Hamas strike on Israel - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

Israel says it will release multiple layers of evidence to prove that Hamas was responsible.

Perhaps we should wait for that evidence before jumping to firm conclusions.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252842#Comment_121252842

They’re taking their sweet time fabricating it so. Out in 2 weeks

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252846#Comment_121252846

Do you know something no one else knows or are you just jumping to conclusions?

Gatling

Well looks like the claims made last night by several individuals that Israel bombed a hospital last night has been pretty much debunked, in the morning light it looks like a fire in a car park caused by a fail rocket attack against Israel ,

https://twitter.com/manniefabian/status/1714505284410921118?s=20

Here's the exact location of the fire after the failed attack on Israel, notice the lack of remains despite the claims here last night of 1000 dead and countless others injured

NIMAN

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252842#Comment_121252842

Truth really does suffer in war.

Both sides claiming it was the other, and the way the Internet is now, doesn't matter if 100% accurate proof is produced, the followers on both sides will never believe it was their fault.

Israel have already tweeted their evidence...

then deleted it.

Tweeted more evidence...

then deleted that too.

Tweeted a video of a 'Hamas rocket misfiring'...

Whoopsie-doodle, timestamp doesn't match up, deleted that too.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252881#Comment_121252881

Of course not, that would mean people having to admit that they were wrong ,

If was amusing to watch the feeding frenzy and now those who stayed level headed which are in a minority on here will now watch as the excuses come thick and fast

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252892#Comment_121252892

What do you think the odds are, of the dozens of posters here who claimed it was Israel launched the horrific attack on the hospital, once it's proven that in fact it was Hamas or one of their lackeys who launched it, retracting their statements? It seems like instead of waiting for evidence they're lining up behind 'if Israel posts evidence, it's lies.'

Funny how people never admit to being wrong.

rock22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252892#Comment_121252892

I assume you think all these people committed suicide too , not killed by Israeli airstrike

https://edition.cnn.com/2023/10/16/middleeast/israel-palestinian-evacuation-orders-invs/index.html

The link is to CNN. No doubt you will tell us that CNN is just part of Hamas

Jinglejangle69

I said wait for more information as we get it.

Israel must be delighted that they now look like the good guys and they can continue killing more innocent children on top of the 2000 kids in the last 10 days.

What a disaster of a situation this whole Israel/Palestinian conflict is.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252894#Comment_121252894

If the evidence presents itself that Israel was responsible for the attack, I will have no problem admitting it. It would be pretty sad to close my eyes and ears and blame Hamas just because I dislike Hamas.

Let's see what evidence comes forward from both sides; that way we can come to concrete conclusions.

Until then, I'm going to reserve judgement - which isn't something that anti-Israel people are willing to do. Their minds are already made up, even when all the evidence isn't on the table.

Beyond brazen.

https://twitter.com/housetrotter/status/1714369451317997805

IDF are currently holding a news conference, claiming that (from Sky News):

A barrage of rockets was launched at 6.15pm by Hamas toward Israel.

A barrage of 10 rockets was fired by the Islamic Jihad at 6.59pm.

At that time there were reports of an explosion at the hospital.

He accuses Hamas of launching a "global media campaign to hide what really happened".

They have inflated the number of casualties, he says.

SharkMX

So was it a hospital or a car park that was bombed. The problem with the internet today is you cant actually get the truth from anyone about anything. People on social media feel they must support one side or the other in everything and then off they go posting.

Im still trying to find out if it was really a car park that caught fire (The cars in that photo) dont seem to be moved, just burned, so not a big enough explosion to kill 500 people in the hospital. If thats the damage, what killed 500 people in the hospital? Are the pictures of the car park real? Are there any pictures of the hospital?

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252878#Comment_121252878

What does the supposed drone footage prove?

Nothing.

thomas 123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252894#Comment_121252894

I for one would love to admit im wrong and potentially could be based on what’s released so far.

muob

Don't try deflecting from the situation It was a HOSPITAL that was hit caused directly by IDF who now are trying to pin the blame on others - cowards as well as bullies and mass murderers

rogber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252419#Comment_121252419

I meant people on this thread, the excitement is palpable in some cases

muob

Lies lies lies from Israel re pinning blame on other groups for hospital attack.

Nothing new there

Meanwhile have still refused point blank to turn back on water supplies 💧 🚿 🚰 to over 2.3Mn and have denied there is any humanitarian crisis there 🙄

DellyBelly

Will this misfire by Hamas of a rocket turn the Palestine citizens against them....it will be interesting to see what happens next

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252896#Comment_121252896

No just according to hamas 2800 are dead ,the same hamas who said 1000 people was killed in Israel airstrike against a hospital,the same hamas who said that they didn't kill any civilians in the massive terrorist attack last week,they also didn't kidnapp any people.

So yes according to Hamas holds a lot of water.....

m2_browning

What a **** show

both this pointless war started by islamists and … this thread

bonus points to silly arguments over what day it is, FML

dennis72

The truth of what happened here makes difference to Palestinians who remain whether against their will or not, they are victims of a war escalated/started by hamas and proxies to Iran who want to wipe out Israel so they can be a superpower in the region.

Hamas must be defeated or it will do the same again their victory would be if the west backed away and Russia and China prosper from its chaos.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252919#Comment_121252919

Are you saying Hamas wouldn't do such a thing ???

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252941#Comment_121252941

Why make such a claim

fits

motaz Azaiza is in Gaza and has footage of the hospital attack on his Instagram account.

Beechwoodspark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252956#Comment_121252956

Hopefully the ordinary Gazans rise up against Hamas after this horrendous misfire incident, and hand the terrorists over to Israel, along with the hostages, and then call for ceasefire negotiations.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252958#Comment_121252958

You are the poster who claimed a dead Palestinian child was a doll.

