Bonus entitlement

Jamescolins

Hi all,

I gave the company eight weeks' notice instead of the required four, I chose to give them eight weeks so they could find a suitable replacement. Our fiscal year begins on February 1 and ends on January 31. The company awards bonuses depending on performance throughout this time frame (of course at the company discretion )

I've been working for the company for two years, and for the last year, I performed exceptionally well—I never missed an hour of work or called in sick, etc. Company has offered me a much better package to stay but I politely refused ( idication of my overall great performance) Every year in April, bonuses are usually given out. Since I submitted my notice few weeks ago I was not eligible for a bonus, but all of my coworkers were. Has anyone encountered a circumstance like this? I will be working for the company for a further four to five weeks, therefore bonuses will be paid out during my employment. Has anyone had a situation like that, can company refuse to pay bonus in this case ? Feels like a distraction, and kind of hurts for giving my all and going extra mile to be refused bonus.

I appreciate any suggestions too. Thank you

Trigger Happy

There is a clause in my contract that says bonuses are discretionary and will not be paid out during notice period if it is the employee who has given the notice. Have a read of your contract and see if it says anything.

skallywag

Your work contract should have the exact terms for the bonus payment called out, and is usually something along the lines of 'you need to have worked in the period x to y' and still be an employee on date z etc.

If you have satisfied these criteria, and you did genuinely perform very very well during this period, then I would also be pissed off to miss out on the payment.

Assuming that you do satisfy the criteria, have you thought about discussing this with your manager, etc.?

Jamescolins

Thank you for your comment, it doesn't say anything about the notice period or leave.

The terms of
the bonus scheme may vary from time to time. This bonus scheme is discretionary and will only be
payable if the Company and individual meet their respective financial and personal objective.

Jamescolins

Absolutely, my line manager is on AL and I don't want to go overboard and reach out to his superior as I really respect my manager and don't want to burn the bridges, I'll have the chat next week

Mick ah

Check your contract to see what your bonus entitlements are.

More than likely the firm is under no obligation to give you a bonus. Despite that fact that a bonus is normally for work already carried out.

Unless you're in a tiny industry, I'd say goodbye once your contractual notice period is up. If the company is going to go by the letter of your contract, then you should too.

thebiglad

Sounds like you could have told the new employer your bonus is due and you don't want to leave till it's paid. Get the bonus resign and give 4 week's notice and be out at virtually the same time.

You have given them an additional 4 weeks and this is the thanks you'll get. Hopefully your manager will be able to pull some influence for you but, depending on the size of company I can imagine the bureaucracy will block it.

If you have worked 4 weeks already are you prepared to call it and walk away - you owe them no favours and it must work both ways!

3DataModem

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058348821/bonus-entitlement

I've been in this situation.

Basically the advice I was given

• If you have written confirmation of the bonus amount and payment date (i.e. "you have earned x") then you can make a case to get it.
• If you don't have it, just have the bonus policy, and the policy states that you don't get paid if you are in notice period, or in PIP, or left the business, then they have the right not to pay you.

Jamescolins

Thank you, that's very insightful.

It's a very vague and open description of the bonus, doesn't specify x amount, date period etc.

Next week I'll speak with my boss I might consider a legal advise even if it's at my cost, just so low of them to act this way after getting so much from me. I actually haven't thought about leaving after 4 weeks as per contract but may consider it after conversation with my boss.

This is exact description of the bonus policy, I just removed company name.

You may be eligible to receive a bonus based on Company, business and personal targets and objectives
which will be agreed on an annual basis and updated as required by the Company over the course of
the year. The bonus pay out % is based on the Company’s financial performance. The terms of
the bonus scheme may vary from time to time. This bonus scheme is discretionary and will only be
payable if the Company and individual meet their respective financial and personal objective.

csirl

Looks like if you met your targets you're entitled to a bonus? Nothing about notice periods.

road_high

unfortunately it’s a scenario where you have to box kind of clever- it’s easy say now but I’d have waited until the bonus was paid to hand in my notice. Once that happened it was at risk as I’d imagine it’s written in on the company side as at their discretion etc

miamee

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122063293#Comment_122063293

Unfortunately yes, if you'd just given them the standard 4 weeks notice you would have received your bonus without any issues and could then have handed it in. By doing them a 'favour' you have done yourself a disservice. I'm not trying to kick you when you are down, it's just a lesson for the future. Companies exist to make money and will save a few €€€ wherever they can, especially on a juicy bonus for someone who has one foot out the door.

