Trans Woman School shooting TN

archermoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410085#Comment_120410085

From what I can tell officials in Tennessee have been using she/her pronouns for the shooter based on gender assigned at birth. I haven't seen a lot of information about the shooter, but from what I can tell they were a trans man rather than a trans woman.

Spanish Eyes

Title of thread should read Trans MAN.

chopperbyrne

Thread title should be changed though to Trans Identified Woman (Female) or Trans Man (Female) though if it's going to be mentioned.

looksee

Yes, I just read the statement in post 3 issued by the 'Trans Resistance Network' which appears, contrary to its name, to be a trans support group, and they refer to the shooter as he - also known as Aiden.

rogber

Isn't the headline misleading and it's a trans man who did the shooting?

I thought they were "assigned" female at birth (i.e. born female) before deciding they were a man and doing a mass shooting to prove it? So trans man, not woman

silverharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410109#Comment_120410109

not quite right, if was a toothless redneck that could be deemed to be a white supremist, this thread would be the motherload

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410093#Comment_120410093

It’s not just technically correct, it’s absolutely correct, and it puts responsibility back where it belongs - on the person or persons who chooses to commit murder, regardless of their weapons of choice, be it their bare hands, a butter knife, a beretta or even a bazooka. I’ve already acknowledged the ease with which it is possible for people who are of a mind to do so, to have access to firearms.

Unfortunately for them, American society has decided that their freedom to wave their metal mickeys about the place is more important than… well, everything really.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120409933#Comment_120409933

Some clarity needed. Was this person a female at birth who then later styled/ reassigned herself as a man?

Did her parent(s) look at the baby when born and say 'we have a new lovely daughter'?

Did the police shoot dead a man or a woman? Or a woman styled/ reassigned as a man?

Should be easy enough to get these basic facts?

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410149#Comment_120410149

A lot of the initial reporting had it all a bit arseways, hence the thread being labelled incorrectly. Could be fixed now though.

ohnonotgmail

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410161#Comment_120410161

over 100 mass shootings including 2 at schools this year alone in the US. how many others had their own thread?

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410085#Comment_120410085

Did she continue to 'consider herself female' though?

The availability of guns is the main issue for people who want to limit or ban guns.

An investigation into what antidepressants/antipsychotics (or others drugs) these shooters are on, and an analysis based on that, would be pertinent imo but I'm not holding my breath.

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410085#Comment_120410085

It's a fair question. I can only think that it must be because the shooter only recently transitioned. Reading the Daily Mail's article on it they say that according to their Linked In profile the shooter was now identifying as a man.

The same article quotes the mother of the shooter referring to "my daughter". Separately the mother is described as "Very religious".

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410169#Comment_120410169

Police shot and killed a scumbag who had already shot a number of victims.

What more clarification do you need?

One eyed Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410085#Comment_120410085

It’s more a prime example of how language is used to bend perceptions and influence reality.

Basically it’s sleight of language - they’re a woman, who is transgender. That’s proper use of Person First language, as opposed to referring to the individual in question as a transgender man, when they’re… obviously not a man. That’s using Identity First language.

https://askearn.org/page/people-first-language

Things were way less complicated when all you’d to do was mind your Ps and Qs 😂

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410173#Comment_120410173

lots of shootings, but check out the fatalities in them - they're mostly very low.

This recent Nashville one is in the top three from what I can see.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_shootings_in_the_United_States_in_2023

TomTomTim

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410098#Comment_120410098

It's the only one, because some people are both trying to illicit sympathy for this shooter and politicize it to their advantage. The fact that that's happening tells you all you need to know about modern ideologues. They wouldn't dare try something similar with any of the white male shooters, yet they'll gladly do it for one of their "oppressed" groups". I'm not saying that we shouldn't try and understand the motivations of these types, we should, but the people doing it here are only doing it in the name of spin, and not out of some sort of deep care about what leads people to do something like this.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120409908#Comment_120409908

They are the ones who allow military grade weaponry to be purchased as easy as a shovel.

WrenBoy

Hope she burns. RIP to the victims.

briany

I just find it galling that all those 2nd amendment heads in the USA who cling to the right of owning assault weapons even as junior/senior infants kids were mown down will be the same ones jumping upping down for trans people to be outlawed and cite this shooting as the reason.

I want to see their own rhetoric thrown back in their face one time and hear someone say to them something like, "Maybe the only way to stop a bad trans person with a gun is to have a good trans person with a gun."

