Hamas strike on Israel - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226537#Comment_121226537

This from the guy insisting a named woman was raped with zero evidence.

Do you believe everything politicians say or just US Presidents?

ittakestwo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121222085#Comment_121222085

Hamas have no chance of fighting a war like Israel with a military as it has none. It is a complitly lopsided fight. For example Israel can inport tanks planes guns into its country. Hamas cant as what comes in and out of Gaza is controlled by Israel. Therfore they have to go gorilla and fight dirty.

Their reason for fighting is as legitimate as you can get... its for freedom. So it is gorilla warfare rather than terrorism.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226545#Comment_121226545

An eye witness? Is that the Israeli soldier, Raz Cohen, you said she was there as a civilian not a soldier? Is that her?

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226550#Comment_121226550

I'm not the only one including witnesses...

Unlike the absolute zero evidence you've provided to say rapes and murders didn't actually happen

political analyst

Yaakov Katz explains Israel's failure to prevent last Saturday's attacks.

https://www.thefp.com/p/how-israel-got-ambushed

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226554#Comment_121226554

Im not sure calling for no-holds-barred engagement would go as well for your “freedom fighters” as you seem to think.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226570#Comment_121226570

Go on then. You claimed Shani Louk was raped before being murdered. How do you know?

I never said murders didn’t happen. Don’t misrepresent what I said.

I said there was no evidence of mass rape as had been claimed. The one source of a claim of rape provided here is an IDF soldier. The only source for a claim of beheaded babies appears to be an IDF soldier.

No evidence that it didn’t happen? Really?

I guess you are not familiar with the concept of burden of proof.

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226579#Comment_121226579

So zero evidence to back up anything your claiming....

Nothing.....

Whats next lizard men and space ships

ittakestwo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226578#Comment_121226578

I dont think they have any other option. They have no freedom. Living in one big Auchwitz with no military to fight for freedom with. Options are sit quietly at back of bus or fight in anyway you can. Palestinian nation are killed at a ratio of 20:1 compared with israli. So would you be suprised they are going for no holds barred approach. Not like they have any tanks planes etc like the israli army have at their disposal

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226589#Comment_121226589

You are projecting. You seem to be embarrassed because you know you have been caught out.

According to your logic lizard men and space ships exist because I haven’t shown evidence that they don’t.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226596#Comment_121226596

If you read any of my posts in this thread, you’ll see that I think the whole thing is a shitshow and both sides have committed atrocities.

But (and I apologise for repeating myself) , Israelis feel the same bloodlust and desire for vengeance as those in the Gaza Strip. There is now popular support in both Israel and the US for a massive ground operation that will probably lead to close to six figure deaths in Gaza.

So, I stand by my point, that last Saturday in particular, and “no-holds barred” in general, is a mistake for Hamas and its supporters.

tigerbalm_eu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226514#Comment_121226514

I hope they are allowed to. Some of the commentary under articles about her are genuinely horrific. Whatever about the wider conflict, I just cannot understand the lack of sympathy or compassion being shown by some Irish people to named individuals caught up in this.

This family should be hearing nothing but wall-to-wall sympathy, sadness and support.

Normally, us Irish handle grieving well and support each other and our wider community. But this just seems to have brought out another level of hatred.

thegame983

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226605#Comment_121226605

Unfortunately we've been cultivating this way of thinking for some time now.

political analyst

Kim Damti was last seen at that music festival but the media are not indicating where the Israeli authorities found her body - was it at the site of the festival or did the terrorists take her from there and kill her somewhere else? As a rule, the exact location of the discovery of a murder victim's body is indicated by the media.

political analyst

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226610#Comment_121226610

The person who made that comment about the victims at the music festival is probably some saddo sitting alone in his or her bedroom with nothing else to do.

ceadaoin.

So do the hamas defenders on here agree with Jews around the world being terrorised even if they aren't Israeli? This is what is happening as a result of all this. Children are being told to hide any outward signs of their faith and having to go to school under armed guard. Jewish schools in my city have cancelled classes on Friday as a result of calls from the leader of Hamas for attacks around the world (issued from the safety of his luxury home in Qatar). Surely this should be condemned if you "don't hate Jewish people, just Israel"?

tigerbalm_eu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226616#Comment_121226616

They have now been removed from reddit – but they had a long post history going back years. My summary: Irish, Female, Mother, 30 years old, 11 year old daughter, weed addiction (spoke about that a lot).

