Hamas strike on Israel - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121984219#Comment_121984219

One thing I can't get over is the irony of those blindly parroting continuous and obvious lies on behalf of the Zionists referring to others as "useful idiots"

A claim of antisemitism means nothing now. The word has lost all meaning due to abuse and overuse. You will need to come up with another strategy to shut down and silence people pointing out atrocities given that logic and reason is obviously not an in any way plausible option to justify them

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121984705#Comment_121984705

It's absolutely mental that you could have an invasion of hundreds of thousands of colonial settlers, who murdered and bombed and assassinated both locals and officials, stole land and houses after murdering and pushing out the original inhabitants, then claim victimhood when neighbours aren't too fond of them.

And incredibly warped, entitled, and self-centred view.

The new neighbours here - the Murphys - forced the previous owners out of their house. Murdered a few of their kids and threw the rest on the street. These Murphys constantly harass all the other neighbours, periodically beating them up or stealing or destroying their cars. Breaking into their houses and stealing anything of value. Yet - shock horror - none of the neighbours like them. It's obviously discrimination. And therefore the Murphys are justified to not only continue as they are, but to up their attacks. Some of the neighbours have even submitted complaints to the local Gardai - which just proves their deep-rooted discrimination against the poor Murphys.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121984705#Comment_121984705

Well, certainly no worse than the Turks towards their Greek and Armenian minorities, who were robbed of their lands and possessions and forcibly displaced, with many women and children dying en-route.

Yet oddly there's no question of Christians blaming Muslims in Europe for that (like the comment above justifying antisemitic attacks in Europe by Israel's actions) so you don't see Spanish, Italian or other Christians ever attacking random Turkish familes around the world on the basis of Christian solidarity. Nor is there any suggestion that there's any right of return of the Greeks and Armenians to their ancestral homelands in Turkey.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121984699#Comment_121984699

This is not the gotcha you seem to think it is: neither Netanyahu, nor the state of Israel "sponsored" Hamas.

Rather they enabled money to be sent to Hamas from Arab states like Qatar because they believed, wrongly, that Hamas was prepared to negotiate peace in exchange for money. Turned out Hamas are not interested in peace at all. They are only interested in destroying Israel.

It's actually a very good reason for Israel to fight Hamas to the death, because Hamas have shown that it is not possible to live in peace with them (and also to dump Netanyahu for having been so naive, but that's a separate question.)

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121983238#Comment_121983238

It the other side of Islamophobia which is just as common and even some jews are slating other Jews for it.

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2019/dec/17/islamophobia-a-bogus-label-jewish-chronicle-under-fire-over-s

Its common all over Europe too.

https://www.euronews.com/2024/01/31/islamophobia-is-surging-throughout-europe-heres-how-we-stop-it

drury..

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121979212#Comment_121979212

It all seemed about votes from the beginning with Biden

Hes been having a go at Israel for a while now without taking action

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121984992#Comment_121984992

LOL You think that's what it would take for Hamas to stop trying to murder random Jews? That's even more naive than Netanyahu thinking Hamas were interested in running Gaza as a country rather than as a war economy to destroy Israel.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121984971#Comment_121984971

It could be suggested that Islamophobia is way more prevalent in fact. The majority of Jewish people in Europe are invariably middle class, well educated and fully integrated - Muslims are far more likely to be seen, even by right wing governments and media, as being 'outsiders' and not really belonging in the countries where they now reside.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121984859#Comment_121984859

Holy whataboutery, no idea where you flew off here. Just answer the question please, how exactly did the Israeli settlers treat the locals in the time leading up to the creation of the Israeli state? The deflection screams of an inability to engage the reality honestly.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121984878#Comment_121984878

What do you think handing them suitcases full of cash is, a sanction? Putting sponsored in air quotes doesn't mitigate that they are state sponsors of Hamas. Cash money and all. If Israel did it with good intentions, why was it a secret that only journalists uncovered later by happenstance? Why would negotiations for peace be a secret? Clearly that wasn't the purpose of the cash.

Yes Bibi just handed his useful 'barbarians at the gate' suitcases full of cash, ignored repeated intelligence warnings and murdered Israelis in a kibbutz that voted against him on October 7th all as a coincidence.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121984971#Comment_121984971

The Guardian link doesn't work and it's not clear what your point is.The fact that anti semitism is common all over Europe is totally going to incite Israelis to give up on the fight for the existence of Israel.

