Ireland Under-20 2024 Team

realhorrorshow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122379822#Comment_122379822

Seems like a decent crop with some obvious prospects (Gleeson, Gavin), some who have the athleticism but are still raw (Smyth, Edogbo, Moloney, O'Connor), and plenty who seem to have a ceiling somewhere between good pro and potential international (Sheahan, O'Connell, Ward, Coffey, Murphy, Berman, Treacy, etc.). Some decent looking u19s there also.

johnh6767

Beaten by a better team no shame in that , Gleeson a true pro, so impressive, much to take heart from

conquestscarer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122379843#Comment_122379843

Was solid last year tbf.

Clegg

Decent showing from the u20's this year, but I think it's fair to say that last seasons front row and half backs were significantly better than this years.

sligeach

FFS. Wrong thread.

johnh6767

France are in another league altogether they have taken apart the NZ team that beat them only 2 weeks ago. Based on today, it’s a French win although anything can happen at this age group which is so full of unexpected surprises

sligeach

FFS. Again!

FrannoFan

Read France missing up to 9 players they could have had involved and another couple to injury.

Rugby in France in a pretty healthy place

johnh6767

France in a very healthy place and this French team not close to the French team we saw in Capetown last year so the 9 players missing explains that. It’s more of 6N equivalent team from last year. But still the top performers. If England can reduce their error count which against Ireland was very high at important moments they could hold them to a contest

arsebiscuits1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122380320#Comment_122380320

Very much so.

Age grade rugby only gives you an ~18 month window of players to choose from. Some years are invariably going to be better than others.

Scrumhalves:

Gunne vs Coffey - Different players to be fair. Coffey more like Murray, Gunne like JGP (to oversimplify). Gunne certainly the stronger prospect

Outhalves:

Prendergast vs Murphy - With full credit to Murphy and his ability, Prendergast in a different league

Looseheads:

Boyd/ Calvey vs McCarthy/ Hadden - last years crop were much superior scrummagers with a lot to offer around the park. This years crop a distant second in both depts

Tightheads:

Bell/ Mullan/ Sparrow vs Foxe/Barrett - given Mullan and Sparrow are both U19 still (is Sparrow actually?) there is still hope there. Foxe certainly was a late bloomer in the 20s year before showing some serious scrummaging prowess and busy around the field. Last years crop vs this year here is closer but last year probably shades it.

There are some ambi props there such as Boyd, Bell and McCarthy but I put them in where I think they'll play senior.

Hooker:

Sheahan vs. McCarthy - To their credit, I'd have them very very close. McCarthy probably shading it but Sheahan was a surprise (to me) how well he went this RWC. His throwing and work around the park were both fantastic.

Hey_Ho_Lets_Go_3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122382798#Comment_122382798

Sparrow is u20. But young for his age group, turns 20 in November IIRC.

Shehal

The saying "no scrum, no win" isnt a saying for nothing…I just find it remarkable how you can have such a big pack and be so utterly horrendous upfront at scrum time, if I'm not mistaken we've been 2nd best at Scrum time in every game this season bar Wales & Scotland (and even then we were sent backwards a couple of times) and the last 20 versus Italy in the first JWC game.

I honestly wonder what is being done on the training paddock when it comes to scrums, do they even practice them at all? They were so horrendous from start to finish in this area against England to the point I dont think it can just be put down to how powerful England were in this area.

It's a testament to Ireland they were able to stay competitive as long as they did despite this obvious deficiency but once we didnt fix the scrum this result was always likely to happen regardless of how good we were in other area's.

Hopefully we can beat NZL now and claim 3rd at the very least, I cant imagine the NZL scrum will be as good as France/England or even Georgia so if we can get parity in this area we should have a good chance.

arsebiscuits1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122382848#Comment_122382848

Definitely a combination of ability and coaching.

There's no way around the fact that Englands front 5 are generational at this level. Opoku has already played in Europe (including against Leinster where he gave Healy some trouble)

But Ireland looked poorly coached. Second rows packed down way too high. Inconsistent drive from all 3 rows. Different heights, angles etc.

Hey_Ho_Lets_Go_3

Aaron Dundon is the forwards coach... Not sure he is that great a coach. They have no dedicated scrum coach either so he is presumably double jobbing. Not great.

Dubinusa

It's disappointing to say the least. I suppose finishing 4th or 3rd is ok. Scrummaging is poor. Last years lads were better.