Their reaction,

RIP to the dead. Another day in America...

Deregos.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410170#Comment_120410170

Yes, the title should be changed to something like. . 'Another nuthouse with assault rifles kills six in school shooting'.

A determined adult doesn't need a gun to kill three children and three unarmed 60-something adults. If a person was intent on committing a crime like this and guns were not available, they would think of other ways of accomplishing same.

Guns obviously facilitate the larger mass shootings - the Vegas hotel one etc - so i'm not against restrictions. But anyone who thinks gun restrictions would be a quick-fix solution to mass killings is naive.

Brussels Sprout

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410248#Comment_120410248

Not sure what thread you're reading. I can't see anyone trying to "illicit sympathy for this shooter".

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410374#Comment_120410374

I don't think anyone is debating that, it's the ease at which you can kill with a gun that begs the question re gun control.

Plunging a knife into someone or something equally as visceral and personal is a lot more difficult to do than pulling a trigger from a distance.

Sure, some mass shooters could have probably gone on a rampage with a knife. I would say a lot of them simply wouldn't have been able to commit their crimes without a gun though. Not everyone can kill with their bare hands.

briany

@[Deleted User]

But anyone who thinks gun restrictions would be a quick-fix solution to mass killings is naive.

Strongly disagree. The person who committed the atrocity in Las Vegas would have had a far harder time doing what they did using only handguns, a knife or a board with a nail in it. Impossible, even, I would say.

There's a whole culture around mass shootings in the States and something about that way of killing which draws would-be perpetrators to it. It's not that they'd switch to improvised explosives or something like that if assault weapons became too difficult to get. If it was just about killing people, you'd already see a larger variety of methods in these kinds of massacres, a lot more bombings etc. There is a cultural attraction to guns and being the gunman which cannot be replaced by knives, bows and arrows or bombs.

Unless guns were totally outlawed, these kinds of shootings would continue to some degree, but sensible restrictions would at least severely reduce what your average maniac can do.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410374#Comment_120410374

Would you rather confront a determined adult with a knife or an assault rifle that can fire 60 high velocity bullets a minute?

BruteStock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120409801#Comment_120409801

With statements like this is it any wonder why anti-trans bigotry is on the rise. According to reports Hale was well adjusted , educated , decent job , talented , loving friends and family etc. . The torment this person experienced , like in a lot of cases , was in her own head. The community who made that statement will put the blame everywhere else and will ignore the mental health struggle that comes with gender dysphoria.

They also want people to respect Hales pronouns in death. I say she waivered that respect when she murdered children. Its a mental health issue? Then seek help. The thing is , the trans community don't encourage mental health treatment. Its frowned upon in favour of medication and surgical procedures.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410491#Comment_120410491

Restricting access to firearms - while still having the same number of lunatics intent on killing - would simply change the nature of mass killings.

In the case of the Vegas shooting you have a large congregation of people in a confined space. He could have hired or stolen a large truck and ploughed through the crowd, the death toll would be similar. He could have lobbed pipe-bombs at the crowd.

In the case of a small school shooting where children and retirees are the targets... there are any number of ways an adult - even not particularly strong - could achieve a similar death toll.

I'm not against firearm restrictions but they need to be combined with an examination of what is creating and motivating these lunatics.

TheValeyard

If Sandyhook couldn't convince Americans to cop the fcuk on, nothing will. They're a lost cause.

RIP to the victims.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410185#Comment_120410185

Well, yes to a degree. However the initial reports said that a woman had killed these children and adults. I thought that fairly surprising, as would most people.

Now it appears the shooter has reassigned themselves as a man and it was a fella going around with his assault weapons.

You can surely understand why the average citizens in society are confused??

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410541#Comment_120410541

Not everyone can drive trucks or make pipe bombs.

Everyone can pull a trigger.

Even 4 year olds.

It's a misguided cockeyed talking point from gun advocates, sure if we ban guns they will all hire trucks.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410503#Comment_120410503

60 bullets a minute? That's actually incredibly slow. If you had some high capacity magazines and could easily access them you could fire a a hell of a lot more than that in a minute.

Which just reinforces your point even more!

Brussels Sprout

In the case of the Vegas shooting you have a large congregation of people in a confined space. He could have hired or stolen a large truck and ploughed through the crowd, the death toll would be similar. He could have lobbed pipe-bombs at the crowd.

