The 2024 All Ireland Senior Football Championship (Sam Maguire Cup)

blowitupref

Connacht GAA posted up before the match on Sunday that capacity of Hyde Park now is 23,000 and I think Roscommon GAA did like wise a few weeks ago. A little under 14k turned up and it was most crowded on the terrace side because those tickets was 20 euro compared to 30 for the stand.

megadodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122063085#Comment_122063085

Okay, we'll quietly ignore the spontaneous combustion issue in the Hyde then and hope nobody notices.

Now, seeing as you're making the Hyde out to be such a dangerous place for crowds to gather, answer me this question (a simple 'yes' or 'no' will do): In the event of a mass evacuation, would 85k people in Croke Park be able to get to 'relative' safety quicker than 25k would in the Hyde?

theoneeyedman

Yes.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122063735#Comment_122063735

It Would be certified by a qualified person, including systems for evacuation using enough qualified stewards.

If you can't understand the reason for proper crowd controls in this day and age, then I can't help you. Just use Google and look for crush disasters in sport stadia and other venues, like it's only 18 months or so since almost 150 were killed in a crush in Korea, and only a couple of years before that that those kids were killed in Tyrone.

Don't be a fvckin idiot.

flasher0030

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122063085#Comment_122063085

That is nonsense. I was in Hyde park last week. No danger there. If for any reason the stadium became overfull, and there was panic about some mysterious thing that was going to happen (I cannot for the life of me think of anything that would cause panic in that stadium), then people can just hop over the fence onto the football pitch for starters. And then there is the pitch just outside the main pitch which people can walk over to. It's only 18,000 people. Croke Park has over 80,000 people in a close proximity. If there was some disaster there, it would be much more difficult to get out of.

I don't know if you are being serious in your comments. If you are, then I don't know how you get out of bed in the morning time with the fear that there is a million to one chance that you might get hit by a bus.

YabaDabaDooley

Dublin -20 points on the spread to beat Offaly. I'm not going in to see it this weekend. The curtain raiser will be interesting to see if Kildare can raise a gallop. Louth seem a surer bet to win the prize to be hammered by Dublin in Leinster final.

dxhound2005

There is a bit of jeopardy for Louth, but they will know what they have to do when Sunday comes. If Down beat Armagh on Saturday, Louth will have to beat Kildare on Sunday to avoid going into the Tailteann. If Armagh win, Louth are safe for Sam and Kildare would have the stronger motivation to win and also get into Sam. Louth would have the choice to avoid the hammering by Dublin.

Charles Babbage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122066053#Comment_122066053

You could argue that if their neighbours Armagh win as expected, then not reaching the Leinster final would give Louth one chance in three of getting Clare in their group, who Louth might expect to beat. But equally they could end up with one of Galway/Mayo or Donegal/Tyrone/Armagh in their group instead, and these teams would expect to beat Louth.

Dickie10

you would have to imagine once they know for sure they have qualified for sam maguire that Louth wont be overly worried about winning v kildare, but kildare have to win. i think there might be a big kick left in kildare this weekend and they will win by 2 or 3 points

theoneeyedman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122065840#Comment_122065840

That's not how the regs work. You can't assume people can hop over the fence to enter the playing area, they have to be able to access the evacuation area (may not be the correct term) unobstructed. Croke park would have had test events, and it would be proven (as much as possible) that it can move people out of the place within the requisite time allowed, which I think is 8 minutes (but I'm open to correction on this).

Personally, if something happens, I'd probably be able to 'hop over the fence' in most instances, but then again I guess plenty of people in in the Leppins Lane end in 1989 thought that too! How would you expect an 80 year old man with a dodgy hip to hop over the fence? The capacity would likely have been set when the concrete seats were there, so you're expecting someone to clambour across the concrete seats in a panic.

If we want to increase the capacity, we have to meet the criteria and develop the grounds, as we are doing in fairness.

The rules are there to protect people, and the need for them to be upheld have been proven time and time again all over the world. The reason why ransom busses knocking people down is relatively uncommon is because there are things like footpaths, traffic lights, zebra crossings and all that health and safety nonsense

legendary.xix

I know GAA HQ want early group stage draws for logistics but it detracts a bit from the provincial finals. Mayo knew they were playing the Munster champions last year before the Munster final. They were able to prepare for that and watch the Munster final in preparation for it. Instead of giving non provincial finalists the jeopardy of uncertainty they are being given the advantage of certainty!

dxhound2005

All you need to know about the games 28 and 29 April, according to RTE.

https://www.rte.ie/sport/football/2024/0425/1445611-football-championship-all-you-need-to-know/

megadodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122064131#Comment_122064131

Yet again, like all bad liars and zealots, you refuse to answer any question I ask.

I wonder why that is?

You continuously introduce emotive-based strawman arguments and ad hominems in order to deflect and avoid my questions.

Now you're mentioning people clambering over the concrete seating that used to be in front of the stand. Well, they were replaced by plastic seating. How exactly does that prevent clambering?

As for the 80 year old with the bad hip, how long will it take him to evacuate from the upper tiers in Croke Park?

A few more questions there, along with a reminder that I'm still waiting for you to clarify what exactly is it in the Hyde that makes people burn to death.

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122066958#Comment_122066958

I wouldn't be so sure. If I was from Louth I would seriously fancy my chances. Kildare cannot get much lower. And given that Sam Mulroy was able to try and take on the Dubs on his own last year. What damage will he cause to Kildare?

