Good news for motorists as fuel tax cuts to be extended despite Green resistance

mikeecho

Good news for motorists as fuel tax cuts to be extended despite Green resistance

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/good-news-for-motorists-as-fuel-tax-cuts-to-be-extended-despite-green-resistance-42327474.html

mikeecho

Must be some record.. 74k+ replies in under 1 minute

walshtipp

He's just ratty that it costs the same to drive his electric car as it does a diesel car.

893bet

Keep the fuel of the van that follows his bike around down at least.

teediddlyeye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207060#Comment_120207060

No it fcuking doesn't. Where are people getting this from?

A 55mpg diesel at 1.70 a litre is 6/7 times the price per km then an EV on current night rate prices.

I always thought the average person wasn't great at maths but fcuk me when someone asks what the running cost are and you can see the cogs seize up inside upon explaining.

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207060#Comment_120207060

I guess maths was never your forte ;-)

My EV is charged from the sun for free for about half of the year. For the other half, I pay 7.9c / kWh incl. VAT. I have a gas guzzler, a huge and fast Tesla Model S. Which consumes about 20kWh / 100km. So here is the plain and simple maths for a car doing 18k km per year (the Irish average):

9k km free, the other 9k km, using 1800kWh, times €0.079 = €142

A diesel car doing 60MPG (yeah, right) over 18k km with a diesel price of just €1.40 (yeah, right) is using 847 liters, which would cost €1186

A diesel car costs many, many times more than an electric car...

And that's just fueling costs. An electric car is cheaper on every other aspect of cost too. Depreciation, tax, insurance, maintenance, tolls, the lot.

GSBellew

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207088#Comment_120207088

@55 Mpg = 4.276 Ltrs per 100 km so 100 Km costs € 7.27 in this 55 Mpg diesel

Based on info from https://www.myenergi.com/ie/guides/how-to-charge-the-volkswagen-id-3/

According to the above an ID3 will do 450 km for € 19 to € 24 for a full charge which equates to € 4.22 to € 5.33 per 100km

If the diesel were 6 to 7 times more expensive that would require a charging cost of € 1.038 to € 1.211 per 100km or € 4.67 to € 5.45 for a full charge.

So how much does it cost to charge an ev from empty? quite curious actually.

I've no doubt the fuel costs are lower, but I'll bet my left testicle that my 09 diesel costs me less per km driven over any given month than it would if I were to buy a new EV and add in the monthly payments for it and so on, not to mention that at 14 years old the range is still what it was when new, I can fill up wherever, whenever without wondering what the cheapest time to do so is, a full tank is mere minutes & I'm on my way for another 1,200km.

I will stick with my range of petrol and diesel cars for as long as I can, but remain open to being convinced otherwise.

teediddlyeye

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207116#Comment_120207116

Those charging costs are way off what most would pay for charging, must be peak times.

Here's my running costs for most of 2022. On bord gais current ev rate. Plan on adding solar this year so less again hopefully.

Picked it up on 8/1/22 and now just about to hit 50k km. Traded an 06 diesel passat and yes the monthly costs including payments has been less.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207060#Comment_120207060

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207097#Comment_120207097

Facts were never his forte. Ryan’s family vehicle is a diesel minivan afaik.

Just btw, I’m a motorist and this isn’t good news for me. Some motorists can see the big picture.

mikeecho

Why does every fuel thread descend into EVs are great, and we should all drive out ice off a cliff and buy a new EV.

colm_mcm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207161#Comment_120207161

I thought he changed the Caravelle for an EV in 2020.

colm_mcm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207196#Comment_120207196

read back the thread and see where the misinformation kicked off, followed by corrections.

walshtipp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207088#Comment_120207088

Now redo that maths using the public charging network prices.

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207420#Comment_120207420

Nobody charges their car on the public charging network unless they're away from home.

And very few people own a car if they don't have somewhere to park it

HBC08

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207097#Comment_120207097

Yep,every aspect of cost........except you know the whole buying it in the first place bit.

McCrack

It's far from less

Your 06 diesel passat has bottomed out in depreciation.

