Hollywood on strike

Overheal

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/media-titan-barry-diller-delivers-doomsday-forecast-for-hollywood-actor-and-writer-strikes-could-lead-to-the-absolute-collapse-of-an-entire-industry/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_SAG-AFTRA_strike

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Writers_Guild_of_America_strike

The Directors Guild took a deal last month (IMHO no surprise, fewer of them and a top pay group):

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/business/business-news/directors-guild-deal-details-members-1235510535/

2 days ago the Screen Actors Guild joined the Writers Guild. It looks like it has taken a nasty turn recently too, beginning with some execs reportedly suggesting they wouldn't return to the negotiating table for months, after members of those guilds begin 'losing their houses' which elicited a viral reaction or two from celebs:

https://www.mediaite.com/online/be-careful-motherfcker-ron-perlman-threatens-studio-exec-who-hopes-hollywood-strike-drags-on-in-now-deleted-instagram-rant/

“Listen to me, motherfuckers, there’s a lot of ways to lose your house,” The Hellboy actor told his followers. “Some of it is financial, some of it is karma, and some of it is just figuring out who the **** said that. And we know who said that and where he **** lives.”

He added, “There’s a lot of ways to lose your house. You wish that on people, you wish that families starve, while you’re making $27 **** million a year for creating nothing? Be careful, motherfucker. Be really careful, ’cause that’s the kind of **** that stirs **** up.”

It looks like the fall lineup for most people whether you watch in the US or Sky or whatever is going to be pretty messed up, beloved IPs might hit the chopping block (Disney is already reporting scaling back of it's Star Wars, Avatar and Marvel activity). there might even be a recession/correction of the hollywood industry; this is all after all around the COVID/Post COVID pivot to majority streaming vs. AAA cinema, cinemas are still struggling for their numbers again etc. and the pricing for tickets is becoming absurd, customers don't want this hassle; there's a bubble going to burst seemingly on the horizon, $1Bn spectacles like Avengers Endgame, Avatar, etc. aren't going to be the norm again for a while. No idea how long this strike will go on for

Blarney_man

I love this topic. I'm huge fan of all late late shows, it's fun, that's all. I just can't believe it is going for this long, it seems that writers were making handy money if they can last this long. They also might've pivoted to stand up and all, but I was only expecting 2-3 weeks of down time, it goes forever now.

greencap

oh no, there might not be a fast and the furious 29.

and no more films which end in -man.

StevenToast

Wont someone please think of the actors😪

beastfromtheEast

I hope She Hulk season 2 is not impacted.

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120859731#Comment_120859731

It's hard to summon a lot of sympathy for them I know but in fairness the studios are even worse and have a pretty nasty end game in mind.

Most of modern cinema and TV is dreadful, maybe we'll see something better being produced once this is dealt with? Wishful thinking I know.

screamer

This is wonderful news, hopefully they’ll boycott all the annual slap each other on the back award ceremonies for pretenders. They’re a truly jumped up bunch of a……. Listers.

Cpxxc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120860797#Comment_120860797

Reality is that beyond the 'stars' most actors and frankly writers barely make a living. It's gratifying that the stars are standing up for the the lesser paid people who quite honestly keep the studios in profit.

I've worked in the business. I'd have starved if I depended on the income I got for my work.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120860535#Comment_120860535

The finale of which bizarrely highlighted the problem, the industry was so bloated with CGI and recycled 3 act plots that people were burning out of it.

Varik

There isn't a chance in hell of the studios agreeing to anything that'll restrict them too much with AI, they're terrified of being on the back foot again as they were with streaming. The steaming platforms doubly so. None of them want to bind themselves to something that'll put them at a disadvantage to future competitors.

Directors were never at risk, an AI isn't culpable when things go wrong. Oh no things are going wrong quick better swap the manager, might not fix anything but does buy some time and direct the boards/shareholders' ire elsewhere.

It'll end like sags-aftra strike against video game companies, they'll reword the rejected agreement and add in a bit of pabulum that doesn't mean anything while ignoring all the big asks they had aren't anywhere to be seen and then claim victory.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120860980#Comment_120860980

And that's the crux of the issue; while big-name actors/writers might be on the picket lines even though they earn millions and millions, they're not striking for them, they're striking for everyone below them, of which there are a far greater number who earn a pittance. There are plenty of stories going about including from the cast of Orange Is The New Black, one of Netflix's most popular shows ever, where more people were watching it than Game Of Thrones, and many of the main actors still needed a part-time job in between seasons to stay afloat, and their residuals are barely worth the paper they're printed on because streaming sites can hide viewership numbers.

Add in that studios now want to scan background actors and own their likeness in perpetuity, how studios want to reduce the number of writers in writers rooms by using AI and having writers just modify the work by an AI, studios want to be able to use AI to digitally recreate peoples faces and voices.... it's f*cking horrible.