No, wait, it won't. They've been there before, widespread anti semitism in Europe, that is, and they decided that the state of Israel was the only insurance against another holocaust. So such attacks outside Israel inevitably lead to more military response from Israel, not less.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985016#Comment_121985016

If you knew any history, you'd get the connection. There are a bunch of states all created as a result of the collapse of the Ottoman Empire, many with forced displacement of various minorities, religious and/or ethnic. Several are still ruled by the family of the warlord that kicked the most ass at the time. Or another warlord that murdered the previous one.

Yet the only one of them that is regularly denounced today as somehow illegitimate is Israel. The only one that's actually a democracy.

But yeah that's not antisemitism, it's just a coincidence.

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985020#Comment_121985020

And retaliation to Israeli abuses. Vicios circle.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985033#Comment_121985033

Still dodging the question dishonestly. You apparently know the answer is not hugs and rainbows, far from it.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985041#Comment_121985041

I never said it was. I said that's how all those states in that region came into existence. But we accept the House of Saud, even though they were just the local thugs. Israel is a democracy, but Israel must be destroyed.

mvt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121984517#Comment_121984517

Maybe I should have made it clearer that I meant the people in Arab states not the governments & also the state of Israel not all the people in Israel.

Also am talking about the present day which I personally think is the only time that matters in this situation.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985047#Comment_121985047

But it was Israelis who were murdered, kidnapped and raped on Oct 7th, not their government. And it's Jews - not even Israelis - who are being attacked in antisemitic attacks in Europe and America now. That's just antisemitism, to blame non Israelis, just on the grounds that they're Jewish.

Odhinn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985033#Comment_121985033

It's not a democracy for the millions of Palestinians in the occupied territories.

Sudden Valley

Amazing after 30k deaths, 10k children being killed, posters are still bring banging the drum about anti semitism being thr biggest issue now. I doubt after all the destruction in Gaza that there will be many hostages left alive so now it is just a massacre of civilians in the hope of getting some of the bad guys in the cross fire.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985132#Comment_121985132

Then you’re off topic. This thread is about the Hamas attack and the resulting war.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985075#Comment_121985075

That’s not Israel though.

When did the West Bank or Gaza last have an election and how is that Israel’s fault that they didn’t?

Israel is a democracy - and the only one in the region. If Israel felt it safe to withdraw from the occupied territories and Gaza tomorrow, the evidence is that whatever government took its place wouldn’t be a democracy either.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985046#Comment_121985046

More irrelevant deflections. How droll.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985224#Comment_121985224

LMFAO how hypocritical!

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985058#Comment_121985058

Who would Muslims in Israel or the West Bank go to if they wanted to report Islamophobia?

Odhinn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985269#Comment_121985269

"That's not Israel though"

A rather pathetic attempt at a dodge. Millions live under Israeli rule, with no voice in the knesset. It's an apartheid state.

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985058#Comment_121985058

Antisemitism is cool now, its been redefined as meaning "anti genocide". @Donald Trump clarified this last night.

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985324#Comment_121985324

Apartheid state for sure. Clear as day. They will keep shouting ' antisemitism' though and hide behind it.

Ten of Swords

@SeanW threadbanned

Overheal

veteran anchor Chris Wallace pleads with Israel to find a moral way to conduct operations vs Hamas.

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/for-me-this-is-personal-emotional-chris-wallace-pleads-for-israel-to-find-some-way-to-fight-without-killing-so-many-innocents/

Juran

Why do they need foreign aid workers to distribute food ? Does anyone ever ask that question. Why cant the local palestinian people not organize this ?

I'm not a supporter of what Israel is doung, but evetytime there is conflict in the middle east (and Africa), it always takes forreigners to come in and distribute the aid.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985662#Comment_121985662

well you see Juran, Israel bombed the **** out of the local, indigenous food infrastructure, and has blocked aid from rolling across the border.

Think about it a little harder. Israel wants the Palestinians dead and gone.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121985662#Comment_121985662

Well the locals were doing it and are doing it. And they are also getting killed. The difference is that many of those in power in the West don't care when they get killed and the local individuals aren't getting headlines in Western media when they get killed

i.e. the reason that a big deal was made about those aid workers getting killed is not that they were the only ones getting killed. It's that they were Westerners who couldn't be passed off as "Hamas". There was one Palestinian killed with them too.