Irish Road Racing 2023

Chips Lovell

Have you established that riders who cleaned up last year have entered again this year (on the basis that they are still second or third cats in their home federation) or are you just worried that this may happen?

On a more general note, if I didn't enter every race I didn't have a hope of placing in, I'd have done feck all races.

If you really want/need an upgrade, you can always upgrade yourself in January anyway.

CramCycle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121012829#Comment_121012829

A3s are far better going to C2D, particularly the stronger ones, they'll gain nothing from beating me to the line around Green Sheds.

dahat

Entries not published yet to confirm my thoughts but while using Foran as an example the point remains the same re assigning pts from CI races.

The main issue here is clouded eligibility on previous results attained if applicable tjst would mean an Irish rider cannot enter but an international one can.

dahat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121012946#Comment_121012946

👀👀👀- I see what you are doing here.

Morris Garren

'Reap what you sow' lads. Charleyville used to be a great end of season race for the non-A1 riders a few years ago. Then the popularity seemed to drop. There was chaos one year with races being sent the wrong directions, then a colossal finish line pile up that was all over the Internet, entry was still 'cheque or postal order in an envelope' I think, up to a few years ago, and now it's getting vastly reduced entries. Wasn't aware of the issues with 'foreign' riders-- yet, I don't know a single rider who is entered the last couple of seasons. These things either evolve or die.

Chips Lovell

I'm always saying, focus on actual problems rather than hypothetical ones. I think you need to establish that a.) this is happening and b.) happening on such a scale that the cost of intervention is warranted.

Chips Lovell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121012946#Comment_121012946

I think you'll need to improve your finishing technique compared to the last time I saw you racing that circuit. Either that or bring a pair of runners. See you on Saturday.

CramCycle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121013081#Comment_121013081

Dropped chain and a flat tyre in the last few km and still only finished a minute down. I think I was all style but no result.

joey100

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121012939#Comment_121012939

On a more general note, Most races are A1/A2 combined, very few A2 only races and every weekend we have a2's travelling to races, knowing they don't have much chance against the top lads like feeley, mcdunphy and others who are pretty much semi pro, but still we travel to race and see what happens. This was one of few races where you had a chance to go up against other a2's, without having a1's impact the race. This doesn't happen since Foran have entered, they are well above A2 standard, I raced them last year, they were head and shoulders above most in the race and decided the race on stage 1 and 3. Other club mates have raced them 2 years ago and haven't done the race since, they aren't travelling down and paying for accommodation and race entries, again, when they have no chance.

Chips Lovell

The Peter Principle applies in cycling as much as anywhere else. Sooner or later you get promoted to the point of mediocrity. So eventually we all get to the point where we're up against the genuine talents, the Feeleys and the McDunphys. Last time I did Charleville (which was a good while ago now) we all got annihilated by Eddie Dunbar. Was I complaining? No. I'd much rather be going up against the best rather than looking for an easy result. It's meant to be hard. That's what makes it so rewarding when you do scratch out a few results.

joey100

And that I find is the problem with cycling. If you have any opinion that's against what has happened up to now your seen as looking for an 'easy win', or having a go, rather than it been taken as constructive. Race numbers are dropping at every single race around the country but when people try to give feedback as to why this is is the type of response you get. No where did I say I wanted an 'easy win'. I just want to compete in a fair race against other lads my ability. I turn up to A1 combined races and do my best to get around and enjoy it, enjoy seeing where I stack up, going out with no expectations other than to enjoy it.

But sometimes it would be nice to race against other a2's.

And why should I, an A2, be up against the real talents who are a1's? The categories are meant to be there so you race lads your own ability, From what I can see the only reason there is combined A1/A2 races is so that the a1's get to race, cos without the a2's the field would be too small.

dahat

Yes but Eddie Dunbar was qualified to race that day I’m sure.

The point is if an international rider gathers 20pts here as an A2 he will not be upgraded so can continue to race as an A2 same year & year after etc. The Irish rider however must upgrade to A1 on 20pts.

No one here is complaining about being upgraded we just want to race against correctly graded A2/A3 in Charleville.

Morris Garren

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121013576#Comment_121013576

Yes, this makes sense. I rode Charleville the year Dunbar annihilated everyone but I was bringing up the rear on the climbs anyway, so he didn't put me off entering. He was a young up and coming star. Glad to try do my own race as best I could. The appeal of getting arse handed to you wanes over time though, and especially if events don't have the same appeal year on year, alternative goals are going to arise.

eeeee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121013138#Comment_121013138

Is this barefoot or are you en cleat?! I don't know if I'd sacrifice my socks or cleats 😂

Either way ouch and lol🤣🤣

Plastik

I don't for a minute believe the majority of people are after an easy result in any race they do, though some probably are.

