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Tour de France 2023 ***spoilers*** Warning in OP

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    #1202
    Dcully
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 14,707 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dcully


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867782#Comment_120867782

    Agreed but on the TT bike topic, i read Dan Martin on twitter during the week say Pog training on a TT bike only while recovering from broken wrist could be a big help for the TT.

    Hard to say for sure either way but an interesting point from Dan.



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    #1203
    breezy1985
    Registered Users Posts: 25,708 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867782#Comment_120867782

    It's not the same as 2020.

    Rog popped on Belles Filles and finished 25" behind WvA for 5th.

    Pog today blitzed everyone and had a great TT and still got destroyed himself.



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    #1204
    Girly Gal
    Registered Users Posts: 2,890 ✭✭✭Girly Gal


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867761#Comment_120867761

    Roglic clearly collapsed under the weight of expectation that day, while it was a remarkable result, some was down to Roglic falling apart, which was quite sad to watch at the time.

    Pogacar didn't fall apart today, it just felt that way because JV was so far ahead, I thought at one point Pogacar had collapsed and fallen behind WvA, but, he was well over a minute ahead of him. Some of the narrative afterwards was that Pogacar failed, but, he didn't, JV's performance was just out of this world. No one could have predicted that margin before the race.



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    #1205
    happytramp
    Registered Users Posts: 2,611 ✭✭✭happytramp


    I suppose on a climb if Jonas won and finished 1.40 ahead of pog in 2nd we probably wouldn't be too surprised.



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    #1206
    eagle eye
    Registered Users Posts: 38,171 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867782#Comment_120867782

    How many times does it have to be said that Pog smashed it? He did an incredible TT and finished well behind the winner.



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    #1207
    Mefistofelino
    Registered Users Posts: 1,792 ✭✭✭Mefistofelino


    Lost in all this is that Mads Pedersen finished 9th, not even a minute down on WVA. Something for everyone in the audience in that top 10 - climbers, GT winners, TTers and sprinters.



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    #1208
    Macy0161
    Registered Users Posts: 9,387 ✭✭✭Macy0161


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867782#Comment_120867782

    Pog more popular than Jonas too, just to add to that as well as the spectacle.

    Big thing for me wasn't really the climbing or the flat, Jonas absolutely nailed the descents, on the aero bars (enough that I was fearing he'd over cook it). It didn't seem that Pog was as fast on the downhills. And I was actually surprised how (relatively) flat it was from the top of the climb - just makes the bike change decision even worse, and he wasn't even as aero as he could've been on the road bike.



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    #1209
    JRant
    Registered Users Posts: 12,958 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867782#Comment_120867782

    Of course it's possible, anything is possible really. The 2020 ITT win over Dumoulin was another hilly day with a categorised climb on it as well and much longer at just under 40km. Rog also cracked that day and had a disastrous bike change and looked all over the place on the road. Again, Ving winning isn't a surprise, the margin is.

    I'd say it's a certainty that Pogs wrist means he wasn't as fluid on the TT bike as he would normally be but he still put in one hell of a ride.

    I'll also say I really like both riders. They had a great battle last year and showed nothing but respect to each other during and since then. The last two years have been some of the best racing we've seen in years and this tour hasn't disappointed either.

    For me it's not about ruining of the spectacle at all. I would love nothing better than to take today at face value and celebrate what was an incredible win.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



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    #1210
    CramCycle
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,773 Mod ✭✭✭✭CramCycle


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867873#Comment_120867873

    He took those descents like a man possessed.



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    #1211
    eagle eye
    Registered Users Posts: 38,171 ✭✭✭✭eagle eye


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867910#Comment_120867910

    He put more time into Pog on the climb than he did in the earlier sections.



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    #1212
    JRant
    Registered Users Posts: 12,958 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867922#Comment_120867922

    Maybe he should use his TT bike for the big mountain stages. He may have stumbled on to something here.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



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    #1213
    Weepsie
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 20,327 Mod ✭✭✭✭Weepsie


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867906#Comment_120867906

    It's not really. He's been smashing TTs all year in fairness. We don't know what they did yesterday. We don't know how much the weekend took out of either.

    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867805#Comment_120867805

    Turbo trainer as good as it is, will never fully replicate a real thing though. Won't be as twitchy, don't have to worry about conditions. The feedback from being on the turbo and then on the road is world's apart



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    #1214
    JRant
    Registered Users Posts: 12,958 ✭✭✭✭JRant


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867943#Comment_120867943

    Like I said, it's no surprise that he won today's stage.

    I wouldn't even begin to hypothesize what he did yesterday to enable such a performance today 😂

    It's been a hectic two weeks of racing so far and both riders should be feeling it coming into this last week.

    "Well, yeah, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man"



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    #1215
    Dcully
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 14,707 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dcully


    @Weepsie I believe it was the TT bike he was speaking of, said he only trained on TT bike for 5 weeks.



