AI to Catch Drivers.

thinkabouit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120526746#Comment_120526746

Why would he.

We're rewarding driver's who have no penalty points, have their car insured nctd & taxed for the year.

No matter what way you call or look at it driving is dangerous. If you can prove you've been following the spirit of the law you should be rewarded someway.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120527001#Comment_120527001

The idea of rewarding drivers for not doing what they are not allowed do is stupid. Like really f***ing stupid!

I get it that you're reluctant to provide details of your idea and this is why it is being mocked. Maybe if you can actually demonstrate how it would work rather than continue to post the same unverified nonsense, people might start taking your opinion a with bit less mirth. As it stands, your idea will not work, will be difficult to administer, unfair to people who cannot drive or choose not to drive, but worst of all, it is effectively rewarding people for doing what they are meant to be doing.

The main issue with your idea is that you're treating driving as a right and not a privilege. Stop taking that approach - driving is not a right!

So either show us how your idea might be something that somehow could actually work to reduce the number of drivers breaking the law on the roads or else just stop pushing this stupid idea simply because your paranoid of AI taking over the world or something

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120527022#Comment_120527022

We need more gardai. However, no matter how many gardai we recruit, we cannot afford to have thenm policing simple offences 24/7 such as bus lane usage.

A traffic camera linked to a computer which does a reg lookup and makes the call that this is a car or bus and then decided to flag it for review by a garda is a far simpler and less wasteful approach to having a garda stand 24/7 at a set of traffic lights waiting to catch a bus lane abuser.

Same for traffic lights. Same at random places looking for seat belt usage. Same for speeding, phone use and so on. It isn't rocket science. It isn't a slippery slope. It is quite simple actually.

As for calim that the success rate will be the same - given that AGS curently don't really police our roads, by merely introducing this, it will have an overnight impact which will simply highlight the current absence of enforcement.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120527054#Comment_120527054

No matter what way you call or look at it driving is dangerous. If you can prove you've been following the spirit of the law you should be rewarded someway.

Like I said earlier, I've not killed loads of people - how much will I get and will it be a lot more that I'd get for not killing just the one person?

Seth Brundle

Apologies @thinkabouit but I meant to reply to this yesterday...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120521452#Comment_120521452

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120522649#Comment_120522649

Yes it's how these things start.

What things?

Look where we are now from 20 - 30 year's ago.

Where?

Remember covid.

I do, why? Should I be worried that you're another of these anti-masker, anti-vaxx nutjobs?

first it was just stay at home, then you can't go beyond 5km, now you need a mask, now you need a vaccine & now you need to prove your vaccinated.

Aaagh, you're going there.

I need to prove nothing?!?! Vaccines were never mandatory. You did need one however in order to do certain things.

However, I am not a selfish prick and wanted to make sure that I didn't place an unnecessary nburder on an already overstretched healthcare system and/or add additional risk to others who were deemed vulnerable (actually I was deemed vulnerable due to my underlying health issues and thankfully I didn't catch covid!).

But, this isn't a covid thread nor is it the conspiracy theories forum.

See now where it starts and ends??

Nope. I like to follow facts rather than some daft paranoid conspiracy! You've provided no facts for any of your proposals to date.

And they won't make a difference because people will continue to be assholes on road's as is the case now even with all the tools we use already.

This is the probalm. You cannot change people's behaviour by asking nicely. Years of watching the Road Safety Authority plead with drivers should show you this!

A better use of that money would be to hire Gardai & actually make the road's better.

The reality is that we can';t have Gardai police every single road and junction as it is simply isn't practical. We do need loads more gardai nonetheless.

thinkabouit

Jesus yee are so brainwashed in yer thinking there's just no hope.

Not one of you can see 10 - 20 year's ahead.

If you wanna keep the roads safe look after your driving and don't worry about anybody else.

You wanna spend 100 million plus on systems and give away more rights just because somebody's using the bus lane. Crime of the century!

Look after what you can control on the road & Mind your own business.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120527435#Comment_120527435

So that's it? All you can say when we ask for details of your proposal is that we should mind our own business??? That's some plan you have there to save lives!

Edit: regarding me being brainwashed, as you can see from my posts, I'm doing the critical thinking here. It is you spouting unworkable and paranoid nonsense.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120526549#Comment_120526549

They have Gardai on bikes, but they don’t do that kind of patrol in ordinary traffic. They’re mainly used at Croker and Landsdowne and similar events.