If Louth are in the game at all or go ahead, I expect Kildare to fold like a deckchair. That is how poor Kildare are mentality, tactically etc etc.

theoneeyedman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122069903#Comment_122069903

What are u talking about burning to death, you're using a flippant remark about people being left behind in the case of a evacuation (let them burn) to blind you to the point that the hazard to the crowds in venues like the hyde is in crushes and the likes. These are where the hazards are. Crowds are dumb, something happens and the herd mentality comes in, and they don't think rationally.

The new seats in the Hyde look to have bigger avenues and channels (aisles) between them, I may be wrong in that but just looking from the terrace on Sunday that looks to be the case to the naked eye. I'd be guessing that the ground underneath is better to than the heavy gravel that was there. All eases movement of people. There are lots of alternative egress points from the upper levels of Croke Park, look how quickly it empties out after a game,and most of them are different routes than you'd use when entering the ground.

Of course, because nobody has been killed in a GAA ground for years, we should just have a free for all. Ram the people in, cram them in as tight as you can, sure what's the worse that can happen. Bring the barbed wire back to make sure they are penned in properly too, why not? All the lessons learned through tragedy elsewhere don't apply to us in the GAA, we're different.

I've seen idiots stick to dumb arguments in here before, but this here is trolling of a whole different level-fair play to you!

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122070232#Comment_122070232

The reality is most GAA grounds are far too big for the attendances they receive. In times gone past when the Hill16 had no barriers, and few stewards that is when there was real danger, for the "big games".

But given the amount of space GAA grounds have relative to the crowds. Plus the smoking ban in the grounds. Your nightmare scenario remains just that. And your argument about impending disaster is like something from a bygone age - thankfully.

overshoot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122069903#Comment_122069903

tgd part B has a very clear measurement for the width of escape routes, or will at least point you to other reference documents. Feel free to check it out and tell the GAA’s consultants where they went wrong if you’re so sure. You’re the one saying the limit is wrong, I think the strawman argument is on your side

legendary.xix

The Munster hurling championship is competitive and getting good crowds. The key is getting the right blend of competitive games, jeopardy and reward. Non provincial finalists should at least have to go through a knockout playoff round to make the group stage. The All-Ireland 16 would then consist of 8 provincial finalists, 1 Tailteann winner and 7 playoff winners.

The 7 playoff losers and a third tier winner from the year before should compete in the Tailteann Cup. The remaining 9 teams then in some Tier 3.

That all aside and back on the field of play. A surprise Down win will add spice to Louth v Kildare tomorrow which would then become an All-Ireland playoff.

theoneeyedman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122070292#Comment_122070292

Around 150 people died in a crush in Korea 18 months ago.

flasher0030

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122070705#Comment_122070705

What does this have to do with Hyde Park. It was night time festivities. Alcohol consumed. The area not patrolled properly. Mention of 100,000 people in this article.

What is the comparison between that and Hyde Park, as opposed to any other GAA ground, or in fact any other large gathering.

https://www.politico.com/news/2022/10/30/south-korea-halloween-grief-shock-00064125#:~:text=SEOUL%2C%20South%20Korea%20%E2%80%94%20Concerned%20relatives,a%20nightlife%20district%20in%20Seoul.

theoneeyedman

It outlines the need for control of crowds. Even in your post, 'area not controlled properly', and too many people in the area, that's what we're talking about here. (There do be plenty of lads with alcohol on in the Hyde too, but not a significant number).

Im willing to submit to the experts on this, it's good to question them, but there is a time to admit that they generally know what they are at.

YabaDabaDooley

Armagh and McGeeney have had a habit of losing quite a lot of big games but this one would be a disaster for them if it happened.

FrancieBrady

all square on 70 mins

FrancieBrady

Armagh win by a point

YabaDabaDooley

Armagh sneak through by a point. Close shave for the 1/5 favourites.

dxhound2005

6 from Ulster in Sam, 3 each from Connacht and Munster. 4 from Leinster, Dublin, Meath, Louth and one of Westmeath/Kildare/Offaly. We can rule out Offaly. A Louth win over Kildare will get Westmeath in.

blowitupref

Real get out of jail card used by Armagh, then again made things more difficult for themselves by giving away to two very bad goals. Down would be in the final with a consistent free taker.

MFPM

Down let that slip, one point in final 24 mins of play. Armagh really inconsistent, capable of such good performances and then can be so off the pace.

YabaDabaDooley

Armagh never seem to do things the easy way. They usually lose big games by a point like league final v Donegal, twice on penalties in Croke Park to Galway and Monaghan, other games i can't recall offhand. Up to now they've lacked a killer instinct. But Geezer has put in some shift up there and i would like to see them win an Ulster title.

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122071258#Comment_122071258

Geezer is the problem. Classic example of a manager living off playing reputation.

gormdubhgorm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122070705#Comment_122070705

If ever there was an example of a complete non sequitur argument, this is it.

It made me say "What??" "What has that got to with what we are talking about?"

Now if you went through the average attendances in the Hyde v Crowd capacity. Or even any anecdotal stories about what attendance there is like it would make more sense.

I was only there once a few years ago. I think it was Conor Cox first year playing for the Rossies. I found it grand lots of space and a wide pitch. The weather was torrential rain though.