2 out of 3 young adults living at home

con___manx1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121937236#Comment_121937236

The government will not let a massive increase in housing happen.

They are letting more and more educated immigrants in to the country. I work with an Indian guy. he told me Ireland has the cheapest student fees for foreign educated immigrants than any other. Its double the fees in the UK. 28000 euro. Here it's 14. Once these immigrants secure a job over 36000 salary they can get a visa. Stay here 5 years and permanent residency. These people will need houses aswell as our own and there will be a never ending supply of demand thanks to this government.

whisky_galore

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122105486#Comment_122105486

They need to attract people to actually build houses; tech bros and deliveroo drivers won't be doing that.

Idbatterim

there is effectively no property tax here and the cost of building is so high, they need to build cheaper studio's and one beds etc and not on greenfield, miles from anything, they need to start building this on brownfield and existing business parks etc, beside good rail links ideally…

relocate dublin port… and possibly redevelop east point business park for housing only…

Furze99

I see there's a growing trend for couples to try and take advantage of the 'vacant home' and 'derelict' grants scheme, worth €50k and €70k respectively. So people are searching around for doer uppers and hoping to get a house that way. But these schemes have drawbacks, first lots reporting that old cottages that were priced at say €60k last year typically are now being priced at say €100k and more - so the grant or part of it is being priced in by the vendors. Once past that hurdle, all the renovation work must be paid up front and then only on final inspection, does hopefully the grant come back. This all has to be in done in 13 months and there's a chronic shortage of tradespeople in many places. Where they are available, they're pricing the work high as well and of course cost of building materials has rocketed for everyone.

So these schemes probably suit those who already own property and/or those who can do a good bit of the work themselves. But they are not a good fit for couples trying to get a home as total costs likely exceed the average new build.

Lillyfae

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122111139#Comment_122111139

God it's depressing, isn't it? Any sniff of a rip off opportunity and they're off.

Electric Sheep

"There are more pros than cons to living at home. But being asked to fill up the dishwasher or make your bed can be a bit disheartening and frustrating for a 28-year-old."

Its's probably even more dishearting and frustrating for her parents that a 28 year old needs to be told, rather than naturally pitching in with the running of the household🙄

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122105486#Comment_122105486

Your Indian guy - did he fail to mention the free tertiary education in Germany. Ireland is hardly the cheapest. I have read of American students who can't afford college in the US going to Germany to study.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122103950#Comment_122103950

There is no easy answer on the construction side other than to encourage and facillitate more people to pursue trades and technical educations and that's got a significant lead time.

On the affordabilty side, there is a lot that could be done, but won't, given government on costs amount to about 50% of the cost of housing.

Both my children have IT related degrees, no jobs and live at home. Plus my sons friend who is autistic and has a biochemistry degree focused on genetics.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122112579#Comment_122112579

Yep, downsizing or rightsizing or whatever they call it, has gone a bit out of date. Upsizing will be more of a trend soon, extensions and garden rooms (lived in).

Viscount Aggro

Asian communities in the UK . They have their own thing going on. Either there live in a multi generational house - this works well, 3 generations living together. Another way they manage the housing market ... A few family members pitch in a few thousand each, to get someone on the property ladder.

flancmange

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122105491#Comment_122105491

You've got many a place designed for two people accommodating hilariously more people on floors and bunkbeds. And those landlords are raking it in. Those landlords in particular know precisely why they're getting so much. I doubt you'll be hearing a complaint from them ever.

Meanwhile, just as expected, the roll on effect on young irish people also being forced back into previously undesirable living conditions gathers pace.

Add in every other well known factor of, let's be honest, selling off quality of life of the many in exchange for the profit of the few, and you're essentially creating a powder keg of explosive reaction.

Society moves slowly, but it does react eventually, and it ain't going to calmed with some form of convoluted tax break or the yearly empty promises.

Idbatterim

If youre the vast majoroty of workers in ireland, young workers, pay is a joke for the cost of living, half your pay over 40k taken, 40k in reland today is a pittance... just emigrate...

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122112734#Comment_122112734

To where?

Potatoeman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122112579#Comment_122112579

There are loads of IT jobs, is there nothing they can get in the field for more experience?

ToweringPerformance

Build up and build an underground transportation system for Dublin. This was the solution 20 years ago and it's the solution now. The idiots in charge for the last 12 years have done the square root of sweet f all and we'll still be talking around in circles in another 20 years if we let them stay in power.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115233#Comment_122115233

How's that going to work? When I left, the infrastructure scandal of the day was the Port Tunnel. How's building a metropolitan underground network going to be remotely practical if they ballsed up building a tunnel?

For context, the London underground began life in 1863 and is still very much a work in progress.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115148#Comment_122115148

One has aspergers and isn't cut out to work in a company environment - of all disabilities in the UK, those with aspergers have the highest unemployment rate - 78%. Their expertise and interest is in game development, and In the past year game companies have been laying off tens of thousands of experienced and skilled workers, entire studios have been closed. Microsoft just closed the Arkane studio in Austin, that produced the Arkane games and Prey, this past week, along with another studio in Canada and one in Tokyo.

