The Hurt Locker: Ireland v South Africa. Saturday 23rd September. Stade DeFrance

Sanjuro · 25-09-2023 11:33am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154002#Comment_121154002

If they know how to do it, why don't the ever do it?

FrancieBrady · 25-09-2023 11:42am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121153858#Comment_121153858

I would be loathe to criticise a game manager of the calibre of Sexton but I think when the dust settles what will be worrying SA more is that if Sexton had elected to take the points on offer and if we had scored that knock-on SA may have been looking at a bit of a rout.

Had we racked up more points earlier we would have had the confidence to play with a bit more creativity and freedom. The dodgy line-out snuffed all of that out and the line-out IMO failed from our own incompetence/confusion rather than anything SA were doing.

25-09-2023 11:46am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154002#Comment_121154002

Nienaber said the same about us, as did Rassie I think. They know how to beat Ireland, and what Ireland will bring. Yes we might offer pockets of innovation but they know the players and the formations and general philosophy of Ireland and what you can do to counter us.

The problem isn't know - it's doing. It's very hard to stop Ireland imposing their game plan, that's why were such contenders.

ionadnapokot · 25-09-2023 11:48am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121153971#Comment_121153971

Defined by key failures

Its a good way of summing it up.

77' mins 5m scrum to Ireland. Even if Ireland didn't win that penalty for 13-8 Ireland could have scored off that scrum 15/17 v 8) or at the very least saw the game out in the SA 22.

Ifs and buts.....but I dont believe that IF SA scored their kicks they would have won the game. Its too simplistic and I think Ireland would have found a way to win.

Cookiemunster · 25-09-2023 11:54am

If Faf has scored the pen that hit the post, they wouldn't have scored their try as it came from the next phase of play. That would have been 1 kick scored for 3 points rather than two kicks missed for 5. It actually worked out better for them that Faf hit the post.

aidanodr · 25-09-2023 11:57am

have to say I saw this and was worried .. BUT ball down/grounded before elbow .. phew :D

https://twitter.com/Coachdivvy/status/1706042768601051461

salmocab · 25-09-2023 11:58am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154198#Comment_121154198

Just on this, it annoys me when people get caught up with counting things like missed kicks etc. if one of those kicks goes over it’s a different restart and everything after that moment is different. You can argue a last minute kick to win would have changed the result easily but things early on in the game going different alter the rest of the match.

terrarev · 25-09-2023 12:05pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154002#Comment_121154002

Knowing how to beat Ireland and being good enough to do it are different things.

Dont Be at It · 25-09-2023 12:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154166#Comment_121154166

Yeah, wouldn't disagree hugely on the penalties bit. Two of them were tough kicks as well.

Very little between the teams and thankfully we came in the right side of it. Great game.

TRC10 · 25-09-2023 12:19pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121153314#Comment_121153314

And bar Sheehan, none of them will

molloyjh · 25-09-2023 12:37pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121150263#Comment_121150263

We absolutely were not saying 2019 would be different. At most we may have said 2011 and 2015 would be different, but from recollection we were very nervous about 2015 because of all the injuries. And in 2011 we didn’t exactly have a QF hoodoo over us then as we hadn’t even made the QF in 2007 and weren’t contenders before then at all.

Heres some actual facts that might shine a different light on things. In the two RWCs where we had a big pool stage win (2011 vs Australia and 2015 vs France), how do we compare to where we are now:

Now:

Grand Slam Champions
Ranked number 1 in the world
Have beaten everyone worth mentioning at least once in the last 18 months and gone unbeaten for 13 games coming into the tournament.
Have won a big pool game
Have been comfortable in all other games we have played in the RWC.

2011:

Had a poor 6Ns where 1 good performance against England was all we had to cheer about.
Were ranked 8th in the world.
Barely scraped past Italy and Scotland in the 6Ns, had lost to Australia, SA, NZ, France and Wales in the previous 18 months and had never beaten NZ. We went into the tournament winning just 4 of the 15 games we’d played in the previous 18 months.
Had won a big pool game against Australia.
Struggled more than we should have against Italy and, especially, the USA in the pools.

2015:

Were 6Ns champions.
Were ranked 6th in the world.
Had beaten SA, Australia, France and England in the previous 18 months, but had also lost to Wales and still had yet to ever beat NZ. We came into the RWC off the back of 2 defeats in the warm ups and with a win rate of 11 of 14 in the previous 18 months.
Had won a big pool game against France.
Struggled more than we should have against Italy but otherwise performed well enough in the pools.

