What would they have done with the Twin Towers if they hadn't collapsed completely?

rossie1977

Chief architect suggested the Natwest tower be demolished after the IRA bomb in 93 and Natwest was nowhere near as damaged at WTC

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/art/news/architecture-update-reprieve-for-the-natwest-tower-1486176.html

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451834#Comment_120451834

Who said a couple of thousand???????? In reality they might have ended up saving 10. Or maybe they could have got 30… who knows. But it would be worth it?

Why didn’t anyone think of it? Well maybe someone did, and maybe someone like you mocked the idea and stopped it going ahead.

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451709#Comment_120451709

This wasn't a movie, you know.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120452963#Comment_120452963

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/poor-info-hindered-9-11-rescue/

Couldnt land on the roof due to antaena ...

And how could the hook a belt around terrified people hanging out of windows.. It would be nigh on impossible.

"Why didn’t anyone think of it? Well maybe someone did"

I would imagine it was suggested, and immediately discounted......

mojesius

One of the police helicopter pilots was filmed on a documentary (Nat Geo 6-part "9/11 - One day in America" . They said the South tower was completely engulfed, so landing on the roof was out of the question. They said there was a clear patch on the north tower roof where they could have landed, but there was no one there to rescue, they got so close, they could see pebbles on the roof but no people there :(

https://youtu.be/rspC_2ujO24

(53:25 for next 3 or so mins.

Warning that it contains upsetting accounts/scenes).

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120453747#Comment_120453747

"age restricted "... blah blah blah ...... 🙄

mojesius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120453756#Comment_120453756

Why the roll eyes?

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120453763#Comment_120453763

because Youtube have deemed it for adult viewing.... 🙄 so you need to sign in etc ...

Jequ0n

I wonder why nobody thought about giving the towers a really stern “don’t **** with me” look. Surely they would have thought twice about collapsing then.

mojesius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120453777#Comment_120453777

Yeah, there's a lot more 'raw' footage and accounts than typical 9/11 TV documentaries so has the age restriction applied.

Coming back to the discussion regarding parachutes etc., From reading some survivors' and witnesses' accounts online, many of those who worked in skyscrapers afterwards invested in parachutes and stored under their desks. I'd imagine you'd need some significant training to be able to confidently use them in an emergency situation with fire roaring around you

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120453715#Comment_120453715

Hanging out of windows?? You’re not going to sneak that one past me. They weren’t literally hanging out. If it were me, I could hold my breath for a few secs while I’d step back from the window to tie the rope onto me. The only issue would be that someone might jump before instructed to do so. I suppose the next thing you’ll say is that they wouldn’t be able to throw the rope from the chopper without it getting blown back by the wind!

The north took about an hour an 45 minutes to fall. I do wonder how long after impact the last jumper was.

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455186#Comment_120455186

You honestly think it's just a matter of throwing a rope a hundred floors up, with turbulence and the rush of air created by the fire itself?

cj maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451732#Comment_120451732

No St Patricks Day. Documentaries are normally shown after the event 😷

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455275#Comment_120455275

If it were just a matter of throwing a rope then they’d probably have been able to save about 40 lives. I wouldn’t expect it to work that well though. In reality they’d probably have to throw it two or three times for someone to catch it. You’d of course want a light weight tied to the end of the rope before throwing it. In any case, they’d definitely have saved a few lives.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455659#Comment_120455659

Do you play GTA a lot ?? 🙄

I really want to get into the pros/cons of how ridiculous this suggestion about dangling ropes towards windows with weights on them while theres a raging fire beneath , whilst trying to navigate in between/around skyscrapers, with the heat of said fire blasting upwards towards the helicopter creating an updraft with 100's (?) of workers trying to get out in panic .....

But i wont ...................

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120463900#Comment_120463900

Navigating between skyscrapers???! It’s not like they’re 20 feet apart!!!! Nice try though. But the pilot would do the navigating before - not ‘while’ - the rope would be being thrown. There’s 4 sides to the building; it’s a matter of going to the one where there’s least smoke. A bit of smoke isn’t necessarily that dangerous… many people passed right through the impact zone in the south tower and survived. That's a fact.

greenspurs

Im not being serious......

I hope youre not either ..............................

NattyO

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058286124/what-would-they-have-done-with-the-twin-towers-if-they-hadnt-collapsed-completely

I doubt they'd have ever gotten any engineer or architect to sign off on the structural integrity of the building after the damage it sustained in the initial hit, not to mention the fire damage afterwards.

The only solution would have been controlled demolition and rebuild.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120465403#Comment_120465403

"controlled demolition"

Some argue that that happened on the day .....................

