Voyager revisited - this time it’s Neelixy

Brian?

Ah Lt Carey haven’t seen you in a while…. aaaand he’s dead.

Evade

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122093757#Comment_122093757

Wasn't he in the previous episode? Seven's timetravel adventure, but only in the past segments.

Brian?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122094560#Comment_122094560

I don’t think so. But I could be wrong

Evade

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122094564#Comment_122094564

I thought Relativity was in season 7 but it's not.

Marlay

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121911800#Comment_121911800

It does sort of end up being built around a single character for quite a while though, well ok, two at least: Seven and the Doctor. It just alternates between them, or has both. Usually something along the lines of:

Janeway: Seven/Doctor I order you not to….
Seven/Doctor does it anyway
Janeway: Well I guess you were right. I've really learnt a lesson here.

Brian?

finished it. Enjoyed the rewatch. Might do it again some day.

Not as good as Next Generation or DS9, but a hell of a lot better than any new Trek.

Evade

You should do Enterprise next

Brian?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122104816#Comment_122104816

that’s the plan.

Inviere

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122104796#Comment_122104796

The logical conclusion really, it's a good show, has its flaws, but there's some great Star Trek in there. Same for Enterprise.

Rawr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122094652#Comment_122094652

I'm guessing that was down to them being clued into Seven and The Doctor being popular. It does become a bit obvious in the later couple of seasons with the frequency of Doctor-centric episodes.

My rewatch has me currently in Season 6 and just past Unimatrix Zero. God that was such a teaser of an episode. I still remember my first watch of Part 1 and being blown away at how they managed to make the Borg seem dangerous again. That week between the 2 parts had me in wonder…..aaaaand then they pissed it all away. Assimilation wasn't a big deal anymore when you take a special hypospray. The Borg are also shockingly stupid too.

• The Tactical Cube knocks out Voyager's shields…and no drones beam onboard to assimilate the ship
• The Tactical Cube has a surprisingly hard time fighting Voyager, when a Classic Cube can take out a fleet of 40+ ships.
• Despite going to the effort of assimilating Janeway, her new arch enemy, the Borg Queen doesn't check straight-away to see if she has joined the hive-mind. Let's Janeway & Co. wander freely on the Cube and mess about with ther Borg Vinculim.
• Even when Janeway and Torres are caught again by the Borg, they seem to just forget and Torres and let her just wander around the Cube again. She ends up sabotasjing the ship again.

They're just so stupid at this stage. The writing before gave at least some excuse for Voyager to have a shot against Borg ships, but in Unimatrix Zero they mostly survive because the Borg have seemed to have forgottten how to Borg.

Inviere

Upon rewatches in recent times, I actually started to see the downfall of the Borg as far back as TNG.

You have the sheer brilliance of Q Who and BoBW which set the standard for the Borg. They should have let things settle there, and keep the mystique. But the follow on episodes, despite being brilliant episodes, really started the trend of 'humanising' the Borg (I, Borg and Descent), and we began the journey of moving away from this mysterious unstoppable force that couldn't be reasoned with.

Voyager gets flak for ruining the Borg, but I'd argue that process began a lot earlier than Voyager.

Rawr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122111255#Comment_122111255

Oh for sure. You even have First Contact being both an awesome movie rendition of the Borg, but also ruining them with the concept of a Borg Queen.

But yea, Voyager is sort of in the unfortunate position of being the late-TNG show that got sullied with the Borg by this point and if it had been DS9 or another Trek show, the problem probably would have been the same. I feel like the Borg sort of became Trek's version of the Daleks. A villain that is excellent in short well-spaced bursts, but just silly when overused.

Stark

The Borg Queen was really when the rot really started imo. The portrayal of the Borg in First Contact was great up until that point.

"Scorpion" was the last Voyager episode before the Queen was introduced afaik and up to that point the Borg appearances in Voyager had been quite decent.

If they simply had her as "the voice of the collective", the concept could have worked but the character was just so petty and small and individualistic. Like she would pay way too much attention to individuals like Picard, Seven and Janeway and held petty grudges against individuals instead of just treating them as tiny pieces of much larger objectives. Just another femme fatale character acting with small minded human impulses rather than the cold merciless intelligence of billions of voices.

McFly85

Yeah it was a disappointing direction to take with the Borg, essentially turning them into one woman’s vast army rather than a mindless collective.

Would have been cool to see Voyager learn to adapt to being around the borg(in a similar way to the Hansens), and eventually liberating the individuals rather than destroying them.

Rawr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122111762#Comment_122111762

Now that might have been really good. Essentially a season or two of them constantly trying to mask themselves from Borg detection based on the tricks the Hansens used. Then you'd occasionally have very high-stakes moments where The Borg would actually notice Voyager. The sort of creeping dread of being in the heart of Borg Space would have made for a very interesting new twist for Voyager.

But alas, much like Year of Hell, I doubt they had the bottle for a season-long arc like this.

LambshankRedemption

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122104796#Comment_122104796

Before Discovery, VOY was my least favourite.

In secondary school, a friend of mine leant me a video(VHS), of an episode he said I absolutely must watch, which I believe was called Timeless, it was a kind of Back to the Future type episode centering on Harry Kim and was enjoyable. In those days, the videos came with two episodes on them. The second episode was called the Adventures of Flotter, and was a Naomi Wildman centred episode involving the holodeck malfunctioning. 🙄

It didn't help my love or appreciation of VOY.

I've tried to do a rewatch of DS9 about twice, and I know there is some really great episodes to come, but the first couple of the seasons have too much religion stuff in it and I get bored.

I really should sit down and do a Voy watch. It wont be a re-watch because I never watched all of it.

Unpopular opinion probably, but I despise the use of Q in both TNG and VOY, and anywhere else he pops up.

Inviere

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122279907#Comment_122279907

I'm a bit of a Voyager apologist, but man, that Flotter stuff was shocking.