You have likely saved 2.5k a year in fuel driving an electric over your passat driving about 45k km a year

If you hold onto your electric for the next 4 years you will have saved about 12.5k in fuel over your 06 passat

However in 4 years your electric will be 5 years old and will have lost 30/40k depreciation versus zero depreciation on the passat

Also you can add interest on a loan/pcp if that's how you purchased or part financed

So buying a new electric is false economy or at least trying to justify it by saying its cheaper to run is false economy and they are fairly bland looking too

User1998

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207097#Comment_120207097

Agree with most of what your saying, but how much did the solar panels cost that provide you with ‘free’ charging?

You assume all EV drivers get half their years charging for free and will never have to use the public charging network?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058283098/good-news-for-motorists-as-fuel-tax-cuts-to-be-extended-despite-green-resistance

Green Party leader Eamon Ryan has strongly indicated he does not believe the cuts to duty on petrol and diesel should be extended beyond February.

However, there is increasing pressure within the backbench ranks of Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael to keep in place the excise reductions.

The excise duty cuts reduce the cost of a litre of petrol by 21c and diesel by 16c. The cuts were introduced last year and extended until the end of this month in the Budget.

There are also concerns over the impact carbon tax increases will have on the cost of driving when they come into effect in May.

Eamon Ryan needs to cop on and realise that not everyone is earning €190k+ a year like he is and there are people struggling to heat their homes adequately and put food on the table, right now.

Let alone invest €40k on an EV, ffs.

🤬

walshtipp

https://youtu.be/SzZYRFZUbn0

In the above video from the UK you will see that driving an EV costs more that driving a petrol car using public infrastructure.

I drive across the UK/continent nearly every year with a diesel car. So no incentive to change. I would need to stop more often, for longer, and spend more money.

Yes the average person just going to work each day can charge at home on night rate to save money. But on a like for like comparison filling with petrol/diesel is the same price or cheaper than charging an EV on the road.

Also many people, myself included do not have somewhere at home to charge an EV.

LIGHTNING

Lets keep on topic here folks.

elperello

As the Indo article says the main pressure is coming from rural TDs.

Understandable due to the fact that so many of their constituents rely on their cars.

creedp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207446#Comment_120207446

So that must mean that anyone that can't charge at home or sply can't afford a new car has no choice but to continue driving ICEs for a while yet and for those people this is good news

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207730#Comment_120207730

When Tesla pays you to take the car off their hands and your solar panels have paid for themselves an hour before you have even put them on your roof, you're in whole other class of cost savings mere mortals can only dream of.

McGrath5

No surprise that this motorist subsidy would continue, it would be deeply unpopular if it was to be rolled back and why has it raised the backs of the EV bourgeois?

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120208189#Comment_120208189

Regardless of the reduction in Duty, it's still cheaper to run an EV than an ICE for the vast majority of motorists. It is in the long term interest of less well off motorists that the national fleet moves from ICE and Hybrid to BEV.

There will never be affordable used BEVs if nobody buys them new

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120208247#Comment_120208247

But not all.

I went through the pros and cons in detail with some good folk on one of the EV threads not so long ago and got some great advice, but it was agreed that for my circumstances, there would be no real savings to my switching to an EV, even if I could get a decent second hand one for under €25k. (Currently driving Nissan Micra 1.1 approx 6/8k miles per year).

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120207980#Comment_120207980

You are supposed to emigrate so as to raise the average income so a greater proportion of the population remaining can all get EV's so Ireland can look good on the world stage. Isn't it comforting to know that the state just had the largest budget surplus in the EU, at €5.2 billion for 2022.

https://www.independent.ie/business/budget/ireland-had-eus-biggest-budget-surplus-at-the-end-of-2022-42307477.html

This lack of adequate revenue is why the government created a body - the commission on taxation and welfare - comprised of extremely well paid leaches who could then recommend tax increases to the government so they could then say, look, it wasn't us, it was that Irish LSE left wing professor who lives in the Uk and who won't have to pay the taxes being recommended. We pay their salaries and expenses, but their opinions are entirely independent of any government influence.

Taxation Commission recommends huge increase in wealth taxes

It might be the potential whiff from having a country of only 5 million being taxed so much this tiny country has the largest budget surplus in the EU, whicle at the same time arguing for higher wealth taxes because the level of taxation is too low, that has inspired the politicos to let the fuel excise situation remain as it is for a little longer.

LIGHTNING

And nobody listened. Locking thread.