There’s no point in talking about 2011. We’re light years ahead of where we were then. We were in a good place in 2015 until we shipped a lot of injuries and lost SOB to suspension in that France game. We won the big pool match but it cost us badly.

We are in an even better place now than 2015, without doubt. And we don’t seem to have paid a price for that big pool win at all. We appear to have 33 fit and available players going into the last round of the pool stages.

If you can’t see how this year is different from the above, well then I don’t think anyone can help you at all.

molloyjh · 25-09-2023 12:48pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154207#Comment_121154207

I hope that account and that Twitter post are paid takes….

CMcsporty · 25-09-2023 12:59pm

Fair play to RG Snyman. Magnanimous In defeat.

Ireland were immense in defence

https://x.com/rterugby/status/1706264613111619811?s=46&t=LZNAt8uQdNSsqynXTsT0dw

CMcsporty · 25-09-2023 1:01pm

https://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby-world-cup/2023/0924/1407092-springboks-shocked-by-irish-breakdown-bite-snyman/

"I must say, in the 30 Tests I’ve had, that’s definitely up there. It was definitely a physical battle and they really stuck in there.”

riddles · 25-09-2023 1:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154135#Comment_121154135

Agree against top sides an early penalty an attempt at points should be taken - worst case scenario you like get possession on the restart. Should be agreed before the game to be honest.

Podge_irl · 25-09-2023 1:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154002#Comment_121154002

"They are a team we play every year (in the Six Nations) so we know how to beat them

eh.....

awec · 25-09-2023 1:20pm

One thing that does concern me, should we meet again, is the scrum. I don't think we won a scrum penalty all day from our own effort, if we got a penalty it was because of a SA technical mistake (too early, over extending etc)? Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, I was at the game and it's hard to figure out what exactly pens are for live.

The line out was a shambles, but I think largely just an off day for us there, particularly for Kelleher. I don't really understand why we didn't just call some throws to POM at the front after the 2nd or 3rd mess up, just to try get Kelleher some confidence back.

Other than that though, fantastic performance, I think outside of Kelleher you can't really pick anyone who was below their usual standard.

The call at the end was a bit lucky IMO, ball was there to be played.

Regarding Scotland, we'll batter them, I'd pick fairly strong with a view of getting a lead and then using the bench as early as possible, just to keep the momentum going. Though we should be approaching the next block with the view that we'll be playing 4 games in 4 weeks, so perhaps some rotation will happen.

Whisper it quietly, but after that result if we play to our potential then we're getting to the final. There are no teams that we can meet between now and then that can beat us at our best, and I include New Zealand in that.

FrancieBrady · 25-09-2023 1:31pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154574#Comment_121154574

Was the ball not there illegally via somebody off their feet?

AbusesToilets · 25-09-2023 1:34pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154574#Comment_121154574

I thought our scrum was fine when their LH wasn't able to bore in. Never played in the forwards, so pinch of salt etc, but I've come to the view that generally, the only reason you see a scrum dominating is because they've gotten away with skullduggery. The one where we got shattered, their LH clearly stepped out and drove across. It's on our lads to stop that. There were a good few rock solid ones in the game.

Yeah_Right · 25-09-2023 1:42pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121150622#Comment_121150622

It's a strange quirk in the laws that a player can be standing out of bounds and still score a try. Actually saw it happen in a 7s game last year. Judging by the reaction, a lot of players don't know that law.

Rigor Mortis · 25-09-2023 1:44pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154002#Comment_121154002

I love the way they've been playing the long game for the last 4 years so. Impressive to have the knowledge and the discipline not to use it for so many years as a means of gearing up for this world cup

ionadnapokot · 25-09-2023 1:59pm

Some brilliant photos in todays papers.

Burkie1203 · 25-09-2023 2:01pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154632#Comment_121154632

Yeah thats being completely ignored. SA #23 was on his knees trying to free the ball

The ball was not available to play immediately so BO'K was correct. Maul went to ground at 80.07/80.08 on clock. Ball came out 4/5 seconds later. No idea why that's such a difficult decision for people to grasp. Thought BO'K gave the boks generous enough time to get it out of there.

Sangre · 25-09-2023 2:02pm

Wish Baird wouldn’t wear such a similar scrum cap to Doris!

legend99 · 25-09-2023 2:12pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154686#Comment_121154686

I'd say a few refs don't know it either!

joseywhales · 25-09-2023 2:18pm

It must be said de allende is absolutely class, he almost single handedly wrecked our backline by just running in a straight line, he's like the terminator.