The 2023 All Ireland Senior Football Championship (Sam Maguire Cup)

The_Kew_Tour

I think lot of early AI won by Dublin had lot Corkmen on it too.

Does not matter a jot though they are Dublins and that's that.

gormdubhgorm

Who do people think were the biggest overachievers this year and the biggest underachievers?

I think Derry have to go as the biggest overachievers so close to getting to an AI final. A team with a well drilled system a match for any side. With honourable mentions to Monaghan (playing to their last ounce as usual) and Westmeath who although not winning a game in the group series gave a great account of themselves.

The biggest underachievers have to be Kildare they even top Mayo/Galway/Tyrone IMO. Bit of disaster of a year for Kildare given the players that they have available to them etc. The group stages really showed how consistently inconsistent Kildare are.

orangerhyme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120946062#Comment_120946062

Cork are biggest underachievers. Roscommon biggest overachievers.

The_Kew_Tour

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120946062#Comment_120946062

Ya Derry over achieved. They won't get near semi final next year

Seadin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120946558#Comment_120946558

I agree with Cork, I don't know what the fcuk is going on there as of late with the footballers. As with the Hurlers, they won nothing in minor since 2001 and in u20 since 1998 but that all changed in both 2020 and 2021 in those age groups. I believe the tide will turn in the senior grade very soon as well and I believe we may be the team to beat Limerick down the road but a bit away at the moment. Limerick won't be around forever and I think Cork will be the team to finally beat them.

dunnerc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120945447#Comment_120945447

Hopefully it wont be to long , but its gonna happen :)

orangerhyme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120947882#Comment_120947882

Cork should be competitive in both codes. GAA is still very popular there.

One reason for Dublin's success is that so many traditional counties were weak during their period of dominance eg Cork, Meath, Tyrone, Derry, Meath, Down, Galway, Kerry (I know they won an AI but it's considered a weak team).

Mayo are the only team to give them a game.

Roscommon have a population of 69,000 and are competitive and drew with Dublin.

Seadin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120948519#Comment_120948519

I agree about GAA being popular in the county but the standard of both codes In the club scene isn't as strong as it should be IMO. If you look at Kerry for example, any team in Kerry would beat the equivalent level in Cork in football. It would be extremely rare for a Cork club to beat a Kerry club in intermediate or junior grades. Yes the setup is different and there are more clubs in Cork but there should be less clubs at the top grade in Cork. Senior A or intermediate A shouldn't exist as it makes the intermediate and junior grades weaker when they go outside the county for the club championship. They should cut down the teams going to Senior and Intermediate. Then you would have a better standard at the lower levels in my view. Cork football I still think is miles off it needs to be to be challenging for Sam Maguire again. Something needs to change there. It happened for the Limerick Hurlers after years of near misses and disputes, they managed to change the way they do things and you now see where that has got them with years of success. Limerick are now winners and beating teams without bottling it like Limerick teams of the past. Limerick were never short of great Hurlers but the process is different now and there is great communication with everyone involved and that's why they are very successful.

orangerhyme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120949293#Comment_120949293

I wouldn't compare clubs with Kerry as Kerry have a huge advantage in the AI club at Intermediate and Junior. A better comparison is minor and U20 where ye do well against Kerry. Cork have won two of each in the last 5 years.

I don't know what's going on in Cork but at a minimum they should be at Mayo and Tyrone's level, i.e. consistently competitive.

Seadin

There are less Kerry clubs at senior level in Kerry than Cork so intermediate and junior in Kerry are alot stronger. If the same structure was in Cork I imagine we be on par at the lower grades of football.

Intermediate in Kerry is like Senior in Cork, alot of Intermediate teams in Kerry may have been playing Senior at some stage but an Intermediate team in Cork would have to go along ways before climbing to the top of Senior football in Cork and that's where the gulf in standard is. If Cork copied Kerry's model I believe they be away more successful in football imo.

Seadin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120949740#Comment_120949740

I agree with minor and U20, Cork usually do well at these grades and are close to Kerry in the roll of honours in these grades. But something goes wrong after that and I don't know why but it's rare to see good Cork underage teams transforming into successful senior teams. Whoever is in charge of this isn't doing a good job. This has been always the case.

The_Kew_Tour

If we are basing it on population than Down and Antrim are seriously underachieving.