If they refuse the bonus make sure any colleagues know about it too to save them the same issue in the future.

Jim2007

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122062370#Comment_122062370

This is pretty standard stuff - it's discretionary, the company makes the rules, there is usually a cut off date….

And from their point of view there is no point in paying you a bonus - you are leaving, they are not going to get anything more from you and so they are better off spending it on someone else on the team who is going to continue working for them.

I hope you get something for your efforts, but I suspect it will be a hard fight.

3DataModem

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122062370#Comment_122062370

Based on that wording, I'd say if you went to an employment lawyer they would tell you you were entitled to it. But IANAL.

thefa

Slightly different scenario but a close colleague at work left recently. He had three months notice and had a conversation with his manager to see out the couple of weeks of the eligible year before handing in the notice and then completed it which fell in the bonus payment period. He still had hassle getting it paid in the end but the manager got it over the line towards the end. Quite a big organisation and generally don’t pay out bonus to leavers.

I am mot sure of the materiality of the bonus or whether the legal route would be worthwhile or not but while it’s great to respect your manager, end on good terms, etc - that needs to work both ways. I would be kicking up a fuss ASAP and consider becoming unavailable for the additional weeks notice.

Ted222

Depending on the amount, it might be worth submitting a complaint to the WRC if it isn’t sorted locally. You could do so yourself without involving a solicitor.

The basis of your complaint would be that the company is in breach of custom and practice in terms of how bonuses are awarded. You’ve reached the targets set. There’s nothing about waiving payment during notice periods so they can’t make any such claim.

I know you want to leave on good terms but the company doesn’t seem to share your view in this regard.

jackboy

At a previous job an emploee was asked to pay the company back the health insurance portion from time of leaving to renewal date. This had never been done before.

It turned out the decision was made by a Junior HR going on a solo run out of pure nastiness. The employee fought it, it was dropped and the HR individual was reprimanded. Don't underestimate the chance that you have been targeted by some individual with a problem.

Tech_Head

Some employers will have have different terms once someone hands in their notice.
In my place, you are no longer entitled to paid sick leave once you hand in your notice so I’d be wary of trying to call in sick as you’ll most likely not get paid for it. That being said, 8 weeks notice is a long time.

C3PO

I also work for a financial institution and a bonus would not be paid in these circumstances.

witchgirl26

The policy you quoted shows that bonuses are discretionary. Means the company can decide not to pay them. Anywhere I worked, you had to be a full employee on the date of the payment of the bonus in order to receive it, not just for the period during which it relates. Most would pay out if the person was leaving after the pay date but was on notice but not if the notice period ended the same date as the paid date.

Unless your bonus is a guaranteed, contractual bonus, it's hard to fight it.

Jamescolins

Hi all,

Many thanks for your comments I really appreciate it. It's a mix of emotions to be honest, I guess lesson learned for the future. I haven't decided yet how I'm going to proceed, first I would like an official response from the company as to why I was excluded and to which part of my contract they're referring to and I'll take it from there.

Once again many thanks for taking your time to share your thoughts on this.

Tomw86

Any company I have been in within Financial Services would not, or in actual examples have not, paid out in this circumstance.

If you hand in your notice prior to confirmation of your bonus being provided then you will not be entitled to it unless, as stated above, it is 'guaranteed'. I believe getting legal advice on this would be a waste.

If you get confirmation of the bonus and payment date in writing, and hand in your notice before the payment date then some companies may still try to rescind it, but would be alot harder for them to do this.

I was in a similar position last year and held off on handing in my notice until my bonus was confirmed and paid just to be on the safe side.

Jamescolins

Hi all,

A small update

I'm fortunate that my manager heard me out and was able to negotiate a bonus payment for me after I laid out all of my accomplishments, performance, etc. Even though I'm positive it's less than usual, I'm happy to receive anything at all.

It wouldn't be worth it if I didn't fight since they would simply leave without paying me. In addition, I consider myself fortunate since without my manager, I most likely would not have succeeded.