If we could have killed the same number of people with those methods (I strongly disagree with that assertion btw) why didn't he use them instead?

Why do the vast, vast, vast majority of spree killers choose to use automatic weapons?

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410583#Comment_120410583

Semi automatic.

Fully automatic could be 10s times that, depending on capacity.

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410541#Comment_120410541

right, but in countries which went on to restrict access to guns and have zero access to these types of guns, what happened?

are you getting the equivalent of 3000 mass killings over 5 years replaced with truck violence, rolling pin murders?

mmmmm

no

a great example is the uk, you surely have access to a tv, watch the news? are there widespread mass truck killings? its say 20% of the population right, so 120 mass murders per year, in ireland, 12 per year

mrslancaster

Terrible tragedy. RIP to the children and teachers killed and condolences to all the grieving families.

silverharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410519#Comment_120410519

indeed, once you create a victim identity for any group you are indoctrinating them with a loser outlook in life. By definition the individual is different to the group with their own challenges and potentials.

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410599#Comment_120410599

There is widespread gun crime and widespread knife crime in the UK.

There are bomb attacks carried out by the New IRA and other Repub factions.

rogber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410519#Comment_120410519

Or more likely the gender dysphoria is an expression of the mental health issues the individual had.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410578#Comment_120410578

Most adults can drive a car. Most adults are capable of following the instructions necessary to make a pipe-bomb. Most adults have sufficient imagination to think of other ways to kill a large group of people. It's not a pleasant train of thought but we can all go there, it is not necessary for me to list alternative methods - trucks etc are mere examples to illustrate the point.

If you have a society which produces a disporportionate number of mass-murders, and you remove one means of killing... you still have a society which produces a disproportionate number of mass-murders. They don't go away. This is basic and irrefutable logic. Would-be killers are still there, they will still attempt to kill. Some will fail - indeed many armed shooters fail despite the supposed "ease" that guns bring to the table. Some will succeed and future mass-killers will adopt the tactics of those who have been successful.

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410731#Comment_120410731

In the case of the Vegas shooting you have a large congregation of people in a confined space. He could have hired or stolen a large truck and ploughed through the crowd

Come back with those goalposts.

Where is your evidence of in exchange for assault rifles all these mass murderers will just use cars or trucks instead?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410374#Comment_120410374

In general they would but in America where the horse has bolted long ago , it would like the government here banning cars tomorrow

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410731#Comment_120410731

is the USA the only place with would be killers?

in the las vegas shooting, say he had a car, he would have had to drive the car, into a venue with security and kill 60 people and injure around 400

LOGIC ERRROR

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410792#Comment_120410792

For evidence that mass-murders will attempt another method, one can look at countries which have had mass-murderers but no easily available firearms. We have seen such attacks using improvised bombs, trucks, knives, sarin gas. There have been mass-stabbings with over 30 fatalities.

Thankfully most countries produce fewer mass-murderers than USA - but when these people exist they find a way. This is irrefutable.

Where is your evidence that removing guns from a violent society causes would-be mass-murderers to quit at the first hurdle and become productive members of society?

Atlantic Dawn

You have to laugh at the police pussyfooting around terminology to describe the scumbag killer so as not to offend anyone, joke of a country they have become.

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410688#Comment_120410688

35 homicides in the uk in 2021

let that sink in for a second

with all dem terrorists floating about

35

over 40,000 guns deaths in the US in 2020, around 50% were homicides, so 20,000

try to take those numbers in

divide 20000 / 2 = 10000

10000/ 2 = 5000

5000 /2 = 2500

2500/2 = 1250

1250/2 = 625

625 /2 = 312

312/2 = 156

156/2 = 78

78/2 = 39

just to help make it easier to digest

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410844#Comment_120410844

yes that's the real tragedy in all this

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410838#Comment_120410838

AUSTRALIA

do some research would ya

any of the countries that response after just 1 mass killing, just one

rather than do nothing

Boggles

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410838#Comment_120410838

Sarin gas?

Can that be bought in Walmart?

Where is your evidence that removing guns from a violent society causes would-be mass-murderers to quit at the first hurdle and become productive members of society?

Who suggested that?

monkeybutter

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410889#Comment_120410889

he has never tried to rent a truck or steal one

crusd

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120410838#Comment_120410838

The occurrence of mass murders in other countries are orders of magnitude lower where is effective gun control. Rare incidents elsewhere in no way correlate with everyday occurrences in the US