Civil servants to call for four-day working week

martingriff

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120557654#Comment_120557654

I am guessing they be open still the days there open but some people be working Friday and others Monday.

Looks like the OP is now getting the rage against the civil service but it may come

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058295274/civil-servants-to-call-for-four-day-working-week

No problem at all, many could fit in what they achieve in two days.

RedXIV

I've a lot of family in the civil service and it's pretty clear things having been shaking up for a few years now. My mother retired about 2 years ago and she is aghast at how poorly my siblings are treated in their roles, but that is definitely due to how cushy she had it for years, rather than any particularly harsh treatment they get in reality.

The key thing here though is that if the civil servants get this, it'll set a very strong precedent for the rest of the country and that should be encouraged massively.

Also I'd echo the ideal here is more to do with the number or hours rather than the number of days, I've seen weeks of my wife working three 13 hour shifts as a nurse, which means she gets 4 days off a week, but she's wrecked for most of those days as a result. Shortening the amount of working hours is definitely the ideal here.

SuperBowserWorld

Ah it depends 😁😁😁

Are people working 9-5 working a lot less than those working 9-6 ?

Also, those who commute long hours are working a lot more.

Also, those who earn more than others are working less.

Also, those who have to keep people alive for a living are working a lot more than those who don't ...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120557962#Comment_120557962

Ditto.

In my over 30 years in the civil service, across various departments, at various grades, I have yet the find myself in one of these magical places that allows staff three hours off during the day, only makes you work until 4 o'clock and gives you every friday off on flexi.

Kimbot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120558047#Comment_120558047

same here, in 22 years I havent come across that yet.

HerrKuehn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120558006#Comment_120558006

If the CS started working 4 days (32 hours? 28 hours (4x7)?) it would have no affect on private companies, you are dreaming if you think it would.

Also, the 13 hour shifts in nursing suit some (my wife is a nurse), you need less childcare, so there are benefits.

Thelonious Monk

Yeah I mean it's not like American multinationals are going to suddenly go to 4 days a week because our civil service did it

bucketybuck

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120557987#Comment_120557987

Less people on site at specific times means reduced service to the public. Longer queues to the reduced staff as the obvious example.

The idea that you remove staff on given days with no effect on productivity is not true at all.

RedXIV

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120558054#Comment_120558054

All things being equal, if you've got a young person coming out of school and they have the opportunity to go work 5 days a week in a private company or 4 days a week in the civil service, I suspect you will see some impact on private companies. Perhaps not the big multinationals but they are not the only private companies in Ireland. Civil service is a big employer, if they can switch to this model, it's a viable option for a lot of people who value their time off more than a higher wage. It will have an effect, but I agree it's not going to cause an avalanche of companies to sign up.

the nursing shifts suck for childcare because they are not consistent so we were told to pay 5 days a week anyway, because my wife could be working any day of the week, we couldn't pay for 3 days and pick and choose which they were every time there was a new roster :D I ended up doing far more childcare in my 5 day a week, well past 40 hour job in a multinational while WFH

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120558054#Comment_120558054

For the vast majority of the Civil Service, the full time working hours are 35 hours per week (excluding lunch break).

Also, with a large number of CS now working from home at least 1 or more days per week, there are significant savings to be made in heating and energy costs in closing non-public facing buildings some days of the week.

This is going to happen irrespective of any reduction in working days for staff. My current dept has multiple buildings across Dublin and the rest of the country. It is currenty considering how they can reduce the number of days all our Dublin buildings are open, due to low occupancy rates as staff are WFH. Those who wish to work 5 days a week from the office will be able to use whichever building is open on a particular day.

By the way, this call to reduce the working week to a four day week is not meant purely for the civil service.

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2023/0501/1380009-four-day-week/

This will be the second pilot in Ireland that I am aware of.

Furze99

Typically work 60 hour weeks here....

HerrKuehn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120558142#Comment_120558142

I will believe the reductions in cost when I see it to be perfectly honest. The state sector are not really known for efficiency.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/10m-of-taxpayers-money-could-be-lost-because-opw-officials-mismeasured-leased-floorspace-pac/40475655.html

OPW mismeasured floor space.

recyclops

For a lot of people cramming 37 or so hours into 4 days is not really what they want and productivity drops, the negative impact is that if its not across the board and those working on a 4 day week demand Monday or Friday off it can lead to those who it doesn't suit being unable to take annual leave due to capacity especially in roles that are customer facing.