Manic Moran

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226484#Comment_121226484

There is also some question as to whether or not she is correct in broad strokes. I will recall that in 2003 the US disabled the Iraqi electricity grid for perfectly legitimate military reasons (though they were nice enough to just short it out for a few weeks with missiles which dispensed carbon filaments instead of blowing it up entirely which would require massive rebuilding). It's all down to the specifics.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-63754808

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/when-are-attacks-civilian-infrastructure-war-crimes-2022-12-16/#:~:text=This%20is%20forbidden%20under%20international,by%20rulings%20of%20the%20U.N.

Gaza is in a state of siege, I linked to a couple of articles many pages back which explained that the laws of war regarding sieges are a little more... squishy than blanket statements would provide. I can think of several fairly legitimate reasons to cut electricity from a defined, surrounded space in order to obtain military advantage. For starters, I'll lay bets it'll make the EM signature (amongst others) of Hamas fighters, if they try to communicate with each other, much easier to locate as the general civilian communications grid goes down. I'd be fairly sure Hamas have some power sources of their own for their radios, and the like, for example. And if they can't communicate with each other, well, that's an advantage in a ground offensive as well.

As the various articles observe, it's down to specifics. If Israel keeps Gaza powerless and cut off from resources for weeks without an assault, then that's far more difficult to argue as a legitimate purpose than a few days before an assault.

Manic Moran

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226554#Comment_121226554

Guerilla, not gorilla. FFS.

Absolutely, it would be daft for Hamas to attempt a stand-up fight against the Israeli military. Much as it was daft of the IV/ICA to take over the GPO in open fighting against the British Army.

However, guerilla fighters are still perfectly capable of being discriminatory in their targets. They hit, and run, but who do they hit? In the Irish case, it was the British authority. RIC, soldiers, and their informants/staff. They kept to a set of standards. They did not randomly kill every Briton they found on the streets. As I mentioned before, Hamas proved capable of overrunning Israeli military facilities. Had they kept to that, they would have achieved much of the shock effect in Israel that they desired, without galvanising the nation into the first state of war in fifty years.

NIMAN

There was always going to be a lot of fake news and inaccurate reporting on this.

But surely the POTUS should be more careful with his words.

Problem is, there are going to be a huge number of people in the world who will not see the follow up tweet to say the Pres was wrong, and so they will take it that the beheadings did happen.

Dangerous times we live in.

patnor1011

That 40 beheaded babies story is complete horseschitt. The moment something like that happened we would be drowned with pictures and videos of it.

It was made up lie to prepare ground for what is coming.

From time to time opportunity arise to sort out old problems and we see it happening in real time be it russia/ukraine, izrael/palestine, turkey/syria armenia/azerbaijan and quite more possibly in the making. Taiwan, most of the 'stans, tensions rise in former Yugoslavia, Africa is trying to get rid of the colonial masters who are still robbing them blind...

As always, politicians who push for it do so from comfort of their houses having ordinary people pay for their fantasies in blood and suffering.

xhomelezz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226596#Comment_121226596

Auschwitz?? Really?? If it was anything like that, there would be no over 2 million Palestinians left in Gaza !

Don't be ridiculous. People like to throw words around in this thread, without actually really understanding what those words mean.

Like reading Journal article talking about Israel carpet bombing Gaza.

eggy81

….

clampedusa

The gun fetishists are on social media now playing their usual game, not mentioning its an 18% Muslim population.

Expressing disbelief like 'how could Israel not have thought about more gun ownership'. Like israelis are sat there facepalming and going 'thats amazing, of course, why didnt i....here Herschel, just give everyone guns.'

Yes Herschel everyone.

Yeah I know he is but still.

PokeHerKing

Biden misspeaking/rambling is nothing new. I'm surprised he didnt come out and say we stand with Iran instead of Israel.

TedBundysDriver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226667#Comment_121226667

Indefensible that but guaranteed some will do just that.

Hey boy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226596#Comment_121226596

If Gaza was ruled by peace lovers with Hamas terrorists gone would Israel be bombing it?

Worth a try?

Cordell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226657#Comment_121226657

No, gorilla is a good word, it fits them. They are not a state, they don't have an army, they just have their hate. That's why they will never accept peace.

enfant terrible

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226554#Comment_121226554

What happened on Saturday was legimate?

Gatling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226708#Comment_121226708

You want pictures and videos???

There was children beheaded and rather than people on boards Condem this horrific act we get .

It didn't happen,it's made up

lizzyjane

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226150#Comment_121226150

Israeli baby murdering apologist scumbag.

Two can play this stupid game.

TedBundysDriver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226749#Comment_121226749

The irony of you taking about making stuff up isn't lost on us ...

Boggles

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67082047

US intelligence confirm Israel were warned.

McFly85

Has any news agency verified the claims about the babies?

Dont get me wrong, I think Hamas are well capable of it, but something as horrific as that will create a lot of public anger and justification of retaliation in Gaza.

