

On 25 June 2024, the European Council agreed to extend the temporary protection for these people from 4 March 2025 to 4 March 2026.

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122523023#Comment_122523023

Do you find many unfavorable situations you can't blame on some ethnic group or another, without reading the stats?

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122523015#Comment_122523015

So when Irish people are involved you want to get into the details behind the headline figures.

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122523821#Comment_122523821

I had thought Ireland had the highest ratio of people seeking refuge from Ukraine.

According to those stats we're not in the top three. And it's predominantly women and children seeking refuge.

I'm still waiting for somebody to tell me how many IPAs are living in Ireland. I'd have thought that something you guys would have a solid idea of, considering how many of the countries woes you blame them for.

Yvonne007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122524006#Comment_122524006

No thank you.

But I do feel I have to point out that you are being misleading when you present a report (that is 30 years old) which you pretended to show that the irish are responsible to most violent crimes per capita, when it shows nothing like that at all.

It shows that out of 12,105 Irish people (in 1993, in Melbourne), 123 of them were processed for violent crimes over the space of a year.

YOU brought this stat up, you presented it for some unkown reason in your response to your hand waving away of people from different cultures being over represented in sexual crimes.

I only gave your irrelevant report more than a cursory glance when you started mentioning it to try and blatently misrepresent what it said.

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122524041#Comment_122524041

The problem is we don't know.

We know how many AS have applied, yes.

But if their claim fails, we don't know where they go.

The Minister admitted that we don't know.

Also, we don't have exit controls at ports, that's another issue.

Geuze

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122524041#Comment_122524041

We do have a huge number of UKR refugees, given our location.

We have more than Hungary, even though it borders UKR.

We have way, way more than France, on a % basis.

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122524114#Comment_122524114

I don't remember 'pretending' to show that Irish people committed more crimes per capita, but didn't you do a lot of carefully looking at the details there.

Did you pay similar attention to the reports of crimes committed by Iraqi men that you accuse me of 'hand waving' over?

Yvonne007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122524193#Comment_122524193

Your handwaving was evident for all to see. You admitted that men from a different culture would be over represented in sexual harrassment. I believe that also to be true with regards to sexual assault but in the absence of concrete proof, I was willing to "downgrade" the charges to sexual harrassment.

For some reason, that resulted in you posting report where you purposely misrepresented to show Irish people are overwhelmingly violent in comparison to others, in a city in Australia, thirty years ago.

If that isn't handwaving and deflection, I don't know what is.

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122524216#Comment_122524216

I do think it likely than men from some cultures would be over-represented in verbal harassment. That's not for a minute to say I find it acceptable when people engage in it. In fact, I think we need to look at our harassment laws for a number of reasons. I was quite shocked to find out that certain verbal sexual harassments are quite legal in Ireland, alongside other intimidating or threatening behaviors.

I posted a report from 30 years ago, referencing Irish people, simply to show how misleading such reports could be.

I'm going to assume at this point that you didn't look much into the reports around Iraqi men, or crimes committed by people from other nationalities in Finland. I had a bit of a look myself out of curiosity and I'm even more confident now that the numbers presented aren't really anything to be concerned about.

For a start it looks to be as though the stats given represent the number of suspects for solved crimes. I noticed that there are more suspects than crimes, and I couldn't find anything in their definitions to assure me that multiple suspects could be recorded where only one had actually committed the crime, which I think could lead to an overrepresentation of foreign men in general.

Then looking at the data provided, I noticed that the numbers of suspects for each nationality outside of Finnish people per crime category were generally quite small. I saw some anomalies in the data, which was presented in the report for the years 2017 and 2018 but available for the years 2009 to 2020. It seemed as though the data peaked significantly for some non-national groups in certain years. Whether this was down to individuals committing large amounts of crimes in certain years, or certain crimes generating a large number of suspects, I couldn't tell. I am confident though that it is simply not reliable to compare a much smaller group to a larger one using the methods they have, especially where the reports are only made available for a shorter time period.

Yvonne007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122524286#Comment_122524286

The fact is you did not post a report from 30 years ago "simply to show how misleading such reports could be".

You misread the data. You thought you were making a point that you weren't. Much like how you got other figures wrong earlier in the thread

To be honest, you've blatently misrepresented facts on this thread more than once so I will take everything with a pinch of salt until I look into it myself.

Anyway, my point is, we should get our own house in order, with proper and fair benefits and amenities for our citizens, while having a safe, robust and sturdy immigration policy and not be entertaining any ideas of allowing people who harrass or endanger our citizens remain in our country. We have enough of our own degenerates, lets not allow more in.

