Hamas strike on Israel - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

PeggyShippen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122460891#Comment_122460891

Israel is a 'beacon of hope" for a whole variety of reasons.

Firstly it's a Democracy surrounded by kingdoms and corrupt dictatorships. They made great country iout of very little

2. It is secular and people are free to worship whatever religion they want. There's a vibrant Christian population, a large Muslim minority, the Bahi religion is based in Haifa.

3. It protects Jerusalem..a centre of the 3 main religions. It allows me to visit whenever I want .

4. Israel is a technological marvel and agricultural leader . It's entrepreneurial outlook is an example to the region. It has no oil but shows how am infertile country can still progress.

5. It's military is a juggernaut with weapons technology it exports worldwide. The bedwetters in Ireland won't like this one as they'd like to see Israel and the West disarmed. So they lead in military development..thats huge.

6. It's a very fun place to visit...a great nightlife, great food and by God the people are interesting. Some unbelievable looking women and I suppose men, extremely confident amd up for a laugh...never seem to have the standoffishness of average looking Irish people with notions of themselves. Have ye ever met or hung out with Israelis properly.. A very open ,intelligent and pluralistic bunch.

WEST

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462404#Comment_122462404

That post is comedy gold 😆, in reply to point 2.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z581dbGqr08

Weepsie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462404#Comment_122462404

Having a juggernaut military is the exact opposite of being a beacon of hope.

Beirut is famous for it vibrant nightlife. Iran, let's set aside its government, as you seem to be doing that with Israel, has a.population of incredibly warm and welcoming and generous people. Again, famous for it. Horrible government though, much like Israel in that respect.

I wonder why I have family who were repeatedly harassed and then finally assaulted when visiting Israel simply due to them being an easy target by officials because they were a woman travelling alone?

Why is there at any given time pre October 7, a minimum of 4500 Palestinians in prison without clear charges.

Why do 95% of Palestinian women in Israeli prisons reports some sort of sexual violence committed against them by officers?

I've been abroad with Israelis. Incredibly rude, arrogant, and treated staff and such like dirt. Now I've seen the same from plenty of Irish, English and a a few others, but the point your making is nonsense really.

Do you have anything to say about the 10,000s of settlers who are there illegally having taken the homes of muktitudes more Palestinians? Do you condemn that at all?

Israel protects Jerusalem? The Jerusalem they routinely demolish homes and force it's residents to live in refugee camps. Freedom to practice your faith only goes so far.

Israel, controls all the natural resources of Israel and Palestine, rationing water to Gaza, shooting at fishing boats, patrolling international waters it actually has no right to, and certainly no right from stopping Gazan fishermen into. In has annexed so much agricultural land that never was to belong to Israel that it "the agricultural marvel" is sort.of built on the blood of Palestinians and Syrians too

Why wouldn't Israelis be confident. They can do whatever the **** they want treat people like scum and laugh about it after.

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462404#Comment_122462404

Simple. When you treat your neighbours like dirt you get that kind of response. Neither being right of course.

Weepsie

Isrsel has no oil, but it has in the last 25 years become and increasingly large player on the gas market.

The biggest gas field however is in Gazan water. Israel has in the last year granted licences to explore and potentially drill this field. Something for which they have no claim to whatsoever.

end of the road

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462251#Comment_122462251

presumably you have sufficient evidence to support your claim that those out on the streets yesterday support islamic terrorism and islamic terror groups? if so have you reported this to the gardai seeing as they would be committing a criminal offense as it's illegal to support a terrorist group?

there is no big problem with antisemitism in ireland, of course there are antisemites but the majority of those out yesterday are not antisemetic.

screaching antisemite/antisemetic to justify and excuse israel's crimes does not work any more.

end of the road

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462404#Comment_122462404

israel is not a full democracy and is not secular.
yes israel is a player in technology but other players just as advanced are coming on stream.
israel's military rely on billions of aid and weaponry from the US, yes it provides some help in terms of producing those weapons via information/science ETC and it produces some weaponry under license from US manufacturers which it then exports as the US use it as a proxy.
but ultimately the US are the ones upholding it's military and it's military exports.