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    #1216
    Dcully
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 14,707 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dcully


    @JRant


    "I'll also say I really like both riders. They had a great battle last year and showed nothing but respect to each other during and since then. The last two years have been some of the best racing we've seen in years and this tour hasn't disappointed either."



    Just to quote you on this and to say i couldnt agree more.

    Both very likeable guys and have given us two of the most memorable tours in a long time.

    Both are champions in my mind.



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    #1217
    Girly Gal
    Registered Users Posts: 2,890 ✭✭✭Girly Gal


    No one is really surprised by JV winning, it's the margin of victory considering Pogacar in second had a big margin over the rest of the field.



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    #1218
    Weepsie
    Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 20,327 Mod ✭✭✭✭Weepsie


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867965#Comment_120867965

    Yes, but he was doing so on a turbo trainer for the 5-6 weeks immediately after the fracture. His first cycle on road was on a non TT bike, or at least the first one publicised.


    His wrist was in a cast or strapping for much of that time



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    #1219
    at1withmyself
    Registered Users Posts: 2,522 ✭✭✭at1withmyself


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867694#Comment_120867694

    Ya that was a tough watch alright, less interested now for the remainder of the Tour.

    Good old Rabobank..



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    #1220
    Macy0161
    Registered Users Posts: 9,387 ✭✭✭Macy0161


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120868011#Comment_120868011

    Sticking it to good old Lampre...



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    #1221
    MangleBadger
    Registered Users Posts: 529 ✭✭✭MangleBadger


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120867374#Comment_120867374

    Not really. Pog is 2nd. It’s just Planche 2020 reversed. 1 super human performance.



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    #1222
    Dcully
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 14,707 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dcully


    Ill just put this here


    https://twitter.com/cyclingtakes/status/1681335345302888448



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    #1223
    Morris Garren
    Registered Users Posts: 513 ✭✭✭Morris Garren


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120868127#Comment_120868127

    And you believe this random twittering to be a reliable source of verification? Trump once tweeted that all Mexican immigrants were sex offenders. That's twitter for ya



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    #1224
    Dcully
    Moderators, Computer Games Moderators Posts: 14,707 Mod ✭✭✭✭Dcully


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120868178#Comment_120868178

    Plenty more places to find it apart from twitter if you bother.



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    #1225
    CrowdedHouse
    Registered Users Posts: 6,838 ✭✭✭CrowdedHouse


    Slightly OT for the cross fans 😁


    https://twitter.com/cyclocross24/status/1681369688607973376?s=20


    Seven Worlds will Collide



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    #1226
    cunavalos
    Registered Users Posts: 1,387 ✭✭✭cunavalos


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120868041#Comment_120868041

    Slightly off topic, and this data is five years old but surprising to see the genealogy of professional cycling teams.

    World-Tour-Name-Changes.jpg

    There are a few more name changes to add to the list and only a couple of drop outs ( although you have to take into account dimension data is now technically Q36.5).

    Add to that many of the additions to this list Cofidis are nearly 30 years old and probably the oldest single named sponsor. The likes of Arkea, Intermarche and Alpecin are upgraded version of continental teams over a decade old.

    BMC and Katusha are the only permanent departures from the list and Tinkoff-Saxo ( Team CSC et al.) must have only recently folded prior to 2018.



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    #1227
    billyhead
    Registered Users Posts: 9,793 ✭✭✭billyhead


    You will always have doubts at the back of your mind about today's performance. It's normal with the history of this sport.



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    #1228
    Daroxtar
    Registered Users Posts: 4,333 ✭✭✭Daroxtar


    Le Planche De Belle Fille 2020

    Pogacar > Richie Porte/Tom Dumoulin: 2.2s/km


    Combloux 2023

    Pogacar > WVA: 3.3s/km

    Vingegaard >Pogacar: 4.4s/km

    Vingegaard > WVA: 7.6s/km



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    #1229
    happytramp
    Registered Users Posts: 2,611 ✭✭✭happytramp


    That last one definitely feels the most shocking.



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    #1230
    Mefistofelino
    Registered Users Posts: 1,792 ✭✭✭Mefistofelino


    What incentive does WVA have to go deep, though?. He knows he's not going to win the stage or move on to the podium. It makes sense for Vingo and Pog, or Yates and Rodriguez to go all-in, but Wout? I don't see him destroying himself on this one.



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    #1231
    MangleBadger
    Registered Users Posts: 529 ✭✭✭MangleBadger


    WVA was 20 seconds back on Cavagna by T2 and finished 15s ahead. Cavagna finished in 6th between the 2 Yates brothers. WVA is a far better TTer than Cavagna. This TT had more metres elevation per k than PdBF. It was a pure climbers TT. I think Pog had a fine TT. Nobody else had a great TT (maybe Pedersen)

    Jonas was lifting the entire route. His speed and cornering on the descent was unreal. You could see the difference v Pogacar. Nobody expected him to put that much time in to Pog but I don’t his performance is that ludicrous.



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