Aer Lingus industrial action begins today

Raichų

Pilot Work to Rule begins today with a full strike action due Saturday 29th June from 5am to 1pm.

This is already pishing on a hape of cornflakes and I honestly feel like the strike is going to go on a long time. A 24% pay rise is a hefty amount to ask for and I just don’t see it happening. If the pilots won’t budge and neither Aer Lingus I wonder if it will take long for the minister to exercise his power to force them into the labour court? They were there again yesterday but nothing came of it.

I’m glad I have no holiday planned for the next few weeks anyway!

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058357361/aer-lingus-industrial-action-begins-today

They are already in the labour court, why would the Minister need to exercise his power to force them into it?

Aerlingus is owned by IAG, I expect them to play hardball because if they increase for Aerlingus pilot then every other group will want the same increase.

Are the Aerlingus pilots on less than BA pilot etc?

Raichų

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122305254#Comment_122305254

Well for the moment but the labour court also ruled yesterday there’s “nothing they can do” at present. I believe they will address it again next week.

Some other pilots have received pay rises but no one has gotten anything like the 24% they are asking for.

Raichų

The court asked Ialpa and the airline not to further ramp up the dispute before it gives a planned update on the state of play between the parties on July 1.

However, it is understood Ialpa did not give a commitment.

yeah, I don’t think they will back down anyway. They are really digging in here.

easygoing39

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2024/0626/1456665-aer-lingus-pilots-action/

Strike will be settled soon enough,won't be a long strike at all.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122305366#Comment_122305366

If they are already at labour court why would the government have to step in? Aerlingus is run by IAG and not by the Irish government.

We should not have a country when every single thing that happens the government needs to jump in, that's a nanny state. The unions and Aerlingus have highly paid people to work this out. If they need assistance that is why the labour court is in place.

keeponhurling

If it is a work-to-rule, then the pilots continue to receive their regular salaries and so presumably can keep that going long-term.

Frank Bullitt

Talks broke down today, so sounds like this will all go ahead as planned.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122309994#Comment_122309994

Yeah. The disruption caused by working to rule just proves the pilots' argument that Aer Lingus is short staffed. They can't maintain their schedule without flexibility and overtime etc. Yet Aer Lingus still deny they are short staffed even as they are cancelling hundreds of flights.

What the pilots are looking for amounts to inflation since their last pay rise in 2019. That's far from unreasonable.

Bobson Dugnutt

It’s going to be the start of a lot of industrial action across multiple sectors I feel. Inflation was rampant over the past few years, and companies are making record profits.

You can imagine that hardball trade unions in places like the ESB are looking on with interest.

Beta Ray Bill

My own €0.02 is this:

IAG want the unions gone. Aer Lingus has an unusual problem in that Aer Lingus planes can only be flown by Aer Lingus crew. So when it gets busy, that cannot contract in extra crews to run more flights. This is something the Unions got in a long time ago, (Probably when the government was pulling the strings in Aer Lingus) and is the main reason this is so disruptive.

On top of that, there are around 200 Airlines in Europe, and about 34,000 flights per day. If you're not happy with your job/salary, just get a job with someone else. Unions were a necessary evil in the past for aviation, but nowadays not really.

I think the Pilots should get a raise based on their (personal) and company performance year on year, but 24% is excessive

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122314020#Comment_122314020

Like most of these ex-government entities the new World is not the same as the old World. The likes of Eircom was a disaster after it was made private because of the contracts in place which made it impossible for the new companies to let go of poor performing staff.

The pilots will get a raise, but no chacne 24%. As soon as that is done the support staff etc will demand a raise. This will go on a while

keeponhurling

Are IAG in a position where they can simply refocus their investment and planes to the other airlines? BA, Iberia and Vueling I think

I assume they have no particular attachment to Ireland

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122314116#Comment_122314116

IAG don't give sh*t about Ireland

Can they refocus? Im not sure

Vueling is a poor man's Ryanair

Beta Ray Bill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122314080#Comment_122314080

I actually worked for Eir 9 years ago.

Total union shop. They have a pre existing agreement from the time they were the department of post and telecoms. 40 years service guaranteed, and a DB pension.

I lasted 6 months and had to get out, couldn't deal....

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122314116#Comment_122314116

They've the controlling stake in the Airline but not enought to siphon off its property to its other companies. I think Ryanair and the Government still have a substantial stake in it.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122314678#Comment_122314678

GOvernment doesn't own anything of Aerlingus anymore, it was all sold off.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122314020#Comment_122314020

Complete rubbish. BA and Iberia have unions. There is no justification for a very profitable company cutting wages in real terms.

How exactly do you rate a pilot's performance for pay purposes, apart from not crashing?

DXR

Hello, Google often leads me to this website, but I've never contributed to anything until now so here goes.

I've been following the Aer Lingus saga closely on here, as we had a family holiday booked, and chose Aer Lingus as the airline, everything was booked seperate by us, no travel agents involvement meaning we stood to lose a lot had anything happened to our flights.

By the flip of a coin we were ok, as we chose 0715 yesterday morning from Dublin-Lanzarote (this morning's 0715 flight was cancelled) returning July 12th all going well.

My experience yesterday was positive, Dublin airport was chock-a-block, haven't seen it so rammed full of passengers in ages, and I use it frequently for work flights, however it was extremely well managed, with security lines moving sharpish.

You would have been forgiven for not realising there actually was any industrial action by the airline at all, with our own flight actually landing ahead of schedule, though (we thought anyway) the hostesses etc were extra nice than usual.

