Barbarity of drug pushers

johannmall

Take a look a irish psychiatry. ie , they call it "the gravest threat" to irish kids mental health! I'm not that tech literate so I can't import the article , Google irish kids cannabis psychosis and up it comes , and I'll stand by my comments on gateway!

kneemos

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120692282#Comment_120692282

Still have the problem of dealers and debts. Probably more so.

Hate to think what would happen if there was little or no consequence given the current level of use and the queues outside Head Shops when they were open. Strikes me as irresponsible on the part of the Government.

Tavrin Callas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120692718#Comment_120692718

Of course. Absolutely. I don't think for a minute that the solution is to just not buy them as that is totally unrealistic. I was merely pointing out that those that do buy them are contributing to the sort of behaviour described in the OP.

The solution I propose is to fully legalise them. That is a far better way to do away with the criminals and thugs who supply. But in the meantime, just don't whinge about their behaviour because if you are a customer you are part of the problem.

Tavrin Callas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120692742#Comment_120692742

Another good reason to legalise them. At least you'll know what you're buying.

Montage of Feck

Legalize the plants, might get the smackheads interested in horticulture and off the streets.

kneemos

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693385#Comment_120693385

Legalising doesn't mean supplying them over the counter. It just means prosecution for possession is lenient. Dealers will remain.

You can't even buy two boxes of Paracetamol in the chemist, nevermind coke.

Patrick2010

Does legalizing mean something similar to head shops so instead of buying heroin, cocaine, ecstasy on the street you buy it from a dealer in a shop?, or how else would it work?

kneemos

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693436#Comment_120693436

Means you don't get prosecuted for personal use. Nobody is going to legalise the sale of hard drugs.

cms88

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120691692#Comment_120691692

The gaurds are more than likely busy checking if someone doesn't have tax on their car

Patrick2010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693445#Comment_120693445

So the dealers remain as the source?, and people can still build up drug debts?. I don't see what legalizing actually solves

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120692248#Comment_120692248

Why couldn't you

kneemos

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693516#Comment_120693516

Saves court and police time I suppose and you don't get a criminal record.

I'm sure the dealers would love it though.

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693413#Comment_120693413

That's decriminalisation

Legalising something means making it legal

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693516#Comment_120693516

Decriminalizing and legalising are different.

Decriminalizing takes away police wasting time on petty users, and allows them to concentrate on dealers. The drug is still illegal, but instead of users going to jail, they would work with health workers to try and get them off the drug, and importantly, carry no criminal record so their future isn’t f*cked.

Legalizing would be like alcohol. There would be controls in place, like over 21’s, not available until a certain time, taxed etc. The police would still go after unlicensed dealers and monitor the controls put in place.

Tavrin Callas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693413#Comment_120693413

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693445#Comment_120693445

You come in with some pretty sweeping statements to this thread. "Nobody is going to legalise the sale of hard drugs", "Legalising ... just means prosecution for possession is lenient". The law can be what it wants to be, when it is drafted and approved.

And you seem to be confusing legalisation with decrimilsation. "Legalisation ... just means prosecution for possession is lenient" sound more like the result of decrimilisation, not legalisation. Full legalisation (and regulation and taxation), could be brought in, where drugs are manfactured to a standard, sold to certain people (like alcohol and cigarettes, age limits, and warnings should probably be included), and the tax on it is collected and used.

kneemos

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693540#Comment_120693540

Mad if you think hard drugs are going to be sold over the counter.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693567#Comment_120693567

To be fair, they said it “could” be legalised and sold over the counter, which indeed it “could”. The government have got the power to do that.

The government won’t of course, for many reasons, but the poster is not saying it “will” be, but it “could be” and there is an important difference there.

Quitelife

a lot of the suicides in county Limerick are related to drug debts , young people who can’t pay think it’s easier kill themselves than face the wrath of the traveller gangs . It’s all brushed under the carpet as mental health issues but it all comes back to the control drug gangs have on communities . One family who buried their daughter after a suicide had a traveller gang outside their door two days after the funeral saying they were now expected to pay the debt or else they’d dig their daughters body up .

local politicians ignore the lawlessness , they only give out lotto grants once a year and ignore their constituents plight .

Gussie Scrotch

It seems to me that there are two main problems with drug use.

1) The impact on the individual user.

2) The impact on society. By this I mean the impact on those not involved, crime driven by the need to feed addiction, criminal activities related to the dealing side of the industry.