Chico Flores

Think we can be a little critical, we all want the 20s to go well, but fact is most won't even have pro careers really. If we can get 5/6 from a year that can be starters at pro level and 2/3 that can push for internationals, thats pretty good

3/4th in world is more than fine for me - scrum was really bad but at same time we just don't have the lads consistently massive size and England just had more power, such is life. Possibly gone back a little under Faloon but at same time its not end of the world

snotboogie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122383478#Comment_122383478

Seems a bit pessimistic. Looking at 2019 squad, you have Casey, Flannery, Healy, Byrne, Ahern, Baird, Hodnett, McCann, Clarkson, McKee, Milne, Murray, Wycherley, Deeny, Hackshaw, Moloney and Penny who are all either starting level URC players or likely to get there in the next year or two. Ryan would have been in that group too if not for injuries. That's 17 players from one year. From that group Baird and Casey are already well established internationals. Byrne has been capped. Hodnett, Ahern and Penny have been unlucky not to be capped yet. Healy has 6 Scotland caps. It's still possible that someone like Flannery, Murray, Milne or McCann could make the jump to international.

I'd say that 5/6 being URC level starters and 2/3 being capped would be a poor enough year.

durthacht

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122382798#Comment_122382798

How do you think Usanov compares to the loose heads you have mentioned?

Chico Flores

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122383792#Comment_122383792

I think that was an elite year to be fair, I take the point but with the influx of talent from those years and the likes of Crowley and co only being mid 20s, you're not gonna get the same amount in every year. We only have 4 times - you're gonna have good years and years a little less

arsebiscuits1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122383800#Comment_122383800

Usanov had a tough time himself in 6 nations but again that's a moot point when you're up against those English and French packs.

He was good enough to start as an Under 19s prop which is an impressive feat.

Players who get 2 years at this age grade invariably improve the second year, look at Gavin, Prendergast, O'Connell, Gleeson (maybe a generous example as he missed most of his second year) etc.

As an U19, Usanov is/was an average at best scrummager. Given how Ireland props have by and large gone, the trajectory would be he comes back next year as a good but not fantastic scrummager.

Starting next season starting for Tarf in AIL (if selected) will do him a world of good

Hey_Ho_Lets_Go_3

Usanov was playing AIL for Clontarf this season as a 18 year old.

FtD v2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122383908#Comment_122383908

Yeah, it's a fair point. Evan O'Connell and Hugh Gavin looked like nice players last season as U19s, but both of them made material leaps coming into this year. Their physical conditioning was miles better and they had matured significantly as players too.

Would be fantastic if Usanov, Spicer, Corrigan, Calvey etc could progress in the same way over the next 6-8 months.

Dubinusa

Spicer is interesting as he's not athletic or powerful. He's still finding his way. He has improved since the 6nations and hopefully continues to do so. My guess is, he'll be likely 3 to 5 years away from where he will be fluid and peaking. Still, he's been doing nicely.

ljsulster

In my opinion:

Future internationals:

Gleeson

Gavin

Ward

O’Connell

Good Provincial careers

Edogbo

Walker

Hopes

Mckillop

O’Connor

Treacy

Murphy

De Klerk

Boyd

Hey_Ho_Lets_Go_3

So no leinster player from this age grade will make it? Interesting.

conquestscarer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122384694#Comment_122384694

I'd be pretty confident Moloney at the very least will be a good provincial player. Had a torrid time with injury but looked class at his one appearance at this level.

ljsulster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122384694#Comment_122384694

I didn’t include Spicer or Usanov as they are u19

Just feel there is better coming behind Coffey and McLaughlin

Forgot about Moloney- depends if he can stay fit

Dubinusa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122384620#Comment_122384620

I don't think there's any international quality among this group, bar Gleeson. Last year there was quality. A lot of quality. I don't include Gavin as he was from last years crop.

johnh6767

…..unfair to compare with last year team which was a treasure trove of gemstones , but Gleeson & Gavin standout for sure , and beneficiaries of being on their 2nd U20 campaign.

I hope they can get a bronze from their next game , NZ will be up for revenge after such a thumping from France who have to be hot favourites now to take the Cup again. And that’s with a few top talents missing from selection which is indicative of the rude health their under age squad are enjoying . Out boys will be keen to end on a high fingers crossed

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122385026#Comment_122385026

Gavin is this years crop as this is his actual age group and dismissing the entire squad as not international squad is just ignorant, wrong and ridiculous. Even squads that finish 7th/8th/9th in this have had good international quality players. This side is 3rd/4th so should likely have more.

Any way as we're 3rd or 4th we'll have new Zealand, Italy and Georgia in our group next year