Odhinn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462404#Comment_122462404

~~It also has legalised torture, runs an apartheid regime in the occupied territories, has a cabinet that actually has to debate whether anal rape of a prisoner is a crime etc.

Why is Israel building colonies outside its internationally recognised borders?

nacho libre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122462273#Comment_122462273

I get you p johnson. I feel the same sense of bemusement when I see people, who profess to be against political violence and terrorism, out cheerleading for the current Israeli Government led by a suspected War Criminal-Oh you don't agree p, well you and Peggy have a friend in Putin there as he also thinks the ICJ and its rulings are a joke.

And what about the people who thank racists posts made against Palestinians but then a few posts later are up in arms about anti semitism. I am sure you agree P there is a lot of cognitive dissonance going on there.

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463044#Comment_122463044

You'll have a hard time finding me praising Putin but sure whatever fantasy you and the other boys are having. I'm not arsed reading Peggy's wall of texts nor have I thanked any racist against Palestinan posts. But you do you!

I know they get upset if I don't visit often and ye really need to get your personal jibes in after all.

PeggyShippen

It's probably a good time for the IDF to push Hizbollah back behind the Litani river in Southern Lebanon. And keep that buffer zone indefinitely. I think you might see an enlarged Golan heights move aswell to keep the Druze happy . All makes sense militarily aswell. The handbrake is being let off I feel and I ll be surprised if there isn't a big allied bombing campaign on Iran within the month.

nacho libre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463168#Comment_122463168

I didn't say you did. I was speaking of others. I don't have any illusions/ fantasies about your double standards in denying war crimes committed by Israel, it's openly on display with your constant deflections and complaining about piles on against Israel. The fact you don't praise Putin but stay silent about Nethanyu is telling. No wonder Nethanyu has expressed admiration for Putin- two peas in a pod!

Weepsie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463201#Comment_122463201

Israel will be dropping the bombs on their own if theres any campaign.

silverharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463201#Comment_122463201

Im pro Israel so the last thing it should do is agree to ceasefires etc or let the likes of hamas regroup so that Israel faces the same problems down the road but at the same time Israel has to remember its population and economy is small enough and its already ~9months into a conflict, I see a risk of Israel overextending itsself militarily or risk its Iron Dome systems being exhausted?

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463721#Comment_122463721

Israel cannot do away with Hamas, it's an ideology. Hamas might not have the same name but it will not change under a new name. Israel has ensured that the numbers will swell too. If Israel wants to stop the threat then it needs to change and stop stealing land in the WB, release unconvicted prisoners and stop treating the Palestinians like dirt. What they have been doing up until now and in the past has not worked.

Sudden Valley

You would think Israel would finish with the conflict in Gaza before getting involved in another conflict. 9 months into their conflict in Gaza and they don't seem close to destroying Hamas yet some posters here think that they will defeat Hezbollah and Iran soon enough. It's obvious they are killing alot of people in Gaza but perhaps they are not killing the right people to actually win the conflict?

Perhaps the Israeli population will realise soon that Netanyahu's policies are not going secure any lasting peace.

combat14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463985#Comment_122463985

will iran fall into israels trap of a wider conflict

Sudden Valley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122464042#Comment_122464042

I'm not sure why they would bother. Cheaper to finance Hamas or whoever their successor is and Hezbollah and every few years make life difficult for the Israelis. Neither Israel or Iran have any strategy that will lead to victory.

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463985#Comment_122463985

It's as if they are killing thousands to disguise that fact. What we do know that of the 40,000 killed/murdered, most were women and children and around 31,000. Now assuming the rest were Hamas ( a bit of a stretch) then 10,000 were Hamas. Israel estimated that Hamas had at least 40,000 members in Gaza.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463721#Comment_122463721

Would you agree with the stance of many Israelis that all Palestinians need to be wiped out?

