The decline of SF?

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122361708#Comment_122361708

Read the results correctly Bobson. Eastwood made it with a massively reduced majority and Hanna took the seat because her vote was not split.

and a place that rejected the bombings, shootings, rape, torture and disappearing of people carried out by the Provos and defended to this day by SF.

Those 'people' you clearly don't understand also nearly gave SF East Londonderry. A massive unionist majority cut to 175 votes.

Bobson Dugnutt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122361751#Comment_122361751

They didn’t though, Francie. People voted for the SDLP because they wanted to. They prefer the legacy of Hume than the blood-soaked legacy of the Provos.

Bobson Dugnutt

A portrait unveiled today in Leinster House of Senator Billy Fox. The first member of the Oireachtas to be murdered since Kevin O’Higgins in 1927. He was murdered by the Provos and a sectarian motive is suspected as he a Protestant. No SF politician turned up for it.

markodaly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122364295#Comment_122364295

No SF politician turned up for it.

Disgraceful tbh. Even 50 years later SF and their pose cannot let go, put their hands up and say, "Sorry, we were wrong".

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122366362#Comment_122366362

Under researched rant again.

The unveiling was also attended by Marjorie’s brother George Coulson, former Taoiseach John Bruton’s wife Finola Bruton and former president WT Cosgrave’s granddaughter Mary Cosgrave.

Additionally, former Taoiseach Leo Varadkar, former Tánaiste Ray MacSharry, Sinn Féin leader Mary Lou McDonald, Minister Heather Humphreys and members of Monaghan County Council were in attendance.

blanch152

……

Bobtheman

I wouldnt totally despair if I were a SF supporter or member. Elections can throw up surprises. We still have a housing crisis. We still have a health crisis.

Bobtheman

I'd consider giving SF a number 1 or 2. I just wouldn't like them to lead a government. Because they are a bit too populist for my tastes. A bit too fond of class warfare. Ideally I'd like to see them in coalition with FG or FF.

However this seems unlikely now

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122366827#Comment_122366827

The rest of the western world has a housing crises. Many young people ( people in their twenties / early thirties say) struggle to buy a home in Sydney, London, San Francisco too, despite high salaries there. Everyone wants lovely pads in great locations, but there are not enough to go around. High immigration in to this country in the past five / ten years has not helped, it is supply and demand. However you can still buy an apartment in some parts of the country for double the average public sector wage or less. The problem is these are often bought by retiring public sector workers with their one and a half year wages tax free lump sum when they retire, so young people are not always able to buy them. Ask any auctioneer.

The health crises is caused by our inefficiency to govern ourselves, not by lack of money we ( the taxpayer ) give to the HSE, VHI, doctors etc. Giving control to a organisation who main past expertise was robbing banks / planting bombs would not guarantee an improvement.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122366904#Comment_122366904

The money wasted by the HSE is eye watering

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122366946#Comment_122366946

Overseen by successive line ministers and the government generally, for yonks.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122366904#Comment_122366904

western housing problems are not a case of the lack of supply but more so the overall financialisation of the whole process, in which includes a widescale privatisation of property, and the whole process of property, which has opened the door widely for speculation of these markets, whos overall objective is to keep inflating the price of property, which under such, housing is now considered an 'asset'!

….prices are inflated by the influx of new credit into markets, the more new credit enters the market, the more prices inflate, most new money is now created by major private sector financial institutions, we call these 'banks', whereby banks play a critical role in this overall process of financialisation, along side its other partners, insurance and real estate, i.e. 'fire' (finance, insurance and real estate)

obviously those capable of borrowing, which includes employees of both the public and private sectors, we now have other major players from the private sector maintaining this process, such as major investment and pension funds etc…..

our health care sector issues are wide and complex, the fact that we ve significantly under funded our health system for decades, were effectively forced to implement austerity measures when the private sector banking system went caput, and the fact our health care needs have dramatically changed and become far more complex, therefore more costly to provide, resulting in an absolute sh1t show……

blanch152

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122367048#Comment_122367048

Privatisation of property is nothing new, it has been there ever since a family or tribe took over a cave.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122367064#Comment_122367064

..yes this is true, but over the last few decades, there has been a large widescale privatisation of property, hence why many western nations, including ireland, have significantly reduced public housing stock, and states have largely withdrawn from the production and creation of public housing, preferably outsourcing this process to the private sector(part 5).

…this is ultimately why we are where we are, whereby speculation of property and land trumps the actual creation, or attempt to create housing

…this means the needs of these major private sector entities, i.e. the fire sectors, trumps societies actual needs, hence why bailouts and other public polices including qe have been enacted, and maintained…..

pureza

In the Dáil today Pearse was giving out about 2 more excise increases on petrol and diesel this summer and that they should be stopped

Micheál Martin immediately replied that Sf's alternative budget had the whole lot up in one 8% increase in April

Saying one thing one month and a different the next,you wouldn't have a clue what you'd be voting for would you

Isn't this another example of the kind of all over the place pirrouetting of policies that has SF support falling amongst other things?

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122367302#Comment_122367302

…wouldnt be worrying about it, there wont be a sf government, and may never be….

pureza

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122367314#Comment_122367314

I'd disagree there.

The Martin Ferris review of the EU and Co Co results is done.