We all know though it's not that straightforward. Cork size kinda goes against them in another way.

Not making excuses cause 1000% Cork should be doing better especially in football, but its not as simple as potential playing size.

Corks problem has being caused a lot by a County Board that used and abused its power for nearly 30 years and its not recovered yet.

Kerry, Dublin, Mayo and Limerick have great financial backing and better luck to them but where is Dublin, Kerry or Mayos Hurling team or Limericks football team?

Many factors contribute and putting it down to just population is unfair for numerous reasons.

orangerhyme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120950493#Comment_120950493

It's not just population, it's number of clubs and players and culture and history. Cork has all that. I imagine Antrim has a large Protestant population which has no interest in GAA.

Also players being able to live at home is a big advantage, particularly in that 18 to 22 age group.

Large parts of Kerry historically have no interest in hurling. Traditionally only a handful of clubs in north Kerry play hurling. This is changing slowly though.

blowitupref

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120948519#Comment_120948519

Against the top two in the country Cork was competitive in the championship against Kerry and Dublin in the league losing narrowly to both. Reaching a Quarter final was probably the height of their ambitions this year. Cork showed plenty promise and potential this year they remind me of Galway and the stage of development they were in back in 2015 when Kevin Walsh took over.

Roscommon probably have their strongest panel of players at the moment for 20 years and apart from their win against Mayo and draw with Dublin they did not bring their Div 1 league form into the championship. So for them to not reach All Ireland Quarter final for a 2nd year in a row losing to teams they were expected to beat is certainly not overachieving.

MacDanger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120946062#Comment_120946062

In general, Kildare can be considered to be an underachiever considering their population, etc. but this year they finished 2nd in their group and made the knockout stages. They'd have been disappointed to lose at home to Monaghan I'd say but overall, I think they were at par for the championship.

Galway probably the biggest underachievers this year IMO - after pushing Kerry close last year, pretty much everyone would have expected them to be in the last 4 this year but instead they went out at the same stage as Kildare.

Mayo & Tyrone going out at the QF stage is about right I'd say although the manner of defeat makes it feel like an underachievement for both.

orangerhyme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120951187#Comment_120951187

Cork are on an upward swing. I agree. I'm from Kerry and we actually want Cork to be strong but obviously we want to beat them.

I just mean over the last 10 years, they've been underachieving.

They should be reaching AI finals, league finals etc. Winning minors, U20s.

Roscommon have been overachieving relative to their population.

They've won Connaught championships, AI minors, getting to 1/4 finals regularly etc.

69,000 is a tiny population. That's less than 1/20th of Dublin and 1/8 of Cork.

The same goes for Monaghan. It'll be interesting to see how Offaly do cos they're investing a lot in coaching but there also a dual county.

Sligo are on an upward swing also.

robbiezero

Dubs women looking very good here. Killing Kerry

Women against girls so far. Game could be over early. Great football from the dubs.

blowitupref

No change for 2024 when a few tweaks was needed IMO.

https://www.rte.ie/sport/football/2023/0911/1404625-all-ireland-football-final-to-retain-july-date-for-2024/?

enricoh

Mickey Harte stepped down from louth n apparently heading to Derry. Gave louth a good bump during his tenure.

Always_Running

All stars confirmed tonight. David Clifford won player of the year.

Stephen Cluxton (Dublin)

Conor McCluskey (Derry)

Michael Fitzsimons (Dublin)

Tom O'Sullivan (Kerry)

James McCarthy (Dublin)

Gareth McKinless (Derry)

Conor McCarthy (Monaghan)

Brian Fenton (Dublin)

Brendan Rodgers (Derry)

Paudie Clifford (Kerry)

Sean O'Shea (Kerry)

Enda Smith (Roscommon)

David Clifford (Kerry)

Shane McGuigan (Derry)

Colm Basquel (Dublin)

5 Dublin

4 Kerry

4 Derry

1 Monaghan

1 Roscommon 

Jeju

Great to see a few non AI winners -runners up on the list, fair play and well deserved to McGuigan, Rodgers, Mccarthy, Rodgers and Enda Smith who are all brilliant role models and hero's to the young boys and girls of their county's.

munster87

It was the penalty against Cork that tipped it in Clifford’s favour imo

Trampas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121388125#Comment_121388125

I thought it was beating the football power house of Clare