RWC 2023 Ireland v South Africa Buildup - Sat 23rd Sep 20:00 Paris

Jacovs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121127960#Comment_121127960

From a purely selfish point of view, I would also like a SA vs Ireland final.

From an impartial point of view I would probably like to see 2 teams play each other in the final who didnt during the tournament already.

Either way, if SA gets knocked out at any stage im cheering for Ireland the rest of the way, if they are still in it.

Pete_Cavan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121128403#Comment_121128403

It is insane that the two top ranked teams in the world meet in the group and that both will likely progress regardless of the result. Same with France v NZ on opening night, which was a damp squib.

Hopefully we get a belter this weekend, both teams will be going all out to win but they'll know that losing isn't the end of the road, you don't win WCs in the pool. There's a reasonable chance of an Ireland v SA final in which case this game will likely see a whole lot of spice added.

Pete_Cavan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121127968#Comment_121127968

I don't think Sheehan or Conan should be involved this weekend, not a game to be coming into after a month on the sideline. AF when with first choice players available v Romania and Tonga to build continuity, don't see him now throwing in players who were injured with little preparation. Start them against Scotland instead.

Agree about JOB, given his versatility he could yet play an important role in this campaign so I think he should be kept fully primed.

ersatz

On the relative preparation of the teams I guess to depends on how long you think is relevant, but the list of Ireland's run of victories is strong enough over the last year. Its been fascinating to observe how some players have seemingly gone off the boil (VDF, JGP, Furlong, Lowe) while others have hit the form of their lives (Bundee, Beirne, Sexton, Murray, Herring, Hansen). I'm not suggesting the former aren't playing well, rather just not making headlines in the way they were at the start of this list. Partly they've been overshadowed by how well some of the others have stepped up more recently. Honestly, it would have been hard a year ago to wish for this team to be a better position coming into this game.

NZ x 2

SA

Fiji

Aus

Wales

FR

Italy

Scotland

Eng

Itally

England

Samoa

Romania

Tonga

pickarooney

Ireland v France is the dream final for me for several reasons.

Clegg

Given Joe McCarthy's lack of involvement against Tonga I guess there's a good chance he makes the 23 for the South Africa game. I've been impressed by all 4 locks in our opening matches so we've a good selection to choose from.

Jacovs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121128425#Comment_121128425

Then looking at SA's last 15 games (from oldest to most recent):

Win vs Aus

Win vs Arg

Win vs Arg

Lost vs Ire by 3 points away

Lost vs France by 4 points away

Win vs Italy

Win vs England

Win vs Aus

Lost vs NZ by 15 points away

Win vs Arg

Win vs Arg

Win vs Wales

Win vs NZ

Win vs Scotland

Win vs Romania

Yeah this game should've been the final really.

If we do beat Ireland in this game, then I wont mind a SA vs France final for some payback. (Although this would mean France beating Ireland in quarter finals, and id like Ireland to get past that mental hurdle at least if they dont make it to the final).

If we lose to Ireland in this game then a SA vs Ireland final is top of the list, payback is back on the table.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121128541#Comment_121128541

Joe Mc is an interesting one. Definitely showed up well in the warm ups but we've questioned the opposition to a degree so whether he can deliver like that in a pressure cooker like next weekend against an in form top side is still uncertain to me. I think a lot of people thought he was a 'player for the future' selection in the larger squads but as serious world cup contenders I don't think we've made any calls of that nature with the 33. He's there on merit so has a chance to start but I'd be surprised if he's in the starting 15 - as he'd be displacing a proven experienced test player and I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't make the bench as he'd be displacing a proven experienced test player.

Beirne / Ryan has delivered for us in the big games and are a balanced pairing in the second row. I don't think you can take Beirne out of the starting 15 so you're likely talking about dropping POM or VDF to the bench in effect for Joe Mc. Not sure I see that happening this weekend but given the versatility of our backrow there might be some compelling stats which will steer the selection.

ionadnapokot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121127484#Comment_121127484

Is that a concern for this Springbok side? It usually never happens (2017 38v3 loss in Lansdowne aside).

I'd be interested to get a SA take on the drop off from Etzebeth.

kuang1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121128720#Comment_121128720

They said on against the head last night that he's available for selection for Saturday.

kuang1

No whisperings about Bealham anyone?