Show some compassion for the victims rather than dismissing the death and suffering of innocent men, women and children.

Nermal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252959#Comment_121252959

Our own media outlets bear a lot of responsibility here. Articles based on statements from Hamas routinely disguise their source.

Closing an investigation before it's even open.

https://twitter.com/spectatorindex/status/1714536639232712882

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252956#Comment_121252956

If it’s shown to be coming from within Gaza, I still don’t think the people will want to believe it - in addition they won’t be watching the same news as we do in the west- so very hard to convince them otherwise- that’s assuming it wasn’t Israel of course which were still awaiting news on.

Given it’s taken this long at this stage I’m not convinced we’ll get a definitive independent view or account of what really happened - I think this will become a Hamas did it/Israel did it argument

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252976#Comment_121252976

It was a doll in the video,

How many claims have you alone made on this thread denials after denials,

And Here we are again

TheValeyard

Evidence is mounting against Islamic Jihad

Cato the Elder

Regardless of who is responsible, it's remarkable watching people who support the bombing of Gaza in general be so adamantly sure that any specific bombings like at the border post or hospital were done by Hamas. They cannot own any bomb that shows what bombs do to people because regardless of their politics, they deep down know it's wrong.

Furthermore, I consider that Carthage must be destroyed.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252962#Comment_121252962

Well, if they would, all the more reason for Israel to bomb it.

realdanbreen

There is a fairly modern expression that many people loathe, " we are where we are". I think it is one of the best and most apt expressions ever. If nations and people put aside their greed, pride and ancient religious beliefs and accepted "we are where we are" then a lot of current conflicts would cease and people could move on with their lives.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252989#Comment_121252989

Even if all the evidence points to Islamic Jihad causing this atrocity, that evidence will be completely ignored so that Israel is squarely blamed.

It's the old Goebellian tactic, to repeat a lie over and over again and people will eventually believe it.

muob

What Israel have done over the past 11 days in Gaza is totally unforgiveable its blatant war criminality.

Bombing innocent women, children, wiping out entire families, cutting off vital water 💧 supplies, cutting off power, refusing to allow aid corridors, deliberately bombing the possible humanitarian crossing at Egypt so that it is unusable and ordering 1.1Mn to leave their homes and cram themselves in with another 1Mn in an already overcrowded unsafe zone & then in turn bombing that. Bombing a hospital and then having the absolute nerve to try pinning the blame on groups who clearly did not do it ( lies ...deleted more lies ...deleted... give us more time to make up more stories so we are not held accountable for this 😫 🤒)

It's a SAD SAD time for HUMANITY.

Forever I shall hold ISRAEL and any American UK, EU Government heads - who offer their " ironclad " support - responsible for this sorrowful mess. Thankfully Leo V Martin and Higgins had the backbone to call this for what it is .....

'Collective Punishment Massacre'

Defending yourself does not mean massacre of innocent civilians NO WAY ! Not buying that they were just looking for an excuse to invade and terrorise people they have oppressed x 17 years.

Shame on You Israel

And Any One Supporting Your so-called War on Innocents.

hydrus21

https://twitter.com/OAlexanderDK/status/1714525133799342530

If that was a missile strike, where's the hole in the ground ?

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121253003#Comment_121253003

It's nothing but a points scoring game to some people,they make false claims then blame anyone but themselves,

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121253012#Comment_121253012

Which is consistent with the footage that the IDF released.

It's always worth asking the question, Cui bono? - in other words, who has more to gain from such an attack - Hamas or Israel?

The answer to that question is clear.

https://twitter.com/IDF/status/1714513625598021868

hydrus21

Hard to believe " 500 dead " in that car park.

Maybe if it had been a market place.

NIMAN

A lot of the images are only showing damage to a car parking area, and not a very extensive area at that.

Unless the 500 people were standing in the car park, how did so many die?

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252956#Comment_121252956

20 years of Hamas savagery against its own hasn't.

ArthurDayne

You cannot help but feel that the whodunnit about the hospital is obfuscating the key point here — regardless of whose immediate fault the bombing is, what else did the Israelis expect to happen from this operation? Did they really think that things like this were not inevitable?

They have made a huge strategic error with this conflict. On 7th October, only entrenchment or bias could have prevented you from finding sympathy with the Israelis. But rather than take the opportunity to hold the pen on the narrative, allow sympathy to build as the horrors of that day were re-told, barely a day had passed before they threw the initiative away and created a new tragedy for the world to focus on.

And for what? To destroy Hamas at the expense of even worse outcomes for themselves and the wider world, just as the Americans did when they destroyed the Taliban — until the Taliban returned of course. And yes, they'll explain how it wasn't them re the hospital. They will explain that it was Islamic Jihad. They will explain and explain and explain. But as the saying goes — if you're explaining, you're losing.

Nermal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121253043#Comment_121253043

The source for the figure of 500 is Hamas. This has just been buried in the articles you have read, either by the use of unreferenced statements in quotation marks, attribution to the 'Health Ministry' of Gaza or 'Gaza Authorities', or simply hiding the source altogether.

It is of course entirely possible that 500 people or more did die. But the reporting, even in supposed high-quality media outlets, is really poor.

Jinglejangle69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121253029#Comment_121253029

Like yourself.

KilOit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121252956#Comment_121252956

One can hope

StrawbsM

Are there not hundreds of satellites up in the sky that, right now, would be honed in on the land in that part of the world?

Why aren’t we seeing satellite pictures of where rockets/missiles are launched from and where they land?

Danzy

There is unbroken windows in the cars near the so called blast site