Rugby Championship 2023

AbusesToilets

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120912214#Comment_120912214

Well no, in much the same way as the score in the 1st test in NZ wasn't a full reflection of the Irish team. Other, more capable teams, will have noted NZ's difficultly in dealing with the direct carrying from Australia at times.

lawrencesummers

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120912283#Comment_120912283

The direct carrying that yielded one solitary score over 80 minutes?

irelandrover

This is a tough call. Blocked the ball but caught him on the follow through

AbusesToilets

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120912481#Comment_120912481

Missing my point, but anyways.

Nasty hit there, very reminiscent of Stander's incident.

fitz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120912497#Comment_120912497

If he'd not managed to make contact with the ball, he was gone. Still question if there's a duty of care there. Wouldn't have been surprised to see it treated as dangerous play.

Dave_The_Sheep

Feels wrong that that's not a red card, regardless of the ball contact.

fitz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120912526#Comment_120912526

Yeah, it can see why it wasn't, but I'd have no really issue if it had been. That's some impact to the head.

naughtyboy

Straight red, dangerous play. Very bad call.

It's open season on players kicking the ball If that's not dangerous play.

pickarooney

'Djulyun Montozha' is going to annoy me no end.

PTH2009

Would they not of just had another round of games next week given its it's same match ups next weekend as today

Dave_The_Sheep

Shades of ROG 2009 there. No contest.

AbusesToilets

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120912518#Comment_120912518

Yea, like it's a straight red if he hadn't blocked the ball.

fitz

SA really don't deserve that. Pumas forcing it and gift a physical but very ordinary looking SA side a more comfortable lead.

pickarooney

Argentina utterly toothless in the opposition 22. Constantly going backwards

fitz

Really hate the constant playing of a few seconds of music during every damn break in play. Just STFU.

fitz

Argentina could really have won that game. Neither side impressive.

AbusesToilets

Neither of these teams looked any great shakes. Surprised by how poor the Argentinan forwards were carrying. Their backs had some nice moves though

ersatz

Bad as Argentina are if they had a kicker they would have won that comfortably. De Allende's standard for Munster seems to be his standard. That said SA's defence was a lot stronger today, maybe that's down to Argentina not have the brains in mid field but SA really strangled them in their own 22 for the last half hour.

Dave_The_Sheep

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120913006#Comment_120913006

Should.

Shehal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120912497#Comment_120912497

The big difference was Stander didnt have a realistic chance of charging down Lambie's kick successfully so was deemed reckless. Its unfortunate what happened but ultimately the Argentine player had a legitimate chance of charging down the ball and was successful so I dont really see how there is foul play, its very unfortunate what happened but sadly that's just how the game goes.

What I do find interesting is how the same fans who were angry that Freddie Steward got a red card against Ireland for a "rugby incident" now want the Argentine player sent off...

AbusesToilets

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120914913#Comment_120914913

I don't know, it doesn't sit right that there's no repercussion for knocking out a player. I could see an argument that the Argie player acted recklessly in his otherwise legal act.

Shehal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120914928#Comment_120914928

It doesn't sit right but ultimately before a card can be issued the referee have to decide whether there has been foul play and reality is there has been as he successfully charged the ball down so you cant really say there was.

The other issue I have is if that is penalised you might get more players looking to get hit in those situation in order to buy a penalty of a card for the opposition (obviously not what Williams was doing but you know there will be a few sneaking buggers out there that may try although not as dangerously as this incident).

theVersatile

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120914928#Comment_120914928

The problem here is you can't referee based on outcome. If Williams hadn't been knocked up and sprung back to his feet A-okay, would it warrant the same sanction as you are proposing?

Outcome is irrelevant in the current rules. Whether that should be changed is a different philosophical discussion.

I'm in two minds about it still tbh (which makes the outrage I see about it being an "obvious red" all the more silly for me personally) - but I'd have probably given no penalty.

On a different note, it's fascinating how some of the South African "defend the referees" crowd on Twitter have changed their tune the second a decision goes against them.

AbusesToilets

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120915448#Comment_120915448

In no other context would clear contact with the head go unpenalized. We see any number of well intentioned tackle efforts be called. Why is this treated any differently? The outcome of the charge down entirely dictated Brace's decision.

Podge_irl

High tackles have successfully tackled the player yet are penalised, I'm not sure what difference it being a successful chargedown is supposed to make.

Anyway, he has been cited so we shall see the outcome, but I expect a few weeks ban.

Yeah_Right

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120915668#Comment_120915668

Tackler puts his head on the wrong side, gets a knee and gets knocked out. Clear head contact, is that penalised? Tackler gets a shoulder to the face from the ball carrier, clear head contact. Is that penalised?

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120919506#Comment_120919506

Both of these are examples of the tackler putting themselves in the wrong position though. In this case the incident was very much caused by the Argentine player.

A better comparison would be the (admittedly absurdly uncited) POC kick to the head of Dave Kearney. Just cause he made contact with the ball did that make it ok?

AbusesToilets

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120919506#Comment_120919506

As said below, that's not a comparable situation. It's more akin to a player mistiming a jump to compete for a ball, and causing the other player to land dangerously. Genuine attempt at a legal challenge, but reckless in execution.

Mallia cited there, so we'll see what comes from it.

Yeah_Right

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120919547#Comment_120919547

Yeah that might be a better example. I was just pointing out that there are situations where there is clear head contact that knocks a player out that go unpenalised.

It will be interesting to see the outcome of the citing. My first thought on seeing it was it was just like the Stander incident (which I don't think should have been a red) but then I saw he got the ball. So it's a legit rugby move but it endangered another player. So I don't know.

Brief_Lives

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120919850#Comment_120919850

I thought it was a legitimate challenge, with an unfortunate outcome for the other player.

Rugby is a phycal game, this was just a rugby incident. If this results in a ban, i think the game as we know it is screwed.

We can't be an outcome based, decision game.