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120465354#Comment_120465354

I'm lost here.

Have you ever seen the twin towers? They were pretty big. Not to mention the surrounding buildings. It's downtown NYC!

A couple of helicopters to rescue people was never on the agenda. The thought of it being an idea on even a normal day is ridiculous!

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455186#Comment_120455186

Do you really think a helicopter can hover so still that it would allow you time to catch a rope, figure out where the end is, work out how to tie it through your belt loops (are your loops even big enough to fit a rope through?) hold your breath for a few seconds, and then jump out a window?

What happens next? Do you climb up the rope like Indiana Jones? Do they drop you onto another building's roof like in The Matrix?

Seriously, life is not like action films. There is no way anything even close to what you are suggesting would have worked.

Helicopters move around when they are hovering still. One tiny movement from the helicopter and the rope you are delicately trying to tie around your waist would jerk out of your hands at best and at worst, pull you out the window when you're not ready. And that's even if they could somehow get it to you in through a window (they couldn't)

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120465531#Comment_120465531

So the moral to your post that employee's require bull whips on induction day? I'm on board!

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120465396#Comment_120465396

You're entitled to turn the sarcasm back on at any time you want. You ask if I play too much GTA? Well lets think of it this way; if I had a hypothetical thought 25 years ago and suggested to you that it would be possible for a team of just 10 hijackers to make the entire world trade centre disappear inside of two hours without any bombs or guns, you'd have made a similar remark towards me. And you'd have been wrong!

Brid Hegarty

@o1s1n Do you really think a helicopter can hover so still that it would allow you time to catch a rope

Well yeah I do, here's a guy at 5:44 deliberately making sudden movements with the joystick and it would still be fine for all of that to be happening while someone would be tying up the rope... assuming the rope was long enough.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bml3jLAiTgs&ab_channel=HelicopterOnlineGroundSchool

@o1s1n are your loops even big enough to fit a rope through?)

Now you're just being difficult. I dare you to report back to me after finding any piece of rope in your garage and trying it.

@o1s1n Helicopters move around when they are hovering still. One tiny movement from the helicopter and the rope you are delicately trying to tie around your waist would jerk out of your hands...

Only if the rope you brought wasn't long enough. It goes without saying that any person with a reasonable amount of intelligence would anticipate this issue.

@o1s1n ...pull you out the window when you're not ready. 

So? That's the one thing you're all forgetting, isn't it! That you'd die anyway.

There is a chance that it mightn't work, but not because of any reason you suggested. No, the only reason it might be dangerous for the pilot is if the person jumped before being instructed to do so... because the longer the rope, the more of a shock this would give to the helicopter once the rope would become taught if they jumped. If this did happen, I don't know how easy it would be for a chopper to with-stand this force... I know you'll say it couldn't! The other reason it mightn't work is if people couldn't keep calm enough, and started fighting for the rope. You still couldn't stand to lose in that case though as it would not affect the safety of the chopper.

At some windows the people were crowded, while at other windows there were people that could be seen all alone. The trick would be to go towards one of those windows. I wonder if the instructor on the chopper brought a speaker and said "don't jump, wait to be pulled"!

@o1s1n What happens next? Do you climb up the rope like Indiana Jones? Do they drop you onto another building's roof like in The Matrix?

I'm not even going to answer that. That's the easy part.

You're just being difficult with me for your own amusement. If I hadn't mentioned the idea of tying the rope around someone's waste in my initial suggestion, the very first thing you'd say is "oh it wouldn't work because there'd be too much force for someone to hold on to the rope with with their hands". You're just a naysayer.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120466406#Comment_120466406

Oh my. What in your opinion is the best type of knot to use? Trouser loops are well known for their helicopter strength design. Friction of the rope is not important as it would be nivia coated.

Asides from that, sure its only a building on fire and collapsing. Not a bother!

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120463900#Comment_120463900

Panic? You've never been in such a situation so you can not immediately assume that you'd be panicking. People who undergo the experience of being in an emergency are often surprised at how they handle themselves.

This photo was taken 1 hour and 30 minutes after that tower was hit. The smoke is only in certain areas. You cannot assume that every one of those rooms was so full of smoke that you'd have to hold your breathe. Now if you were to try this an hour earlier, it would be easier. The idea would work in theory and there was actually quite a bit of time to plan it.

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120466430#Comment_120466430

Ah yeah, they resort to sarcasm when they're stuck.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120466540#Comment_120466540

Wouldn't have helped them.

Jim_Hodge

Christ but this has become bizarre.

Brid Hegarty

@gameoverdude Have you ever seen the twin towers? They were pretty big. Not to mention the surrounding buildings. It's downtown NYC!

What's your point?