"I started a joke, that started the whole world ......" | Ireland v New Zealand.

AbusesToilets

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256369#Comment_121256369

I didn't like POM slagging Cane last time out, felt cheap and ungracious. One thing to give it back to a dose like Coles, but to be a **** in general is lame

ersatz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256369#Comment_121256369

In fairness the no dickhead thing was always PR, they've never had a problem selecting guys who've beaten up their partners for example. By most measures that would qualify someone for the dickhead category. For me Ioane has always been their poorest back, he can run with the ball and is a very good winger but at 13 we have always taken advantage of him, see Bundie's try on Saturday for another example.

TheRona

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256369#Comment_121256369

In my eyes, if Irish rugby supporters who love to "Shhhhh" everyone in the crowd out of 'respect' for a kicker, but can't afford such respect for the Haka, then Reiko is well within his rights to ask where their voices have gone. I find it amusing.

downtheroad

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121255219#Comment_121255219

Coaching ticket. It must be one of the worst rugby phrases, and there are plenty.

ScissorPaperRock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256391#Comment_121256391

I also think it's one thing to have words between players, during a game, but in Ioane's case it was after the whistle, and directed at the crowd. It wasn't on TV but the the touch judge even ran over to stop him as he started strutting towards the crowd with his arms open and chest puffed up (before the 'shushing').

Sam Cane made his statement through his actions on the pitch this weekend, and you have to respect that.

ScissorPaperRock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256422#Comment_121256422

That's fair enough, but most Kiwis I saw say anything about that before the game seemed to say that it wasn't considered disrespectful and that it was just a response to the challenge. Afterwards more people seem to be raising it as an issue in the context of Reiko's actions.

ersatz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256422#Comment_121256422

I know a lot of Kiwi rugby people and absolutely nobody feels like this. It's not a religious ceremony, it's a sports event ffs.

TheRona

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256470#Comment_121256470

Oh, I agree. People can do what they want, including making noise when someone is kicking. It doesn't bother me.

standardg60

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256422#Comment_121256422

I'm ok with it, to the victors go the spoils and the bragging rights, we bragged last year and bragging will always come back to haunt you. It's another instalment in the developing rivalry between the teams, NZ having lost the last two probably had more incentive to win the current, it's going to ebb and flow. I know Johnny said this defeat made the series win irrelevant but it really doesn't, that accomplishment and the hurt it caused will always stand, and vice versa for this one. Some will say this is the one that matters but on a personal level for the players i would count them equal.

Watching the rugby pod earlier i thought the point made about NZ being fresher for this match was telling, we were out on our feet for the last 20, the circumstance of the draw and the fixtures had an affect no matter how you look at it. Now it's worth wondering whether both the Saffers and to a lesser extent NZ are going to be gassed against English and Argentinian teams who have had an easy ride.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256620#Comment_121256620

I think ‘rotation’ might be the biggest takeaway lesson for us at this WC.

ersatz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121255401#Comment_121255401

This video analyst guy is a major bluffer, I don't believe Ive ever heard anything form him that stacks up.

swiwi_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256232#Comment_121256232

Most ungracious? LOL. Aside from Jacovs, all other SA fans seem to do is come and take a dump on this forum. Rugbymad and company. Kiwis on this forum are few and far between but we do try and contribute. As an aside, would people generally describe Irish fans as gracious losers? At the Paris pub on Saturday I presented my genuine commiserations to an Irish lady in her sixties. Thought she might shoot me, the look I got. The lippy NZ players would be Coles and Ioane. But Ireland can really have no complaints. Sexton is never short of something to say and POM has his moments too. My favourite Irish players are ringrose and Keenan - really intelligent footballers. Cant really understand kiwis with no family ties such as Irish parents or grandparents signing up to play their country of birth. Especially 2 lads with Māori blood given a section of Irish fans never stop giving out about the haka. But there we go.

standardg60

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256640#Comment_121256640

Completely agree, many capable and fit players were underused against the weaker teams.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256712#Comment_121256712

I find the SA crew grand and the rest of the Kiwis. The only Kiwi who ever made a cheap shot at me was you, and the reason seemed to be I wasn't concerned enough about the demise of Australian rugby😅Your concern for my mental health was touching. I was new to the forum and you seemed to feel you could throw your weight around a bit. You needn't worry I'm well balanced😂

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256752#Comment_121256752

As the days go on the more I think it was critical.

And I was ok with Farrell sending out the full team for the pool games.

Faith in our squads ability rather than the A team might be the key we are looking for.

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256712#Comment_121256712

Personally, I think I'm a delight. But yeah SA fans have the top step of the pedestal all on their own.