My only gripe was, (my own fault completely) I got stung for baggage. Mistakenly thought I'd covered all bags, in reality only sorted one up to 20kg, so they stung me for €135 for baggage yesterday! But that was my fault completely!

Wouldn't mind a return to the good old days though where baggage didn't need to be a constant concern, especially not with Aer Lingus, but it is what it is I suppose.

thebaz

Given the already high wages of these pilots, and ther greedy demand of 24% pay increase demands, have zero sympathy for their cause, there are a lot more workers , in fact most workers, in other sectors far more deserving of an increase than this lot of well paid professionals, and most if they dont likeir the job benefits, have to just change job.

Personally, not put out by this action, but feal for others, including freinds, who are caught in the crossfire , and have holidays ruined.

Gusser09

Hopefully the public give them a piece of their minds at the airport. 24 percent. Chancers.

Madeoface

Greed is all I can see. Nobody is getting an increase of simple inflation added up cumulatively since 2019.

Those pilots were not flying during the lockdowns. Presumably they still got paid with state subvention. They also got the same energy credits as everyone else resident here which eroded a lot of the price inflation experienced. Perhaps they could count themselves lucky there wasn't an income limit on that.

It'll settle around 14.5%. No need for government intervention, it's a private company.

anyone getting a 66% pay rise like what Aer Lingus senior management and executive should explain to the public why their pay rise is acceptable but they won’t give the pilots a reasonable and modest pay rise. This is corporate greed like the days of the Celtic Tiger years. Shame on management and the national mainstream media who continue to back unsustainable executive pay at Aer Lingus but dismiss workers pay demands as “reckless”.

Beta Ray Bill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122314835#Comment_122314835

I'm sure they do. Good IT workers can expect a 6 figure salary, none of them are in unions though. (Unless you're getting outsourced from an Irish Bank or something). A lot of Aerlingus pilots, when O/T is included are on the guts of €200,000. And they're looking for 24%!? Like thats 4 times the average wage.

I just dont think it's justifiable

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122314788#Comment_122314788

Just seen it's wholey own IAG. (Sold in 2015), I had it in my head that someone else had a stake in it.

Been googling the airlines profits over the last X years:

2023 : 225
2022 : 57
2021 : -338
2020 : -502
2018 : 258
2017 : 234
2016 : 205
2015 : 118
2013 : 61.1
2012 : 69.1
2011 : 49.1

Interesting that when the government sold their stake to AIG that profits began to rise. Aerlingus profits haven't actually increased significantly since 2016 (Sitting between €200 and €250m). If you count the COVID they've made a massive loss in the last 5 years. I wonder did the pilots get paid during covid even though they were probably not flying planes.

Trampas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122321089#Comment_122321089

The pilots took a pay cut but I’m sure others can go into the finer details

Remember pilots need to pass medical a constantly and if any sort of issue their career is over.

Like people who complain about teachers holidays why don’t you become a pilot if it’s handy as nothing to stop you

Beta Ray Bill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122321167#Comment_122321167

Fair point, I suppose one could retrain.

I'm not like most of those people(pilots) though, we were not well off when I was a kid (single parent family in the 80's/90's), I grew up in a very disadvantaged area. I'd have loved to have been a pilot. I could go back a train now that I'm finally making good money, but I'm over 40 now and the chances of me having a successful career as a pilot are low at this stage of my life.

Interestingly my uncle did try and get a job as a pilot for Aerlingus, he did all the training, he got all the exams, but was never made a pilot, because in the 1970's/1980's you needed to have "the look" to be a pilot because of the grandeur of the job, and he didn't have that. Closest he ever got was engineer on board when then used to have 3 in the cockpit.

Potatoeman

This is more bad publicity for them. If a company has a reputation of striking then customers will just move to another as the inconvenience is not worth the supposed better ‘standard’. If you are doing a flight that’s a few hours there really isn’t much incentive in paying more for better service if the chance of strikes are a possibility.

Madeoface

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122323594#Comment_122323594

I went to a nothing special / nothing bad local community school and one of the thickest kids in the year lived up the Dublin mountains. He was a nice lad but fairly dim. He wanted to be a pilot too - back in the late 80's.

He didn't get anywhere near the grades required. However, his family was wealthy and he was sent to the US of A to do pilot training and worked his way up from local airlines…. to eventually become a pilot in Aer Fungus. Fair play. He had the money and means to do so.

I nearly pooped my pants when i heard him announce himself as a captain on one of my flights years ago - still remembering him struggle with LC pass maths.

drury..

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122311265#Comment_122311265

I don't think the ESB union plays hardball it's a bad look

As the union leader remarked onetime the workers there are ' spoilt ' in terms of pay and conditions

Beta Ray Bill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122335385#Comment_122335385

That's just the way things were in Ireland back then, and even still now to this day there are remnants of that (who you know, not what you know) in older institutionalised places.

It's funny how things have flipped, Like the Fire Brigade, Air Corps, Aer Lingus, Trawler work, RTE, Irish Rail, Eir, An Post, Civil Service etc. You had to know someone to get a job in those places… now they literally cannot get people to work for them OR are in turmoil with all sorts of issues.

drury..

Just to confirm. I have a flight tomorrow

The pilots are NOT taking industrial action while airborne ?

Raichų

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122345533#Comment_122345533

yeah they’ll switch the engines off mid flight if their shift ends.