Did it ever make sense to move from an old combustion car to a new EV

User1998

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388518#Comment_122388518

Talk about moving the goal posts😂

tom1ie

The EV would have a very limited range though.
My point is to get an EV that has a decent range you’re going to need a large pile of cash or a loan.
An ICE can do the range for a relatively small amount of cash vs an EV.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388530#Comment_122388530

No it’s all linked though.
If you need an EV to do long range it’s expensive to buy so most people need a loan.
An ICE can do the range for a relatively small amount vs the cost of purchasing a long range EV- therefore no loan.
So in groundbreaking news no loan is cheaper than loan when considering running costs for the car.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388518#Comment_122388518

If you need 700km from a tank in one go then don’t buy an EV. It’s that simple. Posting the same crap weekly doesn’t change that.

josip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388327#Comment_122388327

Here we go again…

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388756#Comment_122388756

You don’t have to read or comment on it if you don’t want.
I also don’t think I post this weekly I’m far too busy for that 🤣

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388790#Comment_122388790

Ohh you do. I’m sure others will contest to that. The age old argument you have with the cost of loans against the cost of maintaining that cheap diesel you mention. That cheap diesel you buy for €10k is fine but the cost to fuel, tax, and service it may service a loan for a better, newer, safer EV.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388805#Comment_122388805

ok can you link to the post where I stated that last week or the week before etc etc. 🤣

The savings on fuel on an EV are wiped out by repaying the loan you’d need for an EV with decent range.
Tax or service makes no dent in that either.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388779#Comment_122388779

🤣🤣

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388827#Comment_122388827

So it all balances out except you have a new, safer, more efficient, better tech, more sustainable car. All for the same outlay. Glad we can agree on that.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388533#Comment_122388533

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388548#Comment_122388548

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388518#Comment_122388518

This gets more ridiculous by the minute.

First you said it was cheaper for an ICE, then you said not if you buy a new ICE v new EV

Now you are saying you meant all along it was cheaper for an ICE and not for an EV. Even if buying new

You have contradicted yourself multiple times. Maybe just give up as you don't seem to have a clue what you are talking about

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388831#Comment_122388831

nah I think your agreeing with yourself there chief.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388854#Comment_122388854

Nah chief.
So the moral of the story is still some EV’s are cheaper than ICE and some ICE and cheaper then EV. Sound.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388882#Comment_122388882

sure dude. If your happy to think that work away.

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388790#Comment_122388790

I think you post the same point about EVs and loans more frequently than once per week. This has been covered many, many times. A 10 grand EV can’t do 700km on a single charge. Neither can my bladder. People should buy whatever makes most sense for them. For me, it’s a longer range EV. For you, it’s an old Diesel with no loan on it. For others, I don’t know/care unless someone is asking.

Charles Babbage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388827#Comment_122388827

All of which assumes that you are the type of person that borrows money to buy a car.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122389052#Comment_122389052

So all the other posters calling you out on it must be going made too. Sure dude. Maybe it’s everyone going mad except you 🤷

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122389089#Comment_122389089

absolutely.
If you’ve 25k cash to buy a second hand Tesla that will do the job or even 40k cash to buy a new Tesla well then fair play.

tom1ie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122389116#Comment_122389116

Yes because a few posters that are driving EVs have a different opinion to me it must mean I’m going mad.
No offence but I think I’ll ignore your diagnosis Dr gumbo 🤣

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122389118#Comment_122389118

With interest rates at present you’d be better buying with HP at .9% from Tesla and lodging all your €40k into N26 savings at 4%. Pay back the loan instead of saving that.