I'm absolutely here for the spite from NZ, as far as I'm concerned it just means we have properly made it on the international stage. They just don't care about Wales/Scotland.

standardg60

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256879#Comment_121256879

Me too, in the heat of the moment i was one of the first to call it a bottling, but looking back to Beirne running the length of the field to score a last minute meaningless try against Romania in that heat and contrasting him to receiving the ball from Murray in what the 32nd phase late on against NZ and just standing still only able to raise an arm to absorb the tackle has made me think again.

Seemingly two Irish players played every minute of every game, Keenan was one, was Beirne the other? That is just too much.

downtheroad

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121256752#Comment_121256752

South Africa played scrum halves on the wings against Romania. They got the job done.

We played pretty much a full strength team against the same useless opposition.

Very very foolish by the management.

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121257076#Comment_121257076

South Africa had just played the ruqby championship. we were coming in from the off season with players having played only 2 or 3 games before the worqld cups started.

It wasnt foolish. would it have been better to have more players going in cold with having played even less before the biggest game of pool stage?

Buddy Bubs

The reactions from some posters are a bit over the top. Just read through last 10 pages or so. Ireland had a good tournament, didn't put a foot wrong until Saturday when unfortunately there are no 2nd chances.

Personally, I think the vast majority of people I talked to underestimated NZ hugely, mainly because of their performance v SA in Twickenham, for which they apparently only landed in England the day before. They beat SA convincingly in rugby championship like only they can. Yes, they lost 1st match v France but were in a group where they scored 96 pts against the 3rd placed team so were always getting out of that group.

And remember our series win, they scored 40+ pts in opening test in Auckland against us. So they can turn it on for sure.

The current NZ 23, if they get their act together, have a higher ceiling than any other in the tournament IMO. They may not win it, but I make them favourites. If it comes to pass, I hope they force SA to play rugby like France did by scoring early.

downtheroad

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121257087#Comment_121257087

Yes very foolish. Look at the end result, an absolutely shattered team knocked out in the quarter finals.

There is a squad for a reason. Across the Romania and Tonga games it could have been arranged for every player to play and also therefore rest.

These guys play together so frequently they didn't need glorified run outs against 2 filler teams to knit as a unit.

I think Farrell will learn a lot for 2027 if he's around. But the question arises whether we have the depth to do what South Africa did.

We ended up having to play the full team v the Scots because we thought they were better than they were.

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121257094#Comment_121257094

Would we have done better with players not having the game time built up needed to peak in a 1/4?

We primarily needed our main players to get game time to be best prepped for the bigger games. The players didnt need game time to get together as a unit but to get minutes in the legs. in any other year bar a world cup year we would be aiming to peak for games far later than September/October.

awec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121257103#Comment_121257103

Scotland game wasn't really the issue. We would have played the full team against Scotland no matter what, they're a tier 1 team.

We probably could have rotated more for the Tonga / Romania games.

Things were complicated a bit though by Sexton's ban meaning he really had to play those games, O'Brien being injured for the early games, and Conan being injured for the early games.

Cill94

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121257010#Comment_121257010

I don't personally subscribe to this fatigue theory. Keenan had a good game on Saturday. Aki also had started every game, and was probably our standout player. We are also probably the luckiest team so far with injuries, which is a major indicator of our fatigue being low.

Saturday's game was just an exhausting affair, that had both teams out on their feet by the end. If Barrett isn't under that ball and we don't have to go 37 phases, nobody is talking about fatigue. It had the most ball in play time of any RWC game this tournament, and chasing a game is particularly exhausting.

Bottom line is we got a nasty QF draw and NZ just performed better on the day. One of their best performances in years. It's the fact this team deserved more than a quarter final that makes it sting so much. France were in the same boat.

AbusesToilets

We definitely could have started lads like McCarthy, Baird, McCloskey, O'Toole and others in those 1st 2 games. Bringing Earls, McCloskey and Kilcoyne was also a mistake imo, another backrow forward, and utility back would've allowed for better rotation.

awec

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121257159#Comment_121257159

I think you can argue that bringing Conan was a mistake too. I'm not sure he'd have been brought if they'd known he'd be unavailable for 4/5 pool games.

AbusesToilets

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121257183#Comment_121257183

Agree on that, he was very good on the weekend, but can't honestly say it was worth the extra minutes it forced on Doris etc, when Prendergast or someone could've been playing instead

nacho libre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121257103#Comment_121257103

What was the reason for not playing the fringe players in the other games against Tonga and Romania ? Was Farrell afraid that momentum would be lost if they had poor performances against the so-called minnows? Perhaps Farrell didn't really believe he had the strength in depth to rest key players against the weaker teams.

One other question, was Kelleher being held up by Barrett purely a question of lacking the necessary strength to ground the ball? Would the likes of Furlong and Porter have had the power to get the ball down in that position?

AbusesToilets

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121257192#Comment_121257192

From rewatching, it looked like Kelleher allowed himself to get unbound from his blockers as they drove for the line. Just poorly done on his part. I'd wager Herring would've scored that tbh.