Easier said than done, I know, but better than a "lets help everyone" approach which doesn't make our lives better. There doesn't seem to be anything we can do about it though.

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122524335#Comment_122524335

I don't know why else you think I might have shared that report but that's the reason.

I haven't misrepresented any facts on this thread. I made a small error in describing IPA arrival rates from twenty years ago but immediately acknowledged same. I've been careful to provide tons of references in my posts and have even been criticized for being pedantic in this regard.

Speaking of blatant misrepresentations can you tell me why you think it's ok to refer to people seeking asylum as 'degenerates'? You mention letting people who harass or endanger our citizen remain in this country, who does this refer to? It sounds to me like you might be talking about some kind of zero immigration policy.

star61

I

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122521853#Comment_122521853

I wonder that if it bears no real resemblance to what you actually said that you feel it was directed at you. There are so many posts from so many people.

There does indeed appear to be an attempt to portray The Irish in a very poor light. Why that is I do not understand.

I would hope they wouldn’t feel victimised, as I would hope would any nationality that are fortunate enough to live here.

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122524375#Comment_122524375

I don't see any attempt to portray Irish people in a negative light.

Personally I see Irish people much the same in that sense as anyone else. Some good, some bad, everyone else just trying to get along and live their lives.

Yvonne007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122524357#Comment_122524357

You completely misrepresented the data on the report YOU supplied in posts #29681 and #29700 where you said that, although you didn't necessarily believe it, the data said that the Irish were the most violent.

"Yes, statistics from the period in question tell us Irish people were the most violent in Australia"

The data doesn't show that at all.

That was either a lie, or another "mistake".

And to futher my point, you have asked me why it's ok to refer to people seeking asylum as "degenerates".

Now lets look at what I actually said:

"Anyway, my point is, we should get our own house in order, with proper and fair benefits and amenities for our citizens, while having a safe, robust and sturdy immigration policy and not be entertaining any ideas of allowing people who harrass or endanger our citizens remain in our country. We have enough of our own degenerates, lets not allow more in."

Now where did I call asylum seekers degenerates?

I clearly was referring to people who come here illegally, legally or those seeking asylum who have broken the law.

Another "mistake".

Real Donald Trump

<Mod Snip> Do not discuss a case that is currently before the courts

Ozvaldo

Ah sure bring them all in and it's a gold star for Paddy.Its actually embarrassing our government hate us and prefer refugees

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122524414#Comment_122524414

When you look at the details of the report I shared and consider the factors involved it certainly does not seem correct to say Irish people are more violent. Likewise when you look at the details of the reports on criminality by nationality in Finland and consider the factors involved it does not seem correct to say any particular nationality is more violent, or otherwise criminally inclined.

It's still not clear who you're referring to with your claims about 'degenerates'.

What exactly are you looking for here? As I understand it there are likely plenty of people who have broken the law, or might 'endanger our citizens', who come here either as IPAs, tourists or to work.

Yvonne007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122524454#Comment_122524454

It's absolutely clear but I will clarify it even further.

Any person, living in Ireland, who is not Irish, should deported to the country from which they arrived from, if they commit a crime. If they arrive in the country after destroying their documents, they should be put on the next return flight to wherever they came from.

The degenerates I speak of are people who break our laws.

Degenerate:

having lost the physical, mental, or moral qualities considered normal and desirable

Is that clear?

And with regards to your Finland report, I haven't looked at it. I took you at face value when you agreed that you would expect to see a certain demographic overrepresented. Was that another mistake you made?

moby2101

Mod Snip - Before the courts

MegamanBoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122524476#Comment_122524476

I said I expected to see more than one demographic overrepresented in certain crimes.

I also made the point that I likely broke laws in other countries due to my circumstances there. Am I too a degenerate now?

Would you also consider Irish people who have broken immigration laws elsewhere and lived undocumented 'degenerates'?

You must be disgusted that successive governments have advocated on behalf of these people!

I take you're point about deporting people who commit crimes, but I also don't know why you're posting about it in this thread if it applies in general.

whatever.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122521780#Comment_122521780

Trying to defelect and be vexatious won't work when your own citation states.

They face the risk of rape and other violence at the hands of family members, other refugees"

In your third paragraph you try to denigrate Irish in Australia in complete contradiction to your second paragraph.

Thus you are either engaged in a persistent and "disgusting attempt to generalise" Irish people or you will have to admit that refugees come from groups engaged in violence and rape as cited by you and the UN

sonofenoch

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122523171#Comment_122523171

In your own words what's happening along the canal is wrong but if you're not directly impacted so what!

How many are directly impacted by what's going on in Gaza …doesn't stop them protesting and marching