Jacovs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121128720#Comment_121128720

Dont even mention that 2017 game. My parents came over to visit and we went to that game. Still havent gotten our refunds from SARU.

I mean the actual physical fight, because lets face it, theres going to be one, like the scuffle in the Scotland game where he was involved. Especially if SA is trailing by a significant margin in the last 20 minutes. But Etzebeth has been a very good boy the last couple years, even if teams set out to antagonize him.

Maybe thats his problem. He has to keep his emotions under control, and its affecting his game. He needs that fire in him to bring his A game, and if he is picked for this weekend then he might need to bring that fire. Just stop himself this side of a yellow card...

Jacovs

And on the side lines to this game, for an extra dimension:

https://www.news24.com/sport/rugby/worldcup/rassie-pours-cold-water-on-rumours-of-ireland-move-i-am-not-following-jacques-20230919

SA team announcement tonight at 19:00 SA time.

leakyboots

Absolute horseplay and carnage levels to go through the roof when we win

https://twitter.com/haribaldijones/status/1703033093680988525?t=bpS-GHGMwWgvbs2Lid1SJQ&s=19

pickarooney

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121128746#Comment_121128746

He got fairly wound up against Lyon last year.

Jacovs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121129006#Comment_121129006

Not familiar with the incident.

Looking at his record, his last Yellow Card was on 24 September 2021 vs Argentina, and before that a YC on 25 August 2018, also against Argentina.

Thats not bad going for someone with his reputation.

pickarooney

Yeah, in fairness he doesn't get caught much and still manages to leave an impression. He got annoyed at being dumped on his arse by a winger and threw in a dig on the ground.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1530433143370547202

Cracking tackle by the Georgian

https://twitter.com/i/status/1530291993900892160

Paul Smeenus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121128831#Comment_121128831

These lads all work in a start-up with Jamie.

Jacovs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121129079#Comment_121129079

Yeah that was a bit of dirty revenge, id say he doesnt get dumped like that often and didnt like it very much.

Only thing that saved him from a Yellow or even Red is it doesnt look like he made direct/first contact with the other player's head and clearly wrapped and took the guy with him over the side.

We need him on the edge like that, just not at another player's expense (injury). Tough and hard, so the other players know the next morning they played a game of rugby the night before.

pc7

Head says Ireland, heart says Irelands, scars from World Cups past say who knows. Just hope we do it and no major injuries. I think and hope we will play clever and fast. Its going to be a cracker of a game. I've tickets for both QF's and just want us there and beyond.

ionadnapokot

edit

ionadnapokot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121128746#Comment_121128746

SA weren't a united side that day! Marx, Mboambi, Kitshoff, Etzebeth, de Jager, Kolisi, du Toit, de Allende, Kriel all played.

Yes I agree tensions will be high. I'm hoping there will be a kerfuffle....or two! Just to add to the excitement.

I have allot of respect for SA rugby players. Unfortunately Erasmus has made this side very easy to dislike - to paraphrase the great Jon Smit.

“They are not softies. They’re not like Ireland. They’re not like England, who goes away. They are tough f*****s.” - Erasmus 19' RWC Semi-Final

ionadnapokot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121128738#Comment_121128738

We would be naive to take anything that Erasmus or Nienaber say at face value!

I do think he'll play all the same.

mr_edge_to_you

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121128831#Comment_121128831

You spelt cornage wrong

Shehal

Even if Etzebeth isnt fit to play I believe if there is even a small chance he his fit to play, personally just from looking at him and what those in the know have been saying I'd say he is, he'll be named tonight and given every chance to prove his fitness. He's simply too important to SA to leave out especially with Lood de Jager out they just dont have someone of similar calibre who can fulfil his role. Snyman obvious is class but he's not in the same mould.

Jacovs

Tonight seems fairly early to be announcing a team for a saturday game, isnt it?

If Etzebeth was touch and go I wouldve thought they would wait another day or as long as possible to announce the team to give him every chance.

Announcement tonight means either he is already good to go, or they already know he will be out for another week, so no reason to wait.

Are there any rules on them including him in the team if he is still not recovered, and then replacing him on the day before the game starts?

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121129625#Comment_121129625

Or he's not going to be available, but by naming him early they hope that Ireland prep in a particular way only for them to announce a change at the last minute even though they've been training that way all week.

Silly Buggers is what Rassie does.