But we are all paying to race, not being paid. We are all paying for accommodation. We are all paying our own travel costs. We are all paying our own nutrition costs. We are all paying our own time away from family costs. We are all paying our own replacement equipment costs. We are all paying our own costs when we come down. It's a hobby. It's a pastime. It's a way to keep fit and healthy and it's a way to feel like you're in some small way racing like you see your favourites do on TV. And so the genesis of that is that there has to be an element of fun. Either getting the result, or believing you are in the chase for a result is that hunt. And if neither are possible, then why would you bother. That is/was a prime driving factor for a lot of why the numbers racing have fallen, I believe - me being one of them.

Go race against A1's every week and test yourself? Suck it up week in week out and don't be a wimp? The whole point of grading systems is meant to address that, but it doesn't here, and CI have only made mealy mouth attempts to address it in the last 15 years. I can't get out of A2 racing A2 races, ok, that's your Peter Principle in action there. That's my level. The better guys get the results, but then they leave. That is the key here. But at that level of middle age mediocrity I still believe that you could be happy with chasing a result.

I can't get out of A2 because same guys that have already proven themselves to be better athletes than me turn up every week to prove they're better athletes than me though they have their own category that is never enforced? Not Peter Principle imo.

I won't mention any names of current A1's mopping up points here, but they're all essentially bangers in my eyes. Some have tried or are still trying the next level up, their level, but keep coming back to the level below and taking prize pots. Nice little handy earner for them sure. No one I know thinks much of them for doing it.

And Dunbar was a Junior when he tore the C2D up, not a moonlighting A1.

Chips Lovell

They've been combining A1/A2 for most races because of the numbers for 10+ years. Cycling Ireland should just call a spade a spade and merge the two categories. Other than a small few races the A1s can't enter, there is no real difference between the categories.

joey100

There is a difference between the categories though, that's what people have been saying and why it would be nice that the A2 only races are kept that way. Just because something has been done for 10 years doesn't make it right or mean people should just accept it. Sure the women used to race with A3/A4 races but that changed because people realised they needed their own race and it is better that their race isn't impacted by other riders not in their category.

Chips Lovell

There's no difference in the sense that most weeks, they're all doing the same races. The difference in ability lies between a minority of gifted A1s and everyone else in A1/A2. But that's cycling. It's the same at every level from the World Tour right down to the IVCA league. A small handful riders tend to win most things.

CramCycle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121014172#Comment_121014172

On SPDs as my race bike was still under repair after I broke a lever, quite fittingly this is my CX bike with road tyres.

eeeee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121015142#Comment_121015142

Suspiciously like it was meant to be 🤔😅

CramCycle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121015844#Comment_121015844

It is all part of a cleverly orchestrated promo for "The Bear Group Series" pre season cyclocross league starting on the 7th September in Dublin. Transitioning from road racing to CX in an unorthodox fashion.

Paddigol

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121017345#Comment_121017345

Soooooooo... what you're saying is... Cross is Coming!(?)

CramCycle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121017469#Comment_121017469

It's already here, think McCrystals are all ready in full swing on Tuesdays, the Bear Series league is running for 4 Thursday nights in September for the preseason league. National Series and the K Capital league are starting mid September and then the Leinster League is starting 1st weekend in October. Cross is already here my friend.

beggars_bush

Cannot understand the reluctance to run road events into late September. It's often the best period for dry sunny weather

dahat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121017870#Comment_121017870

All about numbers racing. Historically poor sign ups this time of year has made promoters reluctant to commit to rqces I’d imagine.

dahat

Lucan GP advertised as a handicap for A1/2/3.

CramCycle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121018764#Comment_121018764

I see they changed it. Eugh, hopefully they have a half decent handicap but travelling 180km to get caught on the first half a lap is not enticing

dahat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121019570#Comment_121019570

Better off at Charleville 😂.

Yeah agreed on the handicaps - some have been terrible this year.

Sliabh Lucra gave the A2 lads 2 mins over A1 riders with 1000m to be climbed. That’s all part of the bigger problem though.

daragh_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121017870#Comment_121017870

When we ran the Laragh Classic the first few times that was the idea and we never had a problem with numbers. And we really only had bad weather once (2015). IVCA Races run all the way up October 1st.

wav1

Promoters (myself included) won't run in September..along with all the usual stuff involved guaranteed to run at a loss to the promoting club.

Very true re the weather being mostly nice and pleasant etc but very few riders about.

Lads would rather get hammered in 2 degrees first couple of weekends in March..always has been that way and probably always will