The layoffs are further devastating news in the gaming industry. An
estimated 10,000 people globally lost their jobs in the sector in 2023,
and that number is close to being matched already this year.

The other is facing that old saw of no one wanting new graduates, only those with years of experience and that being very niche in the specific tools the company uses, which don't happen to be those that were learned in college. One avenue for getting started in employment is often with the company you interned with during studies, but they even lucked out there as that company only has senior positions and interns and nothing in between, despite reporting to the college they over-achieved.

Also, not being near Dublin is a factor.

Potatoeman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115374#Comment_122115374

Online courses and maybe volunteer to do some IT training in an old folks home. It’s best not to be idle when not working, build up the CV.

SharkMX

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122112734#Comment_122112734

I emigrated 3 times :)

Living elsewhere is fine for a while, but ultimately Ireland is a good country to live in.

ToweringPerformance

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115294#Comment_122115294

You are right, let's never do anything and complain about everything. The Irish way.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115393#Comment_122115393

Not Idle. One is futhering their self taught Japanese formally. The other missed out on a NATO contract for a military simulator, despite having one mostly complete, not just a blank proposal. I did find them a job description they agreed was a 100% match for their skill set, apart from the currently serving in the Ukraine military bit. Most things I have read on volunteering is that it doesn't work and is a negative, if anything.

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115423#Comment_122115423

It's the Irish way, it's the internet way! Hell, most people won't even be bothered to visit their local TD's clinic and let them know how they feel about things. The funny thing is that it is actually fairly easy to effect change if you do actually do something about it because so few people to talk to their TD that the get a disproportionate amount of representation! If 15 people go into a TD's clinic with the same story he is likely to conclude that he needs to react and if you replicate that over 5 or 6 more TDs and you go t a movement!

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122112734#Comment_122112734

Well if you do you better get far more reliable information that this otherwise you'll be bitterly disappointed because Ireland's effective income tax rate is in the low half of the Europe tables.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115423#Comment_122115423

If you want change, you're going to have to make it happen. In 2024, you've more tools than ever before. Snarky comments aren't going to fix anything.

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115233#Comment_122115233

That is the absolute last thing the country needs! The country need a heavy investment in a nation wide network to encourage a strong movement out of Dublin in order to reduce congestion.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115486#Comment_122115486

In theory I agree but in practice it doesn't quite work out that way. Now our 'local' TDs clinics are an hours drive so you wouldn't exactly be popping over on a whim. But I am inclined to use that good old fashioned method of writing a letter. And you know what, I rarely get a reply from any of them. Thing is, if you've giving them a message that things aren't great as regards some matter, it doesn't support their position and goes in the bin. If on other hand, you compliment them, then you might not get a reply but get added to their mailing list and find some extra Christmas cards in your box. Make of that what you will.

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122105486#Comment_122105486

That would be the unelected government that does not represent the views of the people, but somehow manages to get to run the country after all????

Irish voters will not accept any housing solution that does not include them getting to own a house and furthermore that the value of that house should not decline after they acquire it otherwise they end up in negative equity. And the one thing you can rely on is that politicians will do what gets them elected. So you want that kind of change, then go talk to your neighbours about voting in a party that will result in putting them into negative equity and let us know how it goes.

ToweringPerformance

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115528#Comment_122115528

Nope. That's not the future. We need to build higher and smarter combined with proper sustainable transport including an underground. Said it 20 years plus ago and still stands true.

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115528#Comment_122115528

A nationwide network is useless without proper urban public transport to back it up.

Dublin and Ireland desperately need the metro, and also investment in Cork Luas etc.

Better trains to Cork are not going to solve anything,

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115586#Comment_122115586

True, there's a lot of low rise building between the canals in Dublin. Housing dating back to early 20th century and so on. In other cities a lot of that would have been cleared and regenerated by now. Replaced by more high rise. City planners thought of Dublin as a town for far too long and combine that with strong constitutional property rights and you end up with urban sprawls.

ToweringPerformance

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115612#Comment_122115612

Look at our skyline compared to most modern capital cities, is liberty hall still our tallest building and it's not even habitable for goodness sake. Our thinking is so backward.

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115713#Comment_122115713

It hasn't been the tallest building for quite some time.

We don't need skyscrapers, however we also shouldn't be building anything less than 7 or 8 stories in the city region. It's the mid-rise density building where we really fall down.

Wanderer78

fcuk the young, we dont need them anyway, as we can all work till we drop, ta hell with retiring and getting adequate health care as we age, just as long as property prices keep rising, happy happy days…..

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115568#Comment_122115568

An hour away could be three miles in some parts of Ireland if you don't drive.

Anyway, there's an election coming up. They'll be visiting you soon enough.

Good public transport to the satellite towns, build there and people will happily move out. **** public transport and a 90-minute commute five days a week and they're going to contribute to the crisis in the citier.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115852#Comment_122115852

One of the problems with 2 out of 3 young adults living at home is that it now masks a pre-existing problem — namely, those young adults that have always stayed at home, irrespective of the prevailing economic climate, because they choose not to become a productive member of society i.e. becoming a permanent expense to the state whilst not adding any economic value.

