Performance Punishment - Civil Servant

Relic01

Hi and thanks for reading.

I am a civil servant and keep on hitting the same issue, everytime I move work area.

I am above average speed and quality wise. This gets recognised early on as good, then it becomes the accepted norm and I get increasingly more work.

Eventually the important priority work goes my way in many instances, along with an expectation that I can do it faster and to a high standard. Meanwhile those who aren't perhaps performing as might be expected, have their workload decreased and some is shifted to me.

So high performance is effectively rewarded with more work.

The difference to the private sector is that you can't be recognised for higher performance through renumeration. Equally, underperforming staff are more difficult to tackle/culture is that they aren't.

When it comes to career advancement, an independent panel interviews you. They know nothing about your day to day, or get a report from your boss. So it does not necessarily get reflected, as you won't be talking about business as usual work at an interview.

To be balanced I have risen through the grades fast, as I have had chances to work on the important stuff, represent the area and act up when bosses are not available. I get put in front of Ministers, senior management and stakeholders more often and this you can speak to in interviews.

I am not alone in this, but as I look around it can appear that a minority is doing the majority of work and you are seriously worked. I often do long days and have had to cover backlog work over weekends. I feel like I have to do it, as otherwise something important will get dropped and I internalise the expectation it needs doing, otherwise I am letting down the area and the public.

Friends and family say I am foolish for doing it. I see others doing the same, and it wears overtime.

Am I naive? I have had offers from private sector, so know I could be doing something else and work hard, but better paid.

Flinty997

Also happens in the private sector if less so.

But certainly you've a better chance of being rewarded in the private sector.

whitelaurel

what position are you?

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058356559/performance-punishment-civil-servant

Did you ever get asked to make a cup of tea? If you make a good cup of tea you'll be asked again and it'll be the expectation/norm. Make a bad cup of tea and you'll never be let down it again.

Cynical me, but what you have described is common place, unable or not wanting to deal with the slackers so the good ones are laden down more and as you said at least in the private sector you might be able to more directly link your renumeration with your work.

There are also some very bad managers around who literally shouldn't be let manage.

Relic01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122280131#Comment_122280131

Assistant Principal. Encountered same issue in all the grades I have worked in.

Difference at my grade now is that entire work issues can be shifted to my area, to get them back on track or because they are in the public focus.

Flinty997

Your just someone who likes to do the work. So people will take advantage. Simple as. You've not learnt to push back. Which is surprising given your level. You're not willing to let things fail to prove a point or force change.

tohaltuwi

I never achieved your heights of excellence, OP, (I mean this genuinely) but o found the public service absolutely soul-destroying when you did your job well, especially when so many others around you were incompetent, and indeed being paid far more. I look back now at some absolutely appalling public service culture. Extremely serious bullying was rife in my section too.

It can be soul-destroying when you are doing a very good job and being punished for it.

tohaltuwi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122280316#Comment_122280316

The trouble here is that letting things fail can fall right back on you. In my situation when I attempted that both HQ would get at me, and the union would throw me to the bus as show steward was one of the bullies, a morass of complexities and divided loyalties.

My only reward when I retired was being told I was the person who recognised all the merits of the good staff, especially one exceptional but under-valued staff member’s wife who told me what my recognition of him meant to all the family and his mental health. He had been sort of despised by people of higher grade.

Relic01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122280334#Comment_122280334

I don't know about excellence, I'd say APs are more like middle managers in most places now. You have lead on your area and link between real senior management and the grades at the coalface. So you get it from both ends!

@ Flinty, you may have a point. Failure is anathema to me inherently and I really don't like to see us fail the public, as some of the things we work on has direct effect on people. I also think it lets the wider team down, as someone will have to do it.

With my own staff, I hold them accountable and preach it, but even as an AP my influence is limited when it is the culture, coming from the highest grades.

I see it a lot, good performance gets punished and are more likely to hear about it when things go wrong.

billyhead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122280429#Comment_122280429

If the staff reporting to you are slacking it's up to you to pull them up on it. If it's your peers discuss this with your manager.

Flinty997

The modern work place is as much about self promotion as it getting work done. Sad reality. You really only get rewarded for work if working for yourself. With a few exceptions.

anewme

it’s exact same inprivate sector, some people do all of the work and some people do none of the work. It depends on the role and tge individuals work ethic.

Relic01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122280458#Comment_122280458

I don't want to go into detail.. but this is not always straightforward as people may think. For example I had an under performing staff member and over a length of time provided every support to try and improve things. I also continually documented and made my own manager aware of the situation.

When performance did not improve and it became clear this was unlikely to change I wanted to begin the PIP process. This was not supported as 'not the done thing' in that area of the civil service. Without senior management and HR support…

I very much disagree with this approach and have made this known at the appropriate levels as I think it has the consequence that under performers are carried and undermines the whole team, as people don't see it getting tackled.

Similar across all grades and it is well known who isn't pulling their weight.

This may make the civil service sound awful but I should say that we have a lot of good people, doing their best.

Kingslayer

I always thought someone who is a compulsive hard worker should be self employed. They will just get taken advantage of otherwise.

MakersMark

You need to understand that it's very likely that the majority of your co-workers do the absolute minimum required to scrape be.

Since they cannot be fired, the work will gravitate to the tiny minority who will try to complete it.

