Picard 3x04- 'No-Win Scenario' ~~ { ** Spoilers Within ** }

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120341763#Comment_120341763

Ya I was more just making a joke about how people can blatantly tell me it was bad with no explanation.

Season 1 was certainly good enough that it got me interested in Trek again and excited for s2 (sadly). It's the only live season along with SNW s1 that I like.

Evade

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120341934#Comment_120341934

There are pages and pages of why season one is bad in this forum.

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120341988#Comment_120341988

It was just funny how bluntly you put your opinion.

No need to get into a Goodfellas "what kinda funny" thing.

geecee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120338739#Comment_120338739

it reminded me of the red forest stuff from 12 monkeys, i thought that it was just Shaw triggering this for me... till i realized that Terry Matalas is the (showrunner ?) on both!

CastorTroy

Jack looks like Simon Baker in The Mentalist.

I did like them throwing the asteroid. Maybe he got the idea from the bugs in Starship Troopers.

Happy that Jack pointed out how they were using the Holodeck with everything shut down. Still I'm sure someone could've figured out how to use its battery for the rest of the ship.

I am a little confused as to how alcohol works in a holodeck though.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120342373#Comment_120342373

I wonder if Jameson paid for that product placement... although maybe not if it was referred to as 'something cheap'.

Evade

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120342373#Comment_120342373

Food and drinks on the holodeck has pages and pages of speculation. The most likely theory is that consumables are replicated

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120342450#Comment_120342450

I imagine with "safety protocol" turned on or off for alcohol same as guns.

CastorTroy

Can't see it being replicated. It takes a couple of seconds to replicate a cup of tea, imagine how long it would take to replicate stock for a bar, but the program starts up right away. So unless the whole room is a replicator, then they would also need time to take from the replicator to the shelves.

But just a thought and better not go down that rabbit hole now.

Overall a decent episode. At least they're finally away from the nebula. Unless they somehow are still there next week. Think the Titan sticks around?

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120342559#Comment_120342559

The whole room is sorta a giant replicator.

It creates items that you can touch eat and shoot people with. The fact it's quicker than a normal replicator might be a power thing or just a plot hole thing.

ixoy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120342166#Comment_120342166

Completely reminded me too of the red forest so I'm adding it to the growing list of '12 Monkeys' Easter Eggs. Sure '12 Monkey's had a Titan in it too.

Slydice

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120342166#Comment_120342166

Oh wow, good spot!

~Rebel~

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120342573#Comment_120342573

For efficiency, it could even be a case of the holodeck replicating the look of things, which then become tangible/replicated when a guest interacts with them. So the imagery of a whole stock of bottles, with only the ones you touch becoming 'real' in the moment you touch them. One would imagine two versions of tangibility - stuff you can take out of the holodeck and stuff you can't. So you'd assume the materialisation of a chair is something you can't take out, but that consumables like food and drink are actually replicated the same as food replicators do.

We're probably overthinking it though, given that it likely all just came into being as a fun plot device that allowed them to use random sets from other shows.

The thing of it having its own power source is fine - but you'd definitely expect that if needed for stuff like life support, that they could reroute power from that source into the other systems. Would just be common sense.

Stark

I really liked this episode. My favourite of the season so far. The biggest thing for me is this is the first time since the show started that I felt like I was watching Picard with the full essence of what made us love the character from start to finish. Up to now it's been glimpses of that but mostly Stewart's weird doddery old man take on the character.

My first thought when I saw there was a holodeck scene while the ship was falling to its death was that scene from the Simpson's episode "Lemon of Troy" where they need to make an urgent escape in Flander's RV but the engine won't start as Homer is using the battery to grill meat in the back.

~Rebel~

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120343232#Comment_120343232

"God dammit Jean-Luc, get out of Ten Forward! We've got Ten Forward at home!"

PhiloCypher

I think it's entirely sensible that holodecks would have, at the very least, a back up power source so if you are traversing an overhang on a mountaineering program you don't fall to your death when main power fails and everything dissappears around you .

One thing I do have an issue with is all the crew just standing around in corridors when Riker told them all to congregate in common areas. I appreciate some of this is budgetary, but given they created a 10 forward bar for the Flashbacks could they not have just redressed that set to serve as the Titan common area so the crew would seem to have been following Rikers orders and not just permanently in transit to somewhere .

All in all tho I really enjoyed the episode, best of the season so far . I imagine this whole nebula arc will flow much better when binged.

ItHurtsWhenIP

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120333666#Comment_120333666

No Rafi was nice. Hope that doesn't mean she's getting the lion's share of the next episode.

You are the only one who seems to have had the same concern as I. This was a "Titan Episode". I fear the next one will be an all "Rafi Episode", possibly bringing in some others like Geordie and Lore. Though because of the name of the series, I guess the Titan shows up at the end and the gang all gets together. 🤷‍♂️

ItHurtsWhenIP

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120342373#Comment_120342373

I did like them throwing the asteroid. Maybe he got the idea from the bugs in Starship Troopers.

Didn't Vadic toss the Eleos at the Titan with it's tractor/repulser beam and rip the hell out of it's hull in doing so?

~Rebel~

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120343588#Comment_120343588

Yup, Riker used their own trick against them.

Elsewhere, I kinda hope we don't actually have Lore and Moriarty playing an active role in the series, and that those snapshots we saw in the trailer are actually just changelings fücking with them, cycling briefly through a few known Picard/TNG enemies. The best thing about this series so far is that they've kept things reasonably simple, so i'd rather they stuck to the people who have already been established now (with Geordi added in at Daystrom).

