Hamas strike on Israel - Threadbans in op - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

Odhinn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121914279#Comment_121914279

Terrifying to think the likes of that has access to the levers of power.

Odhinn

The long campaign against the UN/UNWRA continues apace

"UN staff working with Palestinians in the occupied West Bank have been subjected to a systematic campaign of obstruction and harassment by the Israeli military and authorities since the beginning of the conflict in Gaza five months ago, according to internal UN documents obtained by the Guardian.

The documents record hundreds of incidents ranging from the alleged blindfolding and beating of UN staff at checkpoints to the use of UN facilities by Israeli troops as firing positions during raids on refugee camps in which Palestinians were killed."

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/mar/19/un-staff-in-west-bank-accuse-israeli-authorities-of-campaign-of-harassment

SeanW

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121912279#Comment_121912279

Funny how according to some, Israel needs new elections because their leader is an obstacle to peace. Yet those same commentators, Gaza and Hamas get a pass? Wouldn't it be more productive to call for new elections in Gaza?

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121914788#Comment_121914788

It might not be feasible to hold them at the minute, given the whole ongoing genocide thing

SeanW

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121914815#Comment_121914815

Right, so when did Hamas last schedule a free and fair election in Gaza? Israel has elections frequently, the last one being in 2022.

Odhinn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121914825#Comment_121914825

Elections that the Palestinians under Israeli control but outside its legal borders are denied a vote in.

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121914788#Comment_121914788

It would be nothing short of a sick joke to call for elections in Gaza at the moment.

What is wrong with you?

ToweringPerformance

Israel now starving the Palestinians to death.

Evil isn't even a word strong enough to describe them.

ToweringPerformance

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121913408#Comment_121913408

All supported by Joe Biden and his government as they continue to give Israel weaponry to slaughter the Palestinians.

SeanW

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121914861#Comment_121914861

I was merely rhetorically pointing out that Gaza hasn't had elections in the past ~18 years. Perhaps their government should schedule new elections as soon as it is feasible to do so?

Sudden Valley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121914956#Comment_121914956

You are merely pointing out something that doesn't matter at the moment for no apparent reason. Perhaps you can show some compassion for the people dying now who won't get to vote in this election you are asking for to take place.

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121914920#Comment_121914920

I think you'll find that starving innocent civilians has been a part of warfare since the invention of sieges way back before the trojan war.

Netanyahu is just continuing the proud tradition of such venerated characters as Pharaoh Thutmose III,  Oliver Cromwell, Genghis Kahn and his extended family, and of course, good old Adolf himself who mastered the art back in Leningrad about 80 years ago

almostover

The parallels between the Jewish Ghettos in eastern Europe and the current ghettoisation of Gaza are pretty grim. Granted that the worsening of the situation for Gaza recently has been due to the retaliation of Israel to the 7th Oct Hamas attacks but it was started long before that.

Push a defenceless people into an ever decreasing area with no sanitation, medical care or basic aid and slowly starve them into obliteration. It's crazy that it's less than 100 years since Nazi Germany did this to Polish Jews in cities like Warsaw and Krakow and yet here we are again. And the great liberator from the 1940s, the USA, not only stands idly by, but supplies the arms to make it happen. The US is a basket case at this stage, beyond morally corrupt. As for Israel, they've stopped short of gas chambers, that's the only credit they can be given.

It's beyond an atrocity, it is genocide.

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121914956#Comment_121914956

They were occupied and blockaded by the Israelis for the entirety of those 18 years, it's difficult to have free and fair elections when the region has been attacked by Israel every few years, killing and injuring many thousands of people and destroying essential infrastructure that takes years to rebuild

Operation Summer Rains (June 28, 2006 - November 26, 2006): At least 400 dead Palestinians + several hundred more injuries

Operation Cast Lead (December 27, 2008 - January 18, 2009): 1400 dead and more than 5000 injuries

Operation Pillar of Défense (November 14, 2012 - November 21, 2012): 177 dead and hundreds more injured

Operation Protective Edge (July 8, 2014 - August 26, 2014): over 2100 dead and over 10000 injured

2018–2019 Gaza border protests (Great March of Return): over 200 dead and 36000 injuries, vast majority of whom were civilians

Operation Black Belt (November 12–14, 2019): 34 dead and dozens more injured

2021 Israel–Hamas war (Operation Guardian of the Walls) (May 10–21, 2021): 243 dead and almost 2000 injured and a lot of infrastructure destroyed due to heavy bombardments in heavily populated areas.

2023 October 7th retaliation - 32000 dead and rising, many thousands more missing and an unknown number of thousands injured with hundreds of thousands suffering acute hunger and famine.....

Tell me, when could the 'government in Gaza' have organised free and fair elections over the past 18 years?

TinyMuffin

Around this time of year an Israeli bulldozer drove over an American protesting against illegal settlements.