They can claim they were "giving him all the time they could"

Jacovs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121129733#Comment_121129733

Hence me asking the question, if there are any rules around that. Obviously people get injured and need to be replaced last minute, but if a player was already injured then maybe there are certain rules around it? Idk, asking the question.

molloyjh

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121129806#Comment_121129806

Not as far as I know. Matt O’Connor used to play those kinds of “tricks” at Leinster years ago. We’d see a player named and pretty much know that he’d be replaced shortly before kick off with someone else. I bloody hated it as a Leinster fan, but it happened a good few times. So it must be legal.

ionadnapokot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121129806#Comment_121129806

Happens all the time. Once a player is in the squad he can be named and subsequently replaced at the whim of the coach.

Its in the spirit of the game not to do this of course.

cson

Lol the spirit of the game and Rassie complement each other about as well as orange juice and toothpaste.

pickarooney

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121129625#Comment_121129625

AFAIK the boks have a rule that if you're not training on Monday you're not playing at the weekend. Of course, players can get injured later in the week and the roster changed but it's fixed by Tuesday and they prefer to release it themselves than have it leaked.

techdiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121128741#Comment_121128741

https://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby-world-cup/2023/0919/1406126-conan-bealham-sheehan/

Conan, Bealham and Sheehan took part in training today anyway.

Cookiemunster

According to Cian Tracey, Conan is training, but isn't in full training with the team.

https://twitter.com/CianTracey1/status/1704134082169565273

Jacovs

Cheers for the replies. Another 3 hours and we will find out.

Any word on when the Irish team will be announced?

Edit to add, far as I can tell from this article, SA will be playing in their 2nd alternate kit, shown in the article also.

https://www.news24.com/sport/rugby/worldcup/springboks-to-wear-white-in-crucial-ireland-clash-were-getting-on-with-the-job-20230919

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121130473#Comment_121130473

Yeah.. The all-white one will be a better contrast. The other one was just a little bit too samey with the current Irish jersey colour.

Hermy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121128526#Comment_121128526

Recently discovered my birth father is French, and a rugby fan to boot, so that would be wonderful!

Cookiemunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121130473#Comment_121130473

Most likely Thursday afternoon for the Ireland team.

Jacovs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121130566#Comment_121130566

Wonder if having 2 extra days will influence their selection at all.

Quin_Dub

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121130585#Comment_121130585

Highly unlikely - Ireland always announce the team 48hrs before kick-off unless obligated otherwise.

SA though tend to announce the teams earlier - Gatland used to do it to.

DGRulz

Farrell's first couple of team announcements were announced early in the week but for whatever reason they slipped back to Thursdays. The squad generally know from Tuesday if I'm not mistaken?

standardg60

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121130501#Comment_121130501

And there i was looking forward to saying the Boks look jaded at some point :-)

Pudsy33

They'Ve gone 7-1, I really don't get it.

Jacovs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121130941#Comment_121130941

Still be wearing jade shorts and bit of jade in the socks.

Hoping by the end of the game I can say the Irish look green with jealousy.

All_in_Flynn

Really hope we stick to our guns and go with the 5-3 split here.

Jacovs

7/1 is back! Springboks shock with seven forwards on bench for crunch Ireland World Cup clash https://www.news24.com/sport/rugby/worldcup/71-is-back-springboks-shock-with-seven-forwards-on-bench-for-crunch-ireland-world-cup-clash-20230919

Very risky, maybe too risky. I dont like.

Neil3030

Calling it now, Eben's not fit and Pollard replaces him in the 23 by kickoff to move things around to a 6-2 bench.

Jump_In_Jack

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121130980#Comment_121130980

Willemse covering out-half, Colby covering fullback, and Smith covering centre.

Mbonambi will probably play the full 80, Kleyn and Snyman cover lock, and Fourie and Van Staden cover loose forwards.

It’s a gamble but could pay off.

there’s also the chance that Etzebeth could be pulled at short notice and replaced with Pollard, with Snyman starting and Pollard to the bench.

Jacovs

Yeah Kwagga Smith was a 7's player, and although he plays flanker or 8th man, I seem to remember he was used in the back line during some game when someone got injured. But id rather it didnt get to that point.

DGRulz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121131007#Comment_121131007

Given that Rassie said he wasn't gonna go 7-1, that Even was fit and Pollard wasn't gonna play and given that he's just named a 7-1 split, it's probably only a matter of time before the other two happen.