FGR

Really enjoyed this episode. It was the closest to proper live action Trek so far imo. No Rafi in this instance really helped - add to that the lack of Elnor and especially Jurati I'm really liking this season.

Shaw has definitely grown on me. He's a stubborn hard headed boss but maybe the experience here is what makes him open up to reason a la season one TNG Picard. I also like Seven's character in this season; again a benefit of there being no Rafi in the vicinity of the main plot.

I don't like the lighting; and although it's personal preference I don't like the Neo Constitution Class. It's like taking the Titan and purposefully making it look out dated. Maybe it's to keep the SNW ship looking a little less obsolete?

Either which way I'm still hoping for them to give us one more piece of fan service - I thought we'd get it when Ten Forward was being made in the holodeck but of course it wasn't the one from the Ent-D. Even just a glimmer of the cast standing on the bridge of a Galaxy Class or seeing one in action would be amazing.

I understand cost is a big thing but damn, that would be nice.

Overall - quite happy. If they ret-con everything Discovery related and bring in a new series set post Picard but not 600 years in the future then I think I'll be happy.

Maybe a Shaw trek?

Stark

Maybe a Shaw trek?

No

breezy1985

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120347476#Comment_120347476

A show about him and 7.

Star Trek : Shaw and Order.

Drumpot

I really enjoyed that episode. S3 has been stronger then S2.

TheValeyard

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120347815#Comment_120347815

Take your upvote and get out lol

Rawr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120347815#Comment_120347815

Ah…but then we’ll end up with a load of silly spin offs of that:

Shaw & Order: Special Crewmans Unit

Shaw & Order: Orion Syndicate

Shaw & Order: …..Miami

….I’ll get my coat :P

TheIrishGrover

That was... Well it was better than the last but still not great.. The holodeck with it's own dedicated power source? Sure, OK. whatever. I would have thought the reasoning would be more like having it as a backup/DR bridge in the event of disaster..... rather than a pub. And, why not send as many into the holodeck instead of individually powered quarters if you had this standalone independently-maintained safehouse?

Shaw was great. His Wolf359 speech was a great companion to Sisko's: Sisko was only a couple of years from 359 and had lost his wife and here he was in front of Locutus himself. And Sisko was, and continued to be, angry. So his reaction was justified.

Shaw was years later but he has being living with survivour's guilt since then. Not only that but, by this stage, Picard is almost a mythical figure. People worshipping the ground he walks on. And, not only that, but here he comes in, takes Shaw's ship and dooms them all without so much as an apology. He simply is Jean-Luc PICARD and sin è!! So his reaction is great (Although his reaction so publicly would most likely have divided the crew)

How many times did Beverly have to count down before she maybe thought to ask the computer if "Hey, are these pulses increasing in frequency? Can you determine the next one?"

Still don't like Jack (I don't know if you are meant to though. I hope not). and FFS, leave Picard eat his dinner!!!.

The dialogue from Picard and Riker seems slightly strange. I have no problem with the F-bomb. That that was actually well done. But, it seems there is more "Well, it's like this" and ""Well, what can we do?" I don't know if I can even verbalise why I find it just a teeny bit off (Similar to Worf). I suppose it could be that they are more casual and less clipped than initially as they know eachother for decades. I think that's just on me. TRYING to find fault.

Them surfing the shockwave, does EVERY Trek show have to pull that one out? Surely we all knew they were going to do that the instant we saw Beverly timing the pulses. And them having orgasmic/religious rapture as they surf? All it was missing was a Burnham VO "What is the meaning of Hope? When all is lost, REBIRTH! Family"

Riker, as usual, was great. Best thing in the series so far. But I also really like Shaw.

So is Evil-Perry a changeling?

Did I mention I don't like Jack?

Theduke1960

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120348273#Comment_120348273

Love this review. Captured it well. Shaw is brilliant. Grouchy.

And you are right Picard needed to be taken down a peg.

I saw other posters criticising Stewarts acting at this stage. Not great.

However I'm delighted to see Riker back again. Jonathan frakes has improved as an actor. He never had Stewarts range but the old age suits him. He is acting with his face rather than body now.

Theduke1960

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120348065#Comment_120348065

This made me laugh

TheIrishGrover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120349617#Comment_120349617

Yeah, Frakes does a damn good job of directing and I wish him well in that career but absolutely, he aged well into that role. While I do NOT want yet another spinoff..... dare I say it... if one absolutely had to happen? Yeah... gimme a (possibly disgraced) Riker short series (2 series of 6 60 min episodes). He has, hands down, been the best thing on the show. He IS Riker who had come into his own instead of being in this legend's shadow: This is a Riker who captained the Titan before Shaw and was first officer on the Enterprise as opposed to being first officer under Picard. Riker who faced down Locutus. Shaw is excellent also but it is telling that Picard himself comes a distant third. Not due to performance, I thought his anger at Beverly was very well done, but simply because his story arc isn't that interesting...

Theduke1960

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120350315#Comment_120350315

I'm a huge huge Stewart fan. The guy is Oscar material but he is just too old now. Some actors age well. He hasn't.

He was an inspired choice for Picard in 1986. Counter intuitive but he is way way past his sell by date.

A Riker spin off series would have been good 20 years ago but too late now. I love JF but too late now my man.

ST ran back to Picard. Showed a real lack of imagination. Believe in well written new characters male or female.

Fuck prequels masquerading as sequels.

Stop identity politics. Believe in strong males and females.

Fuck feminist orthodoxy.