So it’s not crazy to ask if there’s any source that has verified it.

After all, if a Palestinian in Gaza said the IDF stormed a hospital and decapitated babies, would you just believe them?

brickster69

Unbelievable from an attorney. There is only one answer and they are scared to say it.

https://twitter.com/vicderbyshire/status/1712249225633780043

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121225412#Comment_121225412

That's what's elected leader do

90% distraction 10% action

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226556#Comment_121226556

Predictably, another glib response.

An eye witness who was there, who testified about it to a reputable media outlet. You have absolutely no information that they were there as a soldier - this is disinformation on your part, purely your own fabrication. This is something you have jumped on to avoid engaging with the evidence. It was a music festival attended by civilians where Hamas raped and executed at will. Or are all the deaths of civilians at the festival an invention too?

Do you dispute that entire families were executed by Hamas?

Or are you trying to discredit that also?

Do you accept it is possible, given such a horrific attack, that rapes and mutilations also occurred? It must be considered a serious and realistic possibility in such a sequence of horrific attacks.

Why is it every such claim is therefore met by default by you with automatic attempts to discredit or glib responses therefore? Reserving judgment is one thing, but that is not what you are doing.

What kind of evidence do you think would be forthcoming from such an attack, when victims are executed or abducted as hostages? Well?

You won't accept any evidence provided by reputable outlets so if you want more evidence - as you seem to do - you can go looking for it in the dregs of the internet to satisfy yourself. It seems to be the only proof you will accept because any claims made by the victims themselves you will no doubt try to discredit also, as you have already done so with eye witness testimony.

It is plain to see any excuse will be deployed in your posts to avoid condemning Hamas atrocities.

eggy81

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226831#Comment_121226831

Why can’t anyone give an honest answer anymore. If Russia did it it would against international law. I think it’s time we just accept there are sides to all of this conflict and just say we are on the side of the us and stop playing dumb.

Jinglejangle69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226667#Comment_121226667

Well well.

realdanbreen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121222326#Comment_121222326

Will you stop, just stop . All sane posters here know that what hamas did was horrible but you are now attempting to justify the wholesale slaugher of Palestinians . Palestinians that have been herded into a small parcel of land and persecuted for decades. Its actually frightening to think that the Israeli authorities believe that by slaughtering Palestinians they will somehow "win". More likely this bombardment could bring about even more attacks on Israel.

Jinglejangle69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226490#Comment_121226490

Yeah what’s that again?

AudreyHepburn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226554#Comment_121226554

Beheading babies and raping -and torturing women is fighting for freedom? Really?

Thats a warped and disturbing view to be honest. Take a good look at yourself.

Sudden Valley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226855#Comment_121226855

Going to over react? What would you call denying a civilian population water electricity and fuel? How is that targeting hamas military targets or infrastructure?

Hummingbird Project

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226605#Comment_121226605

I’d be interested who took what steps behind the scenes when Ireland was the only country in Europe not to fly the Israeli flag? Was it Martin? His own party have bad history in sympathising with the Jewish people.

There’s seems to be scrambling and strategising but you can’t strategise and put your own countries national interests, or in the case of Ireland, what appears to be anti-Israeli sentiment first o this case.

There needs to be transparency and the steps taken and reasoning put out in the open. We appear to be a terrrosit sympathising state now, the only one in the EU.

AudreyHepburn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226871#Comment_121226871

Where or when did I ever justify the wholesale slaughter of any group?

Will people please please stop twisting my words.

All I have said is that you cannot compare people being caught in crossfire or being killed during bombing campaigns to a terrorist group rampaging around butchering babies and doing unspeakable things to women.

I don’t want to see innocent Palestinians killed wholesale but surely you can agree Hamas should wiped off the face of the earth?

Sudden Valley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226890#Comment_121226890

We should have put the flag up the weekend. He can't put it up now because some would see of supportive of Israels collective punishment of a whole city to get at a bunch of terrorists.

Beechwoodspark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226554#Comment_121226554

Disgusting to see ppl attempt to justify the barbarity of what Hamas did.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226718#Comment_121226718

I think it was much more deliberate than that. He didn’t misspeak. He purposefully used the word “saw”.

He set out to convince people, with the full imprimatur of his office, of a lie, of propaganda of another country in a time of war. A lie that will be used to justify the deaths of hundreds, if not thousands of innocent children.

Beechwoodspark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226744#Comment_121226744

I wouldn’t insult gorillas by comparing them to Hamas.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121226744#Comment_121226744

Maybe if they had their own state, their own army, they would accept peace. How do you know they will never accept peace? What have they been offered for peace? Do you know?