Perhaps, like the American's failed war on alcohol in the early part of the last century, its time to accept defeat and legalise the whole lot.

Yes, we would still have the problems with addiction ( like we do withalcoholism) but, by taking the criminals out of the loop, we would free up a huge chunk of police time, generate state revenue through taxation of the product, reduce violence - certainly in that subset which is directly related to the dealers, and enable proper management of the impact on society.

Not perfect, not ideal, nor even desireable, but everything else has failed.

I see sheep

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693108#Comment_120693108

I've seen smoking lead directly lead to psychosis more than once, it is a major issue with legalising it (I support legalising all drugs). Not sure what the solution is.

WheelieKing

You should be able to buy drugs from government run premises akin to pharmacies. The war on drugs can't be won and it's fruitless fighting it. Estimations from America say they have spent over 3 trillion dollars in the last decade alone and the problem is worse than ever and they keep repeating the same mistakes over and over like complete gobsh ites.

Iv'e zero time for drugs myself and have distanced myself from friends who partake in using of drugs over the last few years.

Patrick2010

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693806#Comment_120693806

Cigarettes are legal but theres still a lot of cigarettes being sold by criminals. Even if the drugs were sold in shops where would the product be sourced?, you'd still be dealing with the criminals who aren't going to be paying VAT or tax undercutting legal dealers.Buyers will still be turning to crime to fund their addiction.And most importantly do we really want to increase the number of addicts in society?. I work in Dublin 8 and come accross enough zombies as it is now.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693884#Comment_120693884

The product would be sourced from licensed producers. It’s one reason after Canada legalised weed it wasn’t available the day after. All that legal infrastructure has to be set up.

You’ll be dealing with businesses that pay VAT, hire workers that pay tax etc, etc.

Why would buyers turn to crime? What evidence do you have of this?

Regards your last point, if drugs are decriminalised, it’s EASIER to get help to get off them as the stigma of being arrested or being treated like a criminal will be gone.

Patrick2010

Where would we source heroin and coke?

Why would buyers turn to crime?, for the same reason they do now, to fund their habit. I doubt there are many heroin addicts holding down jobs.

Bit like this case, she'll still need to steal to pay for her habit.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/courtandcrime/arid-41151274.html

growleaves

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120693108#Comment_120693108

Scientists here in Dublin doing a lot of research into this.

https://www.rcsi.com/dublin/news-and-events/news/news-article/2012/05/new-rcsi-research-demonstrates-how-cannabis-use-during-adolescence-affects-brain-regions

https://www.rcsi.com/dublin/news-and-events/news/news-article/2021/01/frequent-cannabis-use-by-young-people-linked-to-decline-in-iq

growleaves

Incoming President-elect of the Royal College of Psychiatrists has called for a public information campaign to be launched about the consequences to British teenagers of regularly smoking cannabis.

https://www.bmj.com/content/380/bmj.p407

growleaves

College of Pyschiatrists in Ireland are also warning of the dangers to young people:

https://www.irishpsychiatry.ie/blog/college-of-psychiatrists-warns-that-cannabis-is-gravest-threat-to-young-irish-peoples-mental-health-today/

‘We cannot overstate the danger that this increasingly potent drug poses to young people’s mental health’

Flaneur OBrien

Great. Now ask yourself, do dealers ask for ID? Where licensed premises will have to ask for Id, and hopefully it’s over 21’s as the brain is still forming in teenage brains and they should absolutely not be taking cannabis or any other drugs for that reason (including heavy spirits)

Making it harder for youngsters to get it is one of the aims of the decriminalisation effort.

Also, being able to list the different strengths is important. At the moment, most of the weed is too strong for regular smokers. It would be like having only whiskey available. Can you imagine how many people would turn into headcases if they only had whiskey to drink? No beers, wines etc.

Decriminalising and legalising allows for proper labelling to happen. It was one of my favourite things about going to Amsterdam, perusing the menu 😂

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120692693#Comment_120692693

No, this is the ban drugs rock on which people swear it's a positive thing for society because drugs=bad-mmmkay?

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120694064#Comment_120694064

We cannot overstate the danger that this increasingly potent drug poses to young people’s mental health’

This is the really important bit and why it needs to be legalised. There’s no reason for it to be that strong and getting stronger, except that it makes more profit for scumbag dealers.

Higher potency = less amounts needed to get high, but sold at the same price as larger quantity, weaker strains that were around in the past. It means there’s less product needed to be shipped in as well, so it’s slightly less risky.

Making it legal would introduce much, much weaker strains into society.