The big Hollywood A-Listers are part of a union. They're not out picketing and protesting because their summer house needs another wing, they're doing it to support everyone in the union, which includes small background actors in TV shows, writers on kids TV shows, and even the next generation of writers and actors who will be trying to get a job in the industry and make a liveable wage.

Boiling the discussion down to what A-listers earn is just nonsense, and even then doesn't counter the insane wages studio execs are on or the billions in profits they make.

You also can't decry the actors/writers and then complain about how generic or repetitive a lot of their output is. A lot of that comes from the studios who see things that other people have been successful with, and then specifically hire writers and actors to do a similar thing to that. And secondly, what do you think AI will do? AI can't create something new, it can only take what existing information has already been fed into it, take the prompts you give it, smash it all together and regurgitate out something. It has no concept of quality, of flow, of cadence, of how an audience might understand it, of how an audience might relate to it, it can't draw from its own experiences, it can't describe a scene it sees in its mind.

The writers and actors unions are completely correct to try and put a strong limit on these things now before they go any further, and to ensure writers and actors at the lowest levels can earn a fair wage. Otherwise if you think what Hollywood currently puts out is a load of crud, we would be in for far, far worse.

Astartes

Oh no America's biggest propaganda outlet is in chassis.. oh nooo.. Think of the child actors etc etc

Overheal

Signs of a Hollywood correction (also imprecise to call it Hollywood when a lot of it happens in Georgia these days)

https://www.ign.com/articles/avengers-star-mark-ruffalo-suggests-alternative-to-studio-system-amid-sag-aftra-strike?utm_source=twitter

NSAman

Hollywood has been on strike for years!

nothing original just churn out crap over and over.

when was the last time a movie with a decent plot ‘ story line came out that was purely about the story and not the “stars”?

silliussoddius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120862985#Comment_120862985

Indie’s don’t exactly set the box office on fire, so where will the money come from to pay a living wage?

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120863049#Comment_120863049

I kind of agree. While I'd love to see it, it's a bit idealistic. While there are obviously so many ways now to get your content out there and advertise it, the issue the industry is already facing now is so many different streaming services now pushing people back towards piracy.

By the time you set up any sort of independent platform & create and make content for it, both strikes could be over. And even then, it becomes another platform that people have to sign up to, pay for content, that will likely lead to piracy (which would be far more detrimental to an indie platform).

But the thing with indies is, they obviously don't cost nearly as much as other films, and often big stars (such as Ruffalo) will take a fairly minimum wage if they believe in the film, and to not be stuck doing green screen CGI-fests. As much as I do love the Marvel films and stuff, and as much as the actors seem to have a great time making them and have fun with the films, I'm sure a lot of them would relish being able to make smaller, more personal stuff, having already made their fat pay packages with the big-budget stuff.

titan18

Tbf the stuff about AI and the proposals the studios want to do with background actors and extra definitely deserve to be striked over. Sure, Jennifer Lawrence or Tom Cruise don't need more money, but some actor only getting paid 100 dollars and the studio getting to keep his likeness and re-use it over and over again for nothing is ridiculous. It's cartoonishly evil and deserves to be pushed back on.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120863222#Comment_120863222

The only reason for it I can think of, is if that background actor eventually goes on to be successful, then some of these studios already have full scans of their likeness and probably enough voice samples to essentially replicate them. Throw them in as a minor character where the uncanny valley might not be as noticeable (eg. someone on a screen or a hologram).

I mean, why take scans of background actors, since you'll still need physical people to actually be the background actors and paste that likeness onto? The only reason you'd need to own a background actor's likeness in perpetuity and be able to use it without any consent or compensation, is for future-proofing in case that actor becomes successful. I really struggle to think of any non-scummy reason for it.

Manic Moran

The only issue I agree with the strikers over is, indeed, the 'use of likeness' thing. The rest.... well, outside of Maverick and Super Mario Bros, I've not seen a movie I truly enjoyed in quite a few years. Maybe AI could actually do a better job than the humans if that's what they're coming out with.

Though in fairness, I am kindof curious about Oppenheimer.

gmisk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120863321#Comment_120863321

You must have missed the masterpiece blackbird! Who needs Hollywood...

I thought Maverick was excellent bit of popcorn fun, Super Marios Bros not so much.

The new mission impossible is good as was the most recent John wick. But probably the best film I saw in cinema this year Spider-man: across the spider-verse.

Rye Lane excellent little rom com too and on Disney+

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120863321#Comment_120863321

It's more than just movies though, it's also all TV, and there have been some amazing TV shows over the last number of years, both on TV stations and streaming services.

gmisk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120859720#Comment_120859720

No Spider-Man : across the spider-verse sequel? That would be a shame.

I have literally seen one fast and the furious film, dreadful.