That cohort is now delighted that more young adults are staying at home because it now normalizes how they have lived / continue to live.

So whilst we can focus on the many legitimate reasons that more young adults are staying at home, let's not forget that there are many other young adults who refuse to integrate into society because they have effectively been mollycoddled into behaving and acting as immature man-children.

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115903#Comment_122115903

That cohort was always so small that it doesn't matter.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115903#Comment_122115903

Think you're trying to shoehorn something in here - these people are nothing to do with the housing crisis.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115903#Comment_122115903

…yup our educational, welfare and health systems have a hell of a lot to answer for by continually failing to meet the needs of many, which in turn leads to long term unemployment, addiction and mental health issues, tis a right mess alright….

funnily enough, some that are referred to 'man-children', in fact show some classic signs of developmental disorders such as 'austim', in which long term unemployment levels are commonly extremely high, some studies showing up to 70-80% of individuals with the disorder!

ToweringPerformance

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115807#Comment_122115807

How's the partial retirement Leo?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116027#Comment_122116027

For sure.

For the most part, young adults will continue to live at home all the while we have a rapidly expanding population — and by "rapidly", I mean on an unsustainable level that means housing can never become sufficiently available. Prices will continue to rise; it's a simple supply-demand relationship.

As long as that core problem remains unaddressed, this problem will continue to worsen. Though it seems that many people are unwilling to even acknowledge that this is an actual source to the problem, and that they are perfectly happy to wish that problem away.

I do think that small minority of people who always wish to remain at home must be tackled, but that too is a long-term problem.

Both need to be tackled, but I simply do not see the political will to address either.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116044#Comment_122116044

tis feckin great, and with an endless supply of taxpayers money, why didnt i do this sooner….

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116055#Comment_122116055

..jesus would yea stop with the neoclassical nonsense, house prices are largely due to financialisation of our property markets, and thats about it, thats the bloody core problem, its got little or nothing to do with anything else….

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116027#Comment_122116027

Autism in generally something someone is born with rather than developing later in life, but you have a point: it's not doing anything to help those who are autistic.

Man-children is something else - that IS something developed - but again, the situatoin is not helping. That said, some of the biggest man-children I know are those who do live away from home.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115511#Comment_122115511

I find this low taxation in Ireland a truly amazing feat of financial engineering. I wish I knew how it's done, as none of the major taxation components are on the low side of the average, quite the opposite, usually they are all quite a bit higher.

Ireland tops the league for the cost of taxing and insuring a car, and is second only to Holland for the cost of buying a new car. https://www.independent.ie/life/motoring/car-costs-in-ireland-are-close-to-highest-in-europe-survey-reveals/26223392.html

Ireland has the highest death taxes in world

Third highest CGT rate in EU at 33%, except for ETF’s, which is 41% and where losses can not be offset against gains - *ucking mind blowing. Ireland has some messed up taxation **** like VRT and DIRT, but this one…

4th highest vat rate in the EU

taxfoundation.org rates Ireland’s income tax component in it’s index as being the 4th highest in the EU in 2023:

An overall low taxation rate when so many individual constituents of the whole are so high, seems nothing short of a financial miracle

Just as well we are so lightly taxed, given…

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/2023/06/21/ireland-most-expensive-in-eu-for-consumer-goods-eurostat-finds/

ancapailldorcha

Housing isn't going to get fixed until people stop seeing it as a luxury investment and start seeing it as the necessity that it is.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122115903#Comment_122115903

I presume you realise that traditionally in Ireland, in particular with larger families that the eldest son tended to inherit the farm whilst the youngest daughter often stayed at home to help parents as they aged. That doesn't quite hold true now but in many households there'd still be an element of it. This comment above is to insult this cohort of people, particularly the carers, with a half baked slur.

cnocbui

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116416#Comment_122116416

It's not going to be fixed until councils are banned from buying existing housing stock and are forced to build their own, which would be twice as much housing, or half the cost, given their costs are 50% lower.

Nor is it going to be fixed while German REITS are allowed to buy existing housing stock, on which they pay no CGT or income tax. Not surprised they like to buy Irish when in Germany they are banned from buying from the market and have to build their own.

Ireland, the eternal housing mugs.

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116416#Comment_122116416

Housing isn't going to get fixed until we start building more housing!

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116529#Comment_122116529

But what's the point of building more if you're not going to lower prices? If you lower prices, you push a lot of people into negative equity which won't be politically feasible.

Podge_irl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116551#Comment_122116551

Building more will lower prices and yes it will push people into negative equity. Ultimately that is the only possible outcome of "fixing" the situation. Mind you there are subtleties with regards what is built, and a greater amount of apartments for example may not impact classic house prices so much.

For someone who is not planning to move in the near future, negative equity doesn't necessarily even matter all that much. In that respect I agree with you in terms of making people stop viewing it as a commodity.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122116622#Comment_122116622

I'm all for housebuilding but there are serious political difficulties. People with capital and those with mortgages are going to bitterly oppose anything that's going to reduce the value of their assets. There is already NIMBY problem with the current levels of housebuilding. Ramping that up is going to cause headaches no TD or councillor wants to deal with.