I personally don’t do loans or HP so can’t comment too in depth on that front but each person should use the mechanism that suits them best. Some may pay €400 a month on a car loan and other will spend €400 a month on smokes 🤷

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122389124#Comment_122389124

That’s what the mad hatter said to his doctor before……

Ir3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388327#Comment_122388327

The reason people have a problem with what you are saying is because it has no logic. For instance you compare a used ICE to a new EV, basically implying that someone may think its cheaper to buy a new 40k EV instead of a 10K Diesel/Petrol.. Talk about stating the obvious. If you are going to say that well then if you buy a 10k Petrol then I can say oh you are daft doing that cos you should buy a 5k Diesel, so nobody ever buys a nice car, we all drive rusted out death traps cos they are cheap.. I bought a new car as I had been driving a 15 yr old 320d that blew 2 turbos in the space of 4 years as it was doing local mileage that was not suited to Diesel, so when I decided on treating ourselves to a new car it quickly became apparent that EV would suit us best, 7000km later and we have public charged once in Ireland. So in a like for like situation yes EV is cheaper! and from an absolute petrol head who looked at countless ICE before switching I can say in my opinion that our car is also a much nicer drive than any comparable every day ICE option. Ireland is a sh1t show when it comes to being a car enthusiast and no petrol head could ever say they actually want to drive a diesel! it has always been an option forced on us through taxation. EV has now been forced on me through Taxation but the performance and comfort are real positives.

Norrie Rugger Head

Are people STILL trying the line that it's more expensive or environmentally damaging to move to a NEW EV?

Christ, the only comparison which is like for like is if you need to buy a new car and are looking at ICE new and EV new. EV is, by far, the better option

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122390964#Comment_122390964

Yes, heard it the other day at work, I just called him a wally and walked away

liamog

I remember the days when the Kona came out and people would argue about it costing €15k over the petrol version, the price premium was closer to €8k when you matched the available equipment. Now a petrol Kona (Elegance) is €37,545, the 48kWh EV €36,995 and the 65kWh €40,995. All nicely in the range where people can just decide which drivetrain suits them instead of being driven by cost.

Red Silurian

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122388518#Comment_122388518

This is true, and at our motorway speed limit of 120km/h it would take just 5h50m to cover 700km. Most people would take a break after 2h driving for safety purposes though

Important to note, 10k on an EV would get you a Leaf40 or an ioniq28 so you'd be looking at about 200km range, the average car travels 50km a day so that's equivalent to 4 average days driving

MojoMaker

Time for the Bingo Card I think.

CMOTDibbler

Such a nonsensical question. Not even sure what it's trying to prove or elicit. You might as well ask does it make sense to move from an old car to a new car.

Well yes it does. If you have the money and are tired of forking out for ever-increasing cost of repairs. Or just want something new. Everyone who buys a new car is clearly getting rid of an old car. It's kind of axiomatic. What choice of new car propulsion system is entirely personal to the buyer and their particular use case.

Buddy Bubs

If your older car isn't costing you 500 a month in tax, repairs, NCT, fuel over and above what those things cost in a new car that will depreciate and have finance charges of 6k a year then financially it's not worth it.

If it's not costing you 1000 a month in those things then it's not worth buying a car that will depreciate and have finance charges of 12k a year.

That's the only question to ask yourself.

It's simple maths to answer the question in OP

Everyone's will be different

My own case, bought a new cupra born in 2022 to replace a 2014 Audi A6.

Fuel is down by about 150 a month, tax down by 15 a month, NCT down by 5 a month, repairs and servicing for Audi I had budgeted 1000 euro a year or about 80 a month and hoped nothing big went wrong

So the monthly savings are about 250 a month

Audi was depreciating at about 2 to 3k a year or guess so that's about 225 a month at midpoint of depreciation.

Cupra was bought without a loan so no finance charges but it has depreciated about 18k in 2 years or about 750 a month up to now or about 500 more than the Audi depreciation.

So it's currently costing me about 500 in excess depreciation lessened by about 250 in reduced recurring running costs which overall is an extra 250 a month over the 8 year old Audi I moved out of.

Worth it? Probably, yes it is, to me. I prefer the EV to be honest. Newer tech, better drive, although less comfortable.

Depreciation will slow down over time too making each passing year I keep it more of a financially sound decision, assuming, of course, nothing goes wrong with it.

That's what you have to consider if it's worth it or not.