There will be another change in tack/pirrouette call it what you will,so you will see a rise and rise by Sinn Féin in the run up to the election

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122367302#Comment_122367302

Pearse, poor old Pearse. This is the man who said one month the rich earn 140k and the next 100k.

The alternative budget, which version on they on now after they fixed all the mistakes?

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122367332#Comment_122367332

…sorry but this more than likely isnt gonna happen, sf are clearly in free fall, this more than likely will not reverse leading into the ge, there will very likely, and imho, be another ffg government, and the fact theyll do everything they can to try always block any alternatives, its very likely we ll just remain pretty much as is, possible indefinitely…..

…i.e. the best way for ireland to change, is to stay the same……

…always leads to radical changes of course!

pureza

Well that'll be up to the voters

No party is restricted on the ballot paper

So I'd disagree there too,Ireland isn't Belarus,our voting is free open and fair,please do report anything factual to the contrary?

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122367528#Comment_122367528

…and again, this isnt how the pr-stv system works, government formations are partly to do with voting outcomes, i.e. voter choices, but also partly due to agreements made post election day, i.e. government formations are not entirely due to the involvement of a single entity, either voter choices or elected officials agreements. therefore, the most likely outcome of the next ge will be another ffg lead government, due to the fact theres currently a rapid decline in support for sf, causing a default towards another ffg government. in order for a sf government to be formed, there would need to be a significant high number of votes for sf, significantly higher that both ffg votes, again, this is currently highly unlikely, but i guess we dont have long to confirm this now……

…yes irelands voting system is far more fairer compared to a country such as belarus, but again, voting outcomes only play a part in government formations, this means a single party may in fact obtain the largest amount of overall votes, but still not be able to form a government, this again will more than likely be the case for sf, causing the default to ffg….

paddyisreal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122366904#Comment_122366904

My son is renting an apartment for 400 a month 40 min from Barcelona and 10 minutes from his job. You wouldn't rent a dog kennel within an arses roar of Dublin in Ireland for that. He was renting in cologne before that for 450 a month in the center of the city. We are not London, new York or San Francisco and it's only a matter of time before the arse falls out of this government funded house of cards. As you say the health crisis is caused by our inefficiency to govern ourselves - remind me who is in power and has failed to govern the health care sector ? The shinners couldn't be worse than the crowd running health and housing at the moment. Both are a **** disaster

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122367707#Comment_122367707

If you google it up, you will find in Spain the average annual wage stood at approximately 29,113 euros in 2022.

The Prime Minister of Spain earns only €86,542 per year. Here a lot of Gardai , lecturers in third level colleges etc earn that each year and get more than that as a tax free "gratuity" when they retire. That, and wages in general and cost of building etc here, pushes the price of property higher here.

So 2 different economies. If people here only earned 29k on average, rent would only be 400 per month too.

Maybe in countries like Libya, Venezuala and North Korea, the cost of renting is cheaper too. Republicans have visited those countries in the past, maybe we could learn from those countries you think?

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122368743#Comment_122368743

…and again, you ll find its actually the access to credit that has ultimately caused the rapid rise in property prices, and yes, those that earn more, in both the public and private sectors naturally have had that access, noting theres plenty of people in the private sector earning healthy 5 and 6 figure sums, therefore can borrow larger amounts of money, this approach of just blaming the public sector is just childish now!

…and again, after the 08 crash, we encouraged much large investment and pension funds to invest in our property markets, and they to got access to cheap credit via methods such as qe, as interest rates were kept at record low levels for some time after the crash, this was all to simply re-inflate asset markets post crash, and it worked…..

pureza

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122367609#Comment_122367609

Are you arguing against free will there?

Because last time I voted,there was noone standing over me saying if I voted for one government party I had to vote for the other

If I did that it was my choice

Noone elses

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122368864#Comment_122368864

…again, you seem to think we have a fptp system here, we dont, under pr-stv, it is possible for a party to receive a larger proportion of votes, but still be unable to form a government, this is more than likely what will happen here again, i.e. its very likely sf will get more votes than either ff or fg, or even ffg combined, but will be unable to form a government, resulting in a default back towards another ffg lead government, this is currently the most likely outcome after the coming ge…..

…yes voters have the freedom to vote who they like, citizens even have the right to not vote at all, but again, voters alone do not decide government formations, as is the case here in ireland under pr-stv…..

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122368907#Comment_122368907

If we had a FPTP system, it's unlikely SF would exist at all, it only suits a 2 party system.

Using it as an argument that SF should do better in an election based on number of votes is nonsensical.

SF have to make themselves more transfer friendly, which they were doing as they were morphing into FF but it's blown up in their face as is slowly dawned on their supporters what was happening (particularly galling for the lefty group being taken advantage of).

paddyisreal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122368743#Comment_122368743

The Barcelona economy would be quiet close to ours, average salary is about 38,000. Why did you exclude cologne in Germany from the discussion which I mentioned also.

pureza

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122368907#Comment_122368907

In theory SF being the chief opposition party if they polled the 36% or higher of last year at an election,they'd trump the other choices and would have to be involved

Their not being able to do that would be solely down to voter choice

Your analysis otherwise is nonsense

There is still plenty of time for SF to grow their vote,its not going to shrink further.

Francis McM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122369299#Comment_122369299

Who sys it cannot shrink further? Historically - in the 1960s, 1970s, 1980s etc SF had no more than 2 or 3% vote here in most of the 26 counties.