That's the logical and inevitable conclusion of perpetuating a system of apartheid, murder, theft, and oppression.

tayto lover

It's just another day in Gaza as more kids die in Israeli bombings -

https://www.rte.ie/news/middle-east/2024/0804/1463445-israel-gaza-hamas/

combat14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122464131#Comment_122464131

the vast majority of israelis are not advocating wipe out all palestinians - most arabs are advocating the opposite however

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122464340#Comment_122464340

Hmm. So they want to avoid facing "the same problems down the road" but they are also committed to controlling nurturing an environment where the same type of resistance will necessarily arise.

Gaslighting 101.

nacho libre

Let's hope they do.

As you say the Israeli right don't want peace. Let's say Hamas are somehow defeated and a moderate opposition governs Gaza that would be Bibi and his friends worse nightmare. We know this because Bibi admitted it to colleagues that the best way to weaken the PA and stall a two state solution was allowing the money to come in from Qatar. Bibi would love if the Iranians fell into his trap and a wider war broke out that dragged in the Americans. Let's hope they don't give him what he wants.

Even his own negotiators have said that he was setting out terms for a peace deal to the current war that made their job is impossible.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463985#Comment_122463985

Weepsie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122464340#Comment_122464340

He didn't say most Israelis. He said many. And who or what are these arabs you speak of?

PeggyShippen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122464066#Comment_122464066

Shows how much Hamas value their own women and children. They hide behind them and among them. Hanas are happy to hide in schools and hospitals. Once they operate from those schools and hospitals then they become legitimate targets for airstrikes . This war is going to get worse before it gets better. It ll be interesting to see the Hizbollah and Iranian response. They are already tearing apart their organisations looking for the Shin Bet operatives .. If they over do their response then the Americans will intervene directly . That's Bibis thinking ..makes sense really. Then push on into lebanon. This war is only starting

Wolf359f

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122464817#Comment_122464817

That lie gets repeated ad nauseam. Schools and hospitals don't automatically loose their protective status simply because there's an alleged fighter in it.

Odhinn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122464817#Comment_122464817

You have yet to explain why the "beacon of hope" is colonising areas outside of its internationally recognised borders.

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122464817#Comment_122464817

As you know Peggy that is the excuse the Israelis use to bomb civilians and destroy infrastructure. That's all. It's played out at this stage.

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122464841#Comment_122464841

Not only that. If their information is so good that they know Hamas are hiding behind women and children then how come they haven't been able to free the hostages? It makes no sense because it isn't true.

Weepsie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122464817#Comment_122464817

Israel soldiers had to be told by its own court system to stop using Palestinian civilians as human shields. That was I. 2004 and the practices still continues. This includes forcing people into areas and building they believe to be booby trapped, and a practice called neighboring which is basically using civilians as bait to lure out operatives.

Israel has **** all room to make up accusations of human shielding. They use it as a convenient excuse.

In the the 2008-09 and 2014 conflicts only a fraction of what they bombed and claimed to be examples of human shields by Hamas was found to be remotely credible by various agencies including NATO and Amnesty international.

And as above said, just because there is a cache of weapons or a militant in a hospital, they are still protected by international laws,away that Israel does not respect.

It's abhorrent that Hamas would use these places strategically but it's worse that Israel would consider the massive loss of human life to be okay for what is questionable intelligence mostly.

And the Americans are not intervening directly, despite the wet dreams it's giving defenders of Israel's war crimes

silverharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122463977#Comment_122463977

The only strategy for Israel is to grow, maybe never let anybody back into gaza except under some very selective process maybe

silverharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122464131#Comment_122464131

Ive never heard the term "wiped out" but if they expand their borders and move people on so be it

Weepsie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122465358#Comment_122465358

So are you saying ethnic cleansing is okay, because thats what you're proposing

silverharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122465398#Comment_122465398

Its not for me to say whether its ok or not but it just seems like something that could happen, maybe there is an upbeat solution, create a model city get the oil nations to help fund it but eradicate extremism from the start, see what happens

Weepsie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122465408#Comment_122465408

And what if Israel's extremism? How is that eradicated? What about the very tricky issue if illegal settlement.

