Hamas strike on Israel - Threadbans in op - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563337#Comment_121563337

Its getting silly now. After 3 months I still haven't seen a pro-Hamas post. Not from any regular anyway.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563874#Comment_121563874

Nor has anyone justified October 7th or claimed that innocent Israeli civilians deserved to die or be kidnapped.

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563715#Comment_121563715

Shocking by such a 'democratic' state surrounded by 'barbarians'.

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563773#Comment_121563773

They seem to have taken him at his word.

Rezident

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121562899#Comment_121562899

Ireland is an outlier. Al Jazeera did a documentary on how European countries are biased against Palestinians, from a radical Islamic perspective anyway. They cited Germany, for obvious reasons, and France, strangely, but they did praise one and only one European country for being pro-Palestine: Ireland.

When you are singled out for this dubious accolade by AL JAZEERA, then you're nowhere near being balanced on this one. How did you end up on the same side as Hamas!? Look, I get that Ireland signed up for the 'we were oppressed by the British too' thing with Palestinians. But when you find out what they did to the women alone on October 7, shooting female soldiers directly in the vagina (and breasts), gang raping and mass raping women, girls and children, driving nails and knives into women's private parts, cutting off women's breasts, Ireland did not sign up for that insanity. The enemy of your enemy is not necessarily your friend.

We know radical Islam hates, inter alia, the Jews, but why do they hate women so vehemently? So violently? This is insane what the Palestinian men have done, we can only imagine the suffering of the Palestinian women living with these 'men'.

Do you know what the Palestinian men did to women on 7 October? Do you know the depths they went to? It is beyond beyond the Pale.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67629181

Frank Grimes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563950#Comment_121563950

I'm genuinely curious, what is your motivation for constantly equating all Palestinians with Hamas? Do you genuinely believe this or is it something you think makes you come across as edgy, or 'sticking it to the left' like other posters seem obsessed with doing?

Wolf359f

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563847#Comment_121563847

I'm surprised Israel didn't drop a 2000lb bomb though. I guess some civilians are more innocent than others.

They have shown they can do a surgical strike while minimizing civilian casualties but they choose not to in Gaza.

Sudden Valley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563950#Comment_121563950

You call Ireland biased but you have been constantly displaying selective outrage in your posting. You decry the rape of women on one side but not the killing of women on the other.

You can call us an outlier all you want but 130 countries voted against Israel's action. Perhaps you should consider why the view that Israel's actions are appropriate now is an outlier on the world stage.

nacho libre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563847#Comment_121563847

Escalation seems inevitable. We are closer to a full war breaking out now. Israel knew what it was doing. Hezbollah will look weak if it doesn't respond. The leader of Hamas must have sweat after he heard about this killing. I can't see the Israelis carrying out a strike like this in Qatar though.

Hey boy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563257#Comment_121563257

It is absolutely awful and I do mean it but I can understand why Israel need to stop the threat. No one has any idea how to stop the Hamas operatives within Gaza other than to go in there and engage in trench warfare basically. Hamas could end this tomorrow.

You are free to make stuff up about motives which you could not possibly know.

No comment on the Hamas part I note. Hamas can carry on. It’s the bad Israelis 100% to blame as usual. I spy a pattern.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121564205#Comment_121564205

"I can't see the Israelis carrying out a strike like this in Qatar though."

I wouldn't rule it entirely out either. In October 1985 the Israeli airforce carried out Operation Wooden Leg which resulted in the destruction of the PLO's HQ in Tunis which is 2000 km from Israel. I'm not suggesting that drones or fighter jets will be deployed against potential targets in Qatar, but if Israel wants to get them, they will.

SeanW

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563671#Comment_121563671

Yes, screaming racist is popular in certain quarters, but the poster is correct. South Africa is a hellhole that every level the problems of which include - but are far from limited to - a horrifyingly corrupt and incompetent government. Their public services are so bad that South Africans don't really even have electricity any more, with many having electricity for just a few hours a day. Crime is through the roof and SA is one of only two countries (the other being Lesotho which is surrounded entirely by SA) from Sub-Saharan Africa to feature in the Top 15 by murder rate. Even though Africa generally is thought to have problems, South Africa is by far and away worse than just about any other African country excluding those at war.

So SA is not exactly a moral authority on anything.

Is South Africa Becoming a Failed State? (youtube.com)

Hey boy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563827#Comment_121563827

Thanks for replying.

It is however the same thing all over again. The IDF should not do this or that but no alternative approach provided it seems. Israel cannot sit by with such an active threat next door. What other state would, especially following an invasion such as that of 7th June?

Hamas could end this tomorrow.

Hey boy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563858#Comment_121563858

Show me the post and I will comment on it for you.

Hey boy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563874#Comment_121563874

This was said before and a screenshot was provided.

Hey boy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563888#Comment_121563888

Hmmm, ‘at what point would you fight back’ etc etc sounds like justification to me and that was only a few pages back.

ceadaoin.

Sure we had one guy until recently, constantly going on thinly veiled anti semitic rants, claiming that Hamas are a "liberation group" and that the murders and rapes were made up. But yeah, no one supports Hamas 🙄 and that's not even counting the blatant ones from the start of the thread, which I have provided evidence of on several occasions already when the faux naive "who's supporting Hamas? I haven't seen it" comments come back again. As far as I'm aware, the one who explicitly praised Hamas was a regular poster? The name seemed familiar to me anyway

Sudden Valley

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121564318#Comment_121564318

Probably one of the many posters (I count at least 40) who have been banned from this thread. But if you cant think of one name off the top of your head it cant be that many. Especially considering there are certain posters here constantly referring to anti-Semitism being prevalent in Ireland.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121564264#Comment_121564264

That still sounds like they are talking about Hamas attacking the IDF ('fighting back')......I'm not sure how that could be construed as encouraging the murder of innocent Israeli civilians or raping women.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121562111#Comment_121562111

Judging it with the benefit of 80yrs of hindsight and with the familiarity of modern day weapons, communications and military analysis, and tactics makes no sense.