Ted222

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122281367#Comment_122281367

From your various posts, you’ve described the civil service perfectly. It has always been the same.

You work hard and will probably continue to be promoted. You may eventually rise to a position where you can give effect to the organisational changes you know are necessary.

As has been said, the difference in your situation between the public and private sectors is the culture. You can’t expect to be financially rewarded for going over and above and you aren’t being supported in your efforts to knock a tune out of underperforming staff.

This won’t change.

The question you have to ask yourself is whether you’re prepared to put up with it for the rest of your working life.

If not, take the private sector offers. Don’t wait until it’s too late.

CramCycle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122281367#Comment_122281367

They are right, regardless of public or private, unless a small business, you should not do a PIP or what my old HR called a PMP without their involvement. If you do you are just wasting 6 months. HR, for all their issues will have it squared away on paper. The smart people will jump ship at the next opportunity to somewhere else, some will pull up their socks but it is rare but at the end of the PIP or PMP, if you haven't the right process followed that is just 6 months wasted as letting them go is a huge risk without the proper, verifiable process.

dennyk

high performance is effectively rewarded with more work

That's always been true since human society first developed the concept of some humans working for the benefit of other humans rather than for themselves.

The difference to the private sector is that you can't be recognised for higher performance through renumeration.

Even in the private sector, more often than not the only reward for performing well is more work. Your employer isn't going to volunteer to pay you more when you're already giving them that exceptional value for your current salary, unless they fear you might actually start becoming disgruntled and leave (or unless they're one of those rare unicorn employers who actually do genuinely value their employees and seek to reward them, but those are few and far between). In fact, being a high performer can often make your employer reluctant to promote you to a higher role because your current manager won't want to lose their best worker. In the private sector, changing companies, with all of the risks that entails, is often the only way to get a significant pay rise no matter how hard you work or how well you perform.

Flinty997

Dennyk so very true

Oscar_Madison

So OP, I don’t work in the civil service and maybe as a result you might say “well what do you know so”- and maybe you’re right.

However, what I do know is very long hours, weekend work, covering for others mistakes etc are classic examples of not delegating managing prioritising and coaching effectively.

BUT- I’ll also say that even employing those skills to the max, there can come a time that the only solution is more experienced staff- you can’t do it all but sounds like you’re trying to.

Reflect on to what degree you are a coach and leader as opposed to a “doer” - you may need training in that area- it’s tempting to “do” but it’s not always the right thing.

Then try prioritisation - what needs doing now and by whom vs what can wait?

Really you need to take your weekends back - no one will thank you when you go out on long term sick leave with exhaustion - just some food for thought

Relic01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122283757#Comment_122283757

Thanks for the feedback and to everyone else!

I think likely a kernel of truth in the delegation part as I progressed very quickly through the ranks and went from the coalface to management in a few years.

I believe that I coach well though as I have done it in all but one of my civil service jobs and this is where I would respectfully disagree with Mark that..

"the majority of your co-workers do the absolute minimum required to scrape by"

I think the majority of people fall in the middle and will work according to what is around them. If you set expectations, communicate the goal, their contributions impact, take on board their ideas and support them by training and coaching…people are generally competent in my experience and want to work within a good team. I know some around have expressed an interest in joining my team, despite that I am considered a hard task master.

Where it goes wrong is when someone does not meet expectations and you are limited in what you can do. People in the team see that and what others are doing around them and will get frustrated.

I also don't delegate work past my teams capacity and will take on jobs myself. My own hypocrisy is that I don't want people doing what I do and working the extra hours, unless it is an emergency. They would burn out and I take my responsibility for their well being seriously.

Oscar_Madison

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122285916#Comment_122285916

I might add, that working smarter not harder is also a responsibility for each of your team members - as I said you can’t do it all - but sounds like you have a good awareness around where you might make some improvements that will release the pressure a bit - best of luck

Ted222

Here’s a metric you might want to apply.

How good would it be to develop your staff to a level approaching your own to the point where they themselves achieved promotion.

Rather than protecting them from work they’re not currently capable of, encourage and support them to do better. Let them see you have their back but that you’re challenging them to perform to a greater stand.

I was over 35 years in the CS. Believe me, if you get a reputation for successfully developing staff to the point of promotion, you’ll have ambitious people killing each other to become part of your team.

You may of course currently have some deadwood that isn’t up to the challenge but you can expect them to bail out at the first opportunity.

the_syco

When performance did not improve and it became clear this was unlikely to change I wanted to begin the PIP process. This was not supported as 'not the done thing' in that area of the civil service. Without senior management and HR support…

Getting rid of the useless ones is difficult. It seems the really useless ones know more about the procedure to get rid of them than you do.

I also don't delegate work past my teams capacity and will take on jobs myself.

If you don't test them, how will you know what they're capable of?

whitelaurel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122280259#Comment_122280259

make it to PO and then do **** all.

Relic01

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122303628#Comment_122303628

In that example, never went to PIP process as it was clear that was not the done thing there, so I'd be sailing alone and I know from others that is a very difficult position for managers in CS. Unless your backed by HR, don't bother.

On the capacity of staff...you build a good idea over time and I keep a good watch on where people are with work. Fine line between challenging them and "sweating the assets"!