What you have proposed is essentially ethnic cleaning and weirdly remiscent of the Zionists Delat Plan or Plan D that they implemented in 1948

silverharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122465423#Comment_122465423

again , not proposing but given the situation its a strong possibility as in the less likely situation is a shaking of hands and they wind the clock back a year. Israel has essentially spent its "holocaust card" so there is no point compromising now

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122465359#Comment_122465359

Bit of the oul' lebensraum?

silverharp

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122465542#Comment_122465542

I see what you did there but from a security point of view it would make sense.

Weepsie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122465573#Comment_122465573

Security for whom? The millions of Palestinians forcibly removed from their homes?

Israel, who have will shave shown they've gone even further even their most ardent defenders have said they would?

It's not a solution that be remotely entertained. It sends the wrong message out entirely and basically says their constant abuse of human rights is okay.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122465573#Comment_122465573

Sounds like the Russian position on Ukraine.

Weepsie

Justified and moral to let 2 million Gazans die according to an Israeli minister today

Later said that they should have just put a settlement in Gaza too.

Openly talking about ethnic cleansing now.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/smotrich-might-be-justified-and-moral-to-cause-2-million-gazans-to-die-of-hunger-but-world-wont-let-us/

PeggyShippen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122464841#Comment_122464841

They do if they start shooting out of it or launch rockets from the hospital grounds. Or use it as a military base

Weepsie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122466719#Comment_122466719

For which there has to be an unequivocal burden of truth on those directing the bombs which Israel has never been able to confirm

They are commuting war crimes.

PeggyShippen

It's all coming to a head now and so be it. There can't be a 'sticking plaster" put over the whole Iran terror sponsoring now. It makes no sense for Israel to de escalate . I think a large escalation is what they ll do. Southern Lebanon will have to be invaded. That's so Israelis can return to their homes and farms and villages up there in Northern Israel. Incidentally i stayed at a lovely Kibbutz up there last year run by a fella called Itzik . Decent enough farmland up there. If it develops into a full scale I'm definitely volunteering 🙋‍♂️ to help Israel out there.

Volatile times we live in. The Anti Semites are coming out of the woodwork in Ireland...supporting the Islamic Jihadis in Gaza.

engineerws

Alastair firing on all cylinders today. Hopefully Alastair is wrong and things will deescalate.

https://www.youtube.com/live/3ZkfEh4bIIw?si=4EXMfJUNKsgtOgpu

Weepsie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122466757#Comment_122466757

More lazy anti Semite accusations when we have literal video of Irish lads shouting to kick Islam and Islamic people of the country. The mind boggling hypocrisy is incredible.

You're here saying it's okay that Israel has killed approx 40,000 people and are now looking for more bloodshed.

What you are calling for is far, far more deplorable than any criticism of Israels continuing war crimes can ever be.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122466989#Comment_122466989

Partly for another thread, but there is a big overlap between anti-islamists and the anti-immigrant crowd. The same lads wrapping themselves in the tricolour and calling themselves patriots one minute but them going drinking with UDA types up north the next. Laughable. If you go up North, you'll see where the Israeli flags tend to fly too………..Anti -Catholic and anti-protestant set aside temporarily…..United in the hatred of Muslims!

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122467219#Comment_122467219

There's many haters of Muslims on this thread too. They try to hide it but it's still quite obvious.

nacho libre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122467292#Comment_122467292

Some of them don't even try to hide it.

https://www.irishtimes.com/world/middle-east/2024/08/05/cancer-patients-are-the-quiet-victims-of-gaza-war-and-west-bank-occupation/