I know in a place I worked in before it was offered but the day off was rolling for everyone to limit that impact, what tended to happen was those on a 4 day would after a few months go off it as they didn't like the longer days.

AyeGer

I am fully behind this idea. We work to live not live to work. So long as people are working efficiently then great.

More free time for people to spend on their interests and hobbies would be better for mental health and the economy.

Baba Yaga

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120557875#Comment_120557875

eh...? make it handy for the public to get things done...? cant see that happening...

wench

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120558185#Comment_120558185

According to that article, they got a great bargain.

The OPW entered into a 25-year lease at Miesian Plaza in 2017 on an annual rent of €10 subject to a review ever five years.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120558062#Comment_120558062

It's a step in the right direction towards a four day week for everyone. If folks in the private sector see civil servants on a four day week it might motivate them to start petitioning and working towards a similar outcome for themselves.

Some might even leave American multinationals for a four day week in the civil service, which could make those companies start to rethink their policies.

It's all baby steps really. Look into the history of our current two day weekend, it wasn't always the case (and is actually far more of a modern invention than you might think)

Mrs OBumble

Many civil servants are already on Shorter Working Week, and do 4 or 3 days per week, for 80 or 60% of salary.

Moving others to shorter hours with no loss of salary would not be fair to them.

fits

I couldn’t do my current workload over four days. I’m fairly stretched as it is.

bank holidays make a huge difference to my life though. A day for kids activities, a day for family and a day to do the house and garden jobs and life admin.

id love to move to a four day week but it doesn’t seem to happen much in my corner of the public sector. We are super busy.

Guildenstern

I would agree wholeheartedly about efficiency rates across our public sector, but the 4 day week is coming and if you don't realise that, you just haven't been listening. It's been increasingly debated over the last 4/5 years across business and government.

https://www.euronews.com/next/2023/02/23/the-four-day-week-which-countries-have-embraced-it-and-how-s-it-going-so-far

I hate to say it but we're just late to the party. What happens everywhere else arrives in Ireland. Eventually.

Dyr

If you can do your jobs in four days then you can be whittled down and have the remainder work a five day week.

Drifter100

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120557964#Comment_120557964

Certainly a large number of people are employed on a salary basis with a performance bonus. They won`t get overtime and their hours are nominally 9/5 with appropriate leave. If someone on a salary is paid to do a job they will work whatever hours are required to get their job done. Also people in a customer facing environment where there are only 2/3/4/5 members of staff, its not possible. Life does exist outside Dublin

HerrKuehn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120558096#Comment_120558096

I think there is a certain type of person that gravitates towards the PS, either they value security or they want something with work life balance. The type of graduate looking to work in private industry would generally have a different mindset in my opinion. I would never even have considered working in the state sector.

wench

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120558339#Comment_120558339

Easily solved by reversing their salary cut, and give them the same terms their colleagues would be getting under the new scheme.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120558378#Comment_120558378

Gotta bleed every last bit of productivity out of people, eh? I tell you what, I do not miss working in a multinational!

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120558339#Comment_120558339

Kind of missing the forest for the trees.

If the civil service went to a 4 day week rather than 5 then the people already on a shorter working week could just move to that schedule instead.

Augme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120558339#Comment_120558339

No one is being moved to shorter working hours though.

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120557856#Comment_120557856

And I know some government departments who do not work even as hard as that. Even my cousin who works there says it is a doss house, and a complete joke, but she says she may as well avail of it as someone else.

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120557916#Comment_120557916

This causes issues with rostering and makes grief for managers. I can see so many arguments.

Best to make an executive decision and say "these are your days". Then there'll be swaps (which I have no issue with), but I can see it turning into a crap show.

I'd love a 4 day week, but I already do my hours in 4 days. Everybody has to be on board and professional. It'll be terrible unless some sort mature teams show the way. When I say mature, I don't mean age.