RidleyJones

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120527921#Comment_120527921

They used to be spinning around Dublin when I lived in it which wasn't that long ago. Especially around our housing estates etc it was all Gardai on bikes. That was for traffic stops etc. Maybe they stopped now.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120527022#Comment_120527022

Why would AI need to follow and watch everyone 24 x 7? all we are using it for in this scenario is take the plonkers off the road

RidleyJones

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120527435#Comment_120527435

Breaking the law is breaking the law.

Unfortunealty as many people know already they can look after themselves but its the bad drivers on the road they can't and this is the issue. AI will remove those bad drivers. Sooner the better

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120527435#Comment_120527435

We can see ahead without being a paranoid conspiracist.

Its not everyone else thats brainwashed.

RidleyJones

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120526855#Comment_120526855

You could claim that back against tax?

thinkabouit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120528028#Comment_120528028

I'd say you can't see 1 week ahead never mind 1 year.

Potential-Monke

And there we have it. Breaking minor laws should be ignored. And what constitutes a minor law depends on the person who broke it. We get you now.

Thankfully, the real world will introduce this automated system which will eventually start showing the benefits, and once people see loads of others getting fined/points for not driving correctly, people will start driving correctly.

Yeah, driving in a bus lane is not the worst in the world, but why should people get away with it? They know it's illegal, yet they still do it. Why shouldn't they be caught and fined? What gives them the right to break the rules, however minor? People treat driving as just something they do, this tech will ensure people actually start driving properly or be off the road in no time.

I'm presume you're one of the people who regularly breaks road traffic laws and this is why you don't want it in, especially with the "Crime of the century" comment.

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120529357#Comment_120529357

Its always the ones who break laws that get terrified when the idea of enforcement pops up.

Potential-Monke

Yup, the most vocal are usually the ones who are pretty bad drivers who constantly break these "minor" laws, but they can't see this themselves or don't care. They just don't like to admit it. Bring it on! Someone overtook me on the inside of a roundabout yesterday. That was fun. People like that will be off the road in no time, because they're too ingrained in their wrong ways or selfishness to be able to change in time. That's why they're petrified of Skynet AI tech.

Cordell

broken window theory - one minor rule today, another tomorrow, and before you realize it we're ending up driving like they do in Mumbai. And I'm only half joking.

Kiteview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120527971#Comment_120527971

We don’t need AI to do this though.

It just needs cameras to capture the offence and/or an ANPR system to query the various databases (insurance, NCT etc) plus some automated system for posting out the fines. Other countries have been doing this for years without needing AI involved in it.

Kiteview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120527435#Comment_120527435

There is no right to break the law, so no one is “giving away more rights” if the law is enforced.

In fact, one of the conditions you agree to to get a driving licence is that you will obey the laws (on driving), which is why the courts have the right to rescind your license (ie permit) to drive if you flout those laws.

BrianG23

According to the article the "AI" is just enhanced image processing and works exactly as you say?@Kiteview "AI" is a strong word to use in this case.

It's quite hard for cameras to capture some things, image processing - including more recent advances using deep neural networks(what you call AI), makes it better, more accurate and cheaper to implement.

Far as I'm concerned the fact that this has not already been implemented is a complete joke. Studying the tech for years and wondering what the hell is taking so long. Don't even get me started on the inefficiency of traffic lights!

Also, I'm all for catching the useless ****s driving. The m50 is a joke, nobody follows the rules on it. No wonder there's so many crashes. If it was constantly monitored by cameras, everyone would follow the rules. Not a day goes by you don't see some stupid, dangerous, or impatient driving. Just wait until you or your family gave been affected by it until you sign off a safer system

Kiteview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530297#Comment_120530297

To clarify, I am in favour of using existing camera technologies and ANPR, so your last line is unnecessary.

I don’t see any reason why AI needs to be brought into it when there are existing proven camera based solutions in use all over Europe for decades.

BrianG23

The last line is just my opinion on the topic in general, not directed towards you apologies there.

From the article:

"The Guards are looking at technology that will not only just detect what speed drivers are doing but a range of things from not wearing seatbelts, using mobile phones,” she said. 