Seems people on here keep finding reasons to perpetuate the hate against Israel and justifying the existence of Hamas, a terrorists organisation. I would of thought getting rid of Hamas would calm things down, as no peaceful solution can be found with Hamas. It's very existence is based on hating Israel, brainwashing their children to hate, to activate its useful idiots to perpetuate its propaganda abroad. All while hiding amongst innocent civilians when taking cover, they are cowards.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121914920#Comment_121914920

Let them eat ballot slips, some allude here.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121915410#Comment_121915410

Israel is driving hundreds of thousands to famine and Likud doesn’t want a two state solution how do they calm things down and bring about a peaceful solution exactly? Peace isn’t a mass grave of starved bodies.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121915413#Comment_121915413

Hamas must be first removed from power, Israel is close to defeating them, until then things will remain tough. If a ceasefire happened, Hamas would regroup which would just draw the events out longer.

Odhinn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121915414#Comment_121915414

Theres no real hamas presence in the West Bank, so why are the IDF there?

Grayson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121915410#Comment_121915410

Getting rid if Hamas by levelling a city with bombs, killing tens of thousands of civilians, displacing millions and starving millions.

Do you honestly think that would "calm things down"?

It takes a special kind of stupidity to think that's going calm things down.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121915556#Comment_121915556

They are at war with Hamas, Hamas is using civilians as shields, the goal of Hamas is to have as much civilian casualties as possible so that the war will stop. The aid is there for civilians but Hamas is controlling the situation on the ground. Gazans can't even protest Hamas because they will be killed. It's like Hamas are holding Gazans as hostages. The publicity around these casualties only helps Hamas but for Israel it's very bad publicity because they are made out to be the bad guys even though they're making huge sacrifices to win the war to make Gaza better, to stop Hamas terrorizing Israel with missiles and it's hateful ideology. I don't see any other way to fight this war. This has been going back and forth for years, peace with Hamas doesn't work.

Vote4Squirrels

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121915410#Comment_121915410

Could not agree more there. I find it chilling to hear people calling for a ceasefire and discussing the "demands" to release hostages.

They are actively looking to help a terrorist organisation achieve their aims. Release every single hostage then we can talk ceasefire.

Hamas will never stop what they are doing while they have Western liberals siding with them merely for their opposition being Jewish.

Odhinn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121916240#Comment_121916240

".....even though they're making huge sacrifices to win the war to make Gaza better"

Dear o dear o dear.

Why are the IDF in the West Bank?

Vote4Squirrels

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121916264#Comment_121916264

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67695861

That.

Odhinn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121916271#Comment_121916271

The IDF has been present in the West Bank since 1967 or so. Hamas was founded in 1987.

Vote4Squirrels

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121916288#Comment_121916288

And ? You asked why the IDF were there - since 1987 then that is why.

Grayson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121916240#Comment_121916240

Yes, it's a war crime to use civilians as human shields, but it's also a war crime to bomb them anyway.

So, two options.

Hamas are using human shields and Israel is bombing them anyway. Israel is committing War crimes.

Hamas is not using human shields and Israel is bombing civilians anyway. Israel is committing a war crime.

How does bombing the crap out of a city, displacing millions, starving millions, blocking humanitarian aid (which is also a war crime) and killing tens of thousands, calm things down?

Seriously, explain to me how bombing the crap out of civilian infrastructure calms things down.

How does laying siege to a hospital calm things down?

How does starving children calm things down? Talk a look at the children here and tell me how their starvation calms things down. https://www.reuters.com/default/gaza-starving-children-fill-hospital-wards-famine-looms-2024-03-19/

You claim the publicity around these things is bad. But not the actual events? So do you have no problems with the starvation of children, but you have issues with the publicity of it?

Maybe people think Israel are the bad guys because they are doing really bad things. My personal suggestion is stop starving people and maybe people won't think you're starving children. Stop bombing civilians and people won't complain about them bombing civilians.

The Hamas attack on Israel was horrible. They committed atrocities that day. They targeted innocent people. They killed and kidnapped innocent people. That's why I think Hamas are bad guys and should be stopped. But Israel have inflicted so much more pain and suffering back on Gaza. They've inflicted it in multiples that can't even be calculated at this stage. If Hamas's ideology is evil, then so is the ideology that's driving Israel at the moment.

And once again. Expecting all this violence and destruction to "Calm things down" in Gaza is just delusional.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121915410#Comment_121915410

Well if the US ever plugs the plug and stops the ongoing genocide by Israel, all the antisemitic posters can just go back to the older and always-on-the-frontpage-of-boards thread giving out about "the Jews".

Some people say that that thread never existed, but we know better don't we?

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121916271#Comment_121916271

Isn't it mad that people can try to use a post-facto response to oppression as a justification for the original oppression