If you bombed Dublin city and port you'd cripple the transport network of the entire country. It's a central hub in radial network. Similarly if you have divert vast resources from the front lines into defending a 2nd front behind the front live. How does that not have an effect. Its a nonsense argument that it had no impact.

I'm not sure why you'd want to portray the allies as the bad guys in WW2.

Or what it has to do with the current conflict.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121562199#Comment_121562199

From both sides.

boetstark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121563671#Comment_121563671

If you can prove anything I said incorrect please go ahead.

The ANC have robbed an entire generation their aspiration to grow up and live in a safe prosperous country.

Hey boy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121564348#Comment_121564348

And that is exactly right but you need to tell such posters that, not me. I think you’ll find your interpretation of his/her comment is extremely generous and, if true, should have been made by him/her in the first place. It wasn’t but I and others made your point in reply, ie, the deliberate murder of innocents isn’t justified or resistance.

A point of agreement. Good.

Grayson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121564357#Comment_121564357

The post I was replying to said that they wanted Israel to be held to the same standards as the allies in world war 2. When it came to the allies targeting civilians, they had no standards. That was the point.

And the only reason the allies aren't considered the bad guys in WW2 was because the germans and japanese were so much worse. They started wars of aggression and committed genocide.

And at the time the allies knew t was wrong. In WW1 there was a lot made of how Germany was targeting civilians in Belgium. They had called out germany over blitzkrig in Spain. They were horrified by what the german soldiers did in Poland. It was already known that targeting civilians was wrong. in 1949 they amended the geneva convention to include the indiscriminate killing of civilians which would have included the firebombing of german cities and the dropping of nuclear bombs.

So yeah, we shouldn't hold anyone to the standards of the allies during WW2. They committed what would, only 4 years later, be called war crimes. If we held israel to the same standards they would technically be allowed drop two nuclear bombs on Palestine and apparently be free of guilt.

Timberrrrrrrr

More proof that Israel intends to steal Gaza for themselves.

https://twitter.com/Megatron_ron/status/1742308591803957668?s=19

https://twitter.com/Megatron_ron/status/1742308591803957668?s=19

Northernlily

Israel have gone way too far and this is nowhere near proportional.

They are an evil regime.

Hamas are scum, we get that and Israels Govt and the IDF are committing genocidal atrocities.

They should be sanctioned to the hilt and outcast from the international communities. Decent Israelis need to leave and live their lives in a decent country.

This period of time is a stain on our history.

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121564567#Comment_121564567

Considering what Hamas has done in Palestine over the last 20 years, since Israel left them to it, it wouldn't be surprising if Israel take control of Gaza.

Igotadose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121564575#Comment_121564575

Most other countries have expelled their Jews and worse. Where would you have them go? Add a few million people to Ireland?

And, to quote Golda Meir: "We have a secret weapon in our conflict with the Arabs: You see, we have no place else to go."

HTH

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121564477#Comment_121564477

So it wasn't a "war crime" in WW2.

Germany was still firing V2 rockets into London into 1945. Still massacring prisoners and civilians in 1945 in Europe. Japan was still massacring civilians in vast numbers in 1945. That's the context of everything else. Why would you only refer to one side in a conflict.

Both sides in this conflict are committing "war crimes". Hamas fired rockets into Israel on New Year's from Gaza. Obviously Israel response is disproportionate. Both sides are committing war crimes. Both sides keeping it going. For decades. Both sides are guilty.

The constant reference to WW2 and nuclear bombing is nonsense. Vastly more people are killed with conventional methods and in worse ways. But...but... the US.

Grayson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121564601#Comment_121564601

The post I was replying to said that they wanted Israel to be held to the same standards of the allies in WW2. So yes, I referred to the actions of the allies. Why would I refer to the actions of another combatant? The actions of the allies are the standards that they want Israel to hold so we need to look at the actions of the allies.

And yes, dropping a nuclear bomb on a city full of civilians is relevant. If that's ok for the allies to do, then it's right for israel to do. Because that's the standard that the poster set. The actions of the allies, without any exceptions were ok. So firebombing cities, dropping nuclear weapons etc is ok.

My point is that it's not OK. Israel should not drop a nuke on gaza. they shouldn't firebomb a city. They shouldn't carpet bomb a city full of civilians. What the allies did was wrong.

You may argue that at the time they had different standards. That it was not technically a war crime until after 49. I'd argue that they still knew it was morally wrong but did it anyway. However, even if we accept your argument, we now know that it was wrong. We now consider those things a crime. We now think that dropping a nuke or carpet bombing is immoral and should not be done. So we should not say that israel should be held to the same standards that we hold the allies in WW2.

And you'll notice I only mentioned the actions of the UK and US. I didn't even get into the war crimes committed by the USSR. I'm pretty certain that no-one is advocating the mass starvation of POW's or the mass rape of Palestinian women.

Israel should do better than the allies did. We should hold israel to a higher standard. And this is the point where someone usually points out what hamas did. Yes, what they did was horrific. Hamas should be fought. Hamas should be defeated. That doesn't mean that israel should pursue strategies that involve the killing of civilians.