Even bus lane usage and compliance with traffic lights"

My understanding here is that these things are very challenging without AI. And have only become recently possible due to AI(last 15 years). Number plate recognition is much easier than detecting someone on their phone. It's hard to have a camera accurately detecting these things without the precision AI gives?

I could be wrong of course, can you specify some countries that have this done already so I can research that? Just curious how they are doing it

Kiteview

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530365#Comment_120530365

I was referring to other countries using non-AI cameras for checking for tax, insurance, NCT and other outstanding issues (ie the driver is a wanted person). Also for checking for speeding at fixed points (ie speed cameras) and average speed checks (ie average speed between fixed points on a road). They also use them for bus lanes, yellow boxes, cycle lanes, goods vehicle only loading bays etc.

These are all proven technologies and it would make a major improvement here to widely roll such technology out around the country - it would cut down the huge number of uninsured drivers for a start.

I have to confess that I have a very poor opinion of state bodies rolling out technology here, so I am really sceptical about them using (supposed) AI for it. You only have to look at the “real time” info for buses that was years “in testing” and yet has “disappearing” buses because the info provided to customers is a mish-mash of scheduled info from the bus timetable and real time info from the buses.

BrianG23

Can't disagree with you there. Ireland is slow, if at all implementing technology to improve our society. And when it does its normally poor. For arguments sake, why would you even need and nct,insurance and tax disk. Shouldn't that all be referenced in a central data base against your registration?

For other arguments sake on the whole "AI" thing. First thing that comes up on google "deep learning facial recognition vs traditional" is a research paper stating traditional facial recognition methods are outdated and being replaced by CNN and GAN(this is what chatGBT is built on). So I would assume, if the government are going to start using it, just do the whole shebang with AI.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530198#Comment_120530198

Broken Window theory never really worked. It was largely an excuse for racial harassment of black and Hispanic people.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2014/12/broken-windows-policing-doesnt-work-it-also-may-have-killed-eric-garner.html

RidleyJones

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530261#Comment_120530261

"It just needs cameras to capture the offence and/or an ANPR system to query the various databases (insurance, NCT etc) plus some automated system for posting out the fines."

That's AI, basic AI but still AI.

We have a load of terrible drivers on the road. Drive into Dublin and you can see it. If you put the entire Gardai force into Dublin you might make a dent but we don't have the number of Gardai.

The best option is AI to change drivers mentality. Especially as we try to move away from cars and into public transport, bus lanes full of cars is the norm in Dublin. Stopping cars going into bus lanes will hugely improve public transport and also the lives of millions of people using public transport

tesla_newbie

We need guards enforcing the law re_ violent crime, the laws are already too strict re_ “ speeding “

the type who are agitated about this are the kind who want cars off the road altogether, speed limits are too low in many places and revenue raising vans parked in the most cynical of locations where little or no risk exists ( saw one on the M6 near the Mullingar exit two days ago )

RidleyJones

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120530958#Comment_120530958

We have speed limits for different roads because of the risks involved in those roads. If that is reduced in sections normally this is because higher speed in this area will increase the chances of an accident. So no it's not the "most cynical of locations"

In terms of speed limits we are similar to majority of Europe and over the World(based on my travels most places have similar).

If you can't stay within the speed limits on the road you deserve to get banned.

The general speed limit for motorways in EU Member States is mostly 120 or 130 km/h. Germany does not have a general speed limit for motorways, but a recommended speed of 130 km/h. The general speed limit for rural roads in EU Member States is mostly 80 or 90 km/h and for urban roads 50 km/h.

Cordell

https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/ep/p-rc/recordedcrimeq32022/detailedoffencegroups/

You can see here that driving offences are the second cause of life loss after murder. But mind that usually murder means one life lost, whereas "Dangerous Driving Leading to Death" a lot of times mean more than one lives lost.

tesla_newbie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120531123#Comment_120531123

Rubbish, there is no great risk of accidents on the M6 motorway but it’s a highway where drivers are more likely to tip across the limit , hence a profitable location for raising revenue

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120531231#Comment_120531231

As you appear to know that it is profitable location, how much revenue does it make and at what cost?

As for crashes, there have been a number of them. This is the first result froma quick google...

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/driver-killed-11-injured-in-five-car-m6-motorway-crash-1.3829278