Overheal

Apparently slightly different edits of across the spiderverse were played at various theaters, so depending on where you went to see it you saw some easter eggs, gags and even a few lines that were different to someone who saw it in another screen, clever and meta idea given the synopsis of the film but no doubt expensive to pull off.

https://www.cinemablend.com/superheroes/spider-man/spider-man-across-the-spider-verse-editor-multiple-versions-movie-playing-theaters

What kills me lately is the number of projects that seemed to just be getting killed left and right as tax writeoffs, but then they go ahead with bombs you could see from 300 miles away like The Flash. It's definitely an industry going through a lot of ****.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120863371#Comment_120863371

Maverick looks like people would enjoy it. I'm not personally into Cruise's films though enough to see them in cinemas or anything given he donates truckloads of money to Scientology.

Varik

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120863049#Comment_120863049

So not about indie's in particular but read a few articles in the last year, talking about a certain type of movie and naming the them different things in each article with some of them were called prestige films, but don't think that fits as they'd nowhere near the scale of the old swords and sandal prestige pictures.

I'll go with the Oscar bait tag as it generally fits.

low to moderate budgets, and just bombing so badly. Only works when you've the studio to bankroll it to keep people happy so they keep making the stuff that actually makes money.

Most of them blaming post covid, streaming, and people only venturing out to big screens for big spectacles.

silliussoddius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120863371#Comment_120863371

Blackbird was great, but the problem with streaming is you don’t have the week long wait between episodes like back in the day so content needs to be cranked out faster. I’m not sure if constant content (made by people paid more I’m assuming) can be made, throw in the Blitzscaling approach of companies over the last few years and I think there will be a crunch there also.

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120863321#Comment_120863321

AI would only be used to push out more of the same crap.

Studios are the reason movies have been terrible for the last decade or so, they're the ones cranking out endless superhero movies because money.

Studios using AI to create product will result in even worse borefests than we've grown accustomed to.

Studios want to have complete control much like labels have had in the music industry for the last decade and a half, we've seen the results with music in that time, bland boring goop where talent used to exist, movies have been similar for a while but they'll be a dead industry much like music if this goes unchallenged.

gmisk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120863754#Comment_120863754

I was being a bit sarcastic (blackbird is also an awful film with Michael Flatley).

Black Bird is on apple they only released the first two episodes initially, then new episodes weekly. They do similar that with a lot of theirs (e.g. hijack).

Buy yeah Netflix (quantity over quality at this stage..) and others dump things all in one go mostly.

Beta Ray Bill

This happens every few years it would seem.

The reality is that the age of the super hero movie is coming to an end. Disney and Warner have squeezed every last drop out Marvel and DC in the last 10 years or so and there's basically nothing left.

Top grossing movies of the last 10 years:

Avengers: Endgame (Disney)

Star Wars: Episode VII (Disney)

Avengers: Infinity War (Disney)

Spider-Man: No Way Home (Disney/Sony)

Jurassic World (Universal)

The Lion King (Disney)

The Avengers (Disney)

Furious 7 (Universal)

Top Gun: Maverick (Paramount)

Frozen II (Disney)

Disney absolutely dominate now, but all the movies above are 100% "hyper" fantasy hero movies, with not a notion of reality in any of them.

The well has run dry in that not one of those movies is an original or not a sequel.

Even if you look at the top grossing movies for 2023, there is one original, and even that was just fan service for the most part.

This kind of stagnation kind of suits the studios as they can pump the brand for money at the expense of creativeness and new ideas, it's terrible for actors and writers though that are not already in the brand.

I think the age of the Toy/Computer Game character is approaching though (Mario, Sonic, Barbie, etc)

bloopy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120860535#Comment_120860535

I doubt it.

I don't think it used writers or actors.

ZookeeperDub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120866232#Comment_120866232

Disney is losing million, 900m or so at last count. The new range of live action films are a disaster. If I am watching a film I put on the original. The new Snow White and 7 dwarfs is now Snow white and 7 politically correct men.

The multiple streaming services are eating each other and for a while now it is waiting to go bang. Who will survive? somehow I doubt Disney+ will. They will end up flogging it catalogue back to Netflix or something along the lines of that

Expect 1-2 major online stream companies to go bang, people are investing but no profits so once they look for the profits it will go pear shaped.

The market of streaming needs to consolidate, the push back into the cinema needs to happen to push all the money back into the films.

Beta Ray Bill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120866361#Comment_120866361

This is another valid point you're making which actually backs up my point about them squeezing and squeezing.

Ant-Man Quantumania came out on the 16th of Feb 2023, and on the 17th of May (13 weeks) it was available on Disney+

Like how can the cinema survive if this is the turn around time for a movie to make it to a streaming platform. (I don't go anymore as I just wait for it to come out on Disney+) GOTG V3 is out on the 2nd of August (again 13 weeks roughly from release date)

They are pumping the crap out of it.

I do not think Disney+ will go though, if you have kids, you'll know why.

The Walt Disney Company is Up not down at the moment there's more to the movie industry than just movies unfortunately (Toys, Sponsors, Partnerships, etc... they make incredible money)