But you're unlikely to see more money in your pocket ever by changing cars unless in some rare cases of unreliability or in high mileage cases moving to more fuel efficient cars.

mr chips

We're looking at leasing an EV through my other half's salary sacrifice scheme here in NI (once the tortuously slow process of setting it up is finally complete!). We're still trying to narrow it down from a few options - 2 year old Kia EV6, 2.5-3 year old Model 3 Long Range, 1 year old Kia Niro EV, 2 year old Kia eNiro (old shape) possibly even a new Hyundai Kona. Our annual mileage is around 10-11k miles (16-17k km) p.a., but we need something capable of completing a regular 450km trip we take in winter with just one short charging stop somewhere along the M7. This means that we have to consider range at/near motorway speeds in poor conditions, together with charging time en route and of course monthly leasing cost. Remaining warranty cover and rapid charging speed are also important.

We worked out that between fuel (the biggest cost), servicing & maintenance, tax etc, the old 2.0 diesel Mondeo we've been driving - and the old A6 2.0 TDi we had before that - were averaging a monthly cost of over £300stg per month. The most expensive monthly leasing option would be the EV6 at £364 per month, but even with paying for a certain amount of rapid charging on those long trips, that would only add about £75 per month to our overall motoring-related outgoings (we would be able to do some free charging from home using solar).

The 2 year old (previous shape) eNiro comes in at £275 per month, so it would actually save us money over continuing to run the Mondeo - if we could rely on that one to make those long trips in no more than 5 hours 15 minutes, including charging time - which is the one big question mark over it for us. But that's an exceptional use case - most people won't be making those long trips with an unmissable arrival time. So to answer the OP question - yes, it absolutely can make sense to go from an older ICE to a newer EV.

NB if anybody has an old-shape eNiro, I'd be very interested in hearing about your motorway range in winter!

Old diesel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122390434#Comment_122390434

I TOTALLY endorse the post above.

With the caveat that in my situation I just wanted an EV so tax wasn't a factor - was paying 280 quid or something for the diesel crapbox it replaced.

For context I was interested in diesels when most of today's diesel fans were hating them.

My being interested in diesels history included......

1) I enjoyed the Seat Malaga diesel I was a passenger in 1987. This wasn't entirely down to diesel engine - it was also the first time I was in a car with rear seat belts for example.

2) I got interested in Citroen BXs when a brochure for one turned up for me. Diesels are an important part of the BX story.

3) the diesel Sunny diesel 2.0 normally aspirated I learned to drive in - TWO of them*. Seemed to drive well enough engine wise (other aspects like steering very meh) - so you are quickly wondering just how good some of the better diesels would be.

The likes of Audi TDis, 6 cylinder BMW stuff like the E36, E34/E39 etc.

4) I enjoyed driving 1999 Corolla diesel and Daihatsu Fourtrack. Both crap box territory for typical modern diesel drivers.

Even with above history I still can't understand how you'd enjoy driving a modern diesel.

Making them ultra refined appealed to many drivers - but takes away the character an older diesel had.

And you are left with something that still has some rattle but is now dull.

Excellent (sarcasm)

*my 18th birthday present was 3 driving lessons. The driving instructor had a Sunny diesel N14 at the time. And our family car was also N14 Sunny diesel.

djan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122399660#Comment_122399660

All about that sweet sweet torque but to be honest that's where EVs shine!

Old diesel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122399792#Comment_122399792

To a point yes.

But while you still have the torque in a modern diesel. I think its more linear so less noticeable. As in it has less impact on enjoying the car.

Especially with more people driving autos.

Where older XUD and VW TDI stuff would give you an obvious jump in power when turbo kicks in.

Modern diesels usually have a smoother power delivery in comparison. Supported by the move to 7 to 9 speed type transmission.

Mind you my last experience of driving diesels full time was the Nissan/Renault 1.5 dci.

Ir3

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122399660#Comment_122399660

totally get your point, always remember driving a Citroen ZX Volcane which was my first experience of a turbo diesel and it was really impressive to me at the time but I just meant that an enthusiast will pick a petrol in a car you really want to drive.