(Site is a graveyard - How can boards save itself?) Any update?

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122489929#Comment_122489929

It may be Distilled Media. I checked Wikipedia and that's what it says. Assuming that that's correct, it'll be there as a loss leader so shareholders won't care. Fora aren't financially viable unless they're global and even then, Reddit is considering paywalling some subs.

EmmetSpiceland

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122489874#Comment_122489874

To be fair, the “Radio” forum is, pretty much, unmoderated these days. You’ve got the ‘Off the Ball’ thread, and others, hijacked by American culture war nonsense and then the lad who’s been site banned, twice, still posting reams about Ryan Tubridy, including random shots of his Instagram content, day in, day out.

Might be best to just “employ” the ignore button there.

anewme

if the owners don’t care, then all you are really left with is a few faithful but unsupported mods, committed because of what boards was in the past - the glory days.

“Let’s make boards great again” - it ain’t going to happen.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122489939#Comment_122489939

Maybe the committed users need to buy it to bring it back to what it was.

Tell me how

I hope that were boards to have more mods, with appropriate tools and some processes that it could improve things significantly and that from there, options to support it through various avenues could be considered.

It may never grow in to a reddit or whatever, but it could be a uniquely Irish offering where our strongest traits of conversation, welcoming nature, curiosity and joviality could have a place to be expressed.

I don't put the responsibility for what Boards is or what it could be on any one individual or entity, when it was good, it was good because of the community, that community still exists in Ireland, it's just Boards isn't a home for it in the same way it once was. I do hope that that can change.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122489940#Comment_122489940

I've stopped posting as much as I did, largely because I've moved away from the show a bit.

But when I did post there frequently, I did so primarily so those who came to vent weren't allowed to do so without being challenged and if anyone new dropped in to the thread, they at least saw one poster trying to talk about the positives on a show that had a hell of a lot of positives.

Cookie_Monster

flicking back through the thread shows no sign of the owner or staff comments… the total disinterest from them is one of the main reasons for the gradual decline imo. Vanilla has been a disaster for usability but the disinterest in doing better only compounds it exponentially.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122489734#Comment_122489734

Well maybe not a thousand posts, some sort of benchmark though.

And given how much stricter Politics is than CA, maybe Politics should be left open, as much tougher to act out there with propaganda tactics.

Spear

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122489734#Comment_122489734

Sadly it wouldn't achieve much, it would only shift the issue elsewhere. Aside from the fact there's no technical way to enforce that except for a mod to manually check each post, there's trolls currently targeting other forums such as Feedback and Legal Discussion, but being quieter forums, they're caught quickly and don't get much traction.

Big Bag of Chips

Ok, this thread (like so many others on here) is descending into posters arguing with each other rather than providing feedback on the site. (Quelle suprise)

The owners/management of the site are always working in the background. Updates will be provided when updates are available.

I'm going to post my own personal opinion here, not as an admin. This is a free discussion forum run largely by volunteers. Moderation here is open and visible. Posters have the opportunity to dispute warnings and bans.

The user base here I believe have no entitlement to know how, why etc decisions are made. Yet the mods, admins etc are very open and accessible. They constantly engage with the userbase. I issued a few warnings over the weekend and every single warning resulted in a volley of PMs. I've already posted about the instruction, not warning, instruction to a couple of posters asking them to stop bickering. That resulted in a PM telling me they were "fking sick of moderators, admins and the site". I don't know of too many other discussion sites who have that level of interaction with or access to management and moderators.

My personal opinion (not speaking as an admin) moderation should be anonymous and no dispute resolution. The userbase is not owed any explanations. They wouldn't get It anywhere else. It is this openness and access to the moderation team that allows so much abuse of volunteers. It's no wonder recruiting new Moderators is so difficult!

The moderation structure was set up originally when this forum was a community. Moderators were posters who engaged in threads and stepped in when things got heated. The site, like the rest of the internet, is now a very difficult place to navigate. People's opinions are more extreme. It has now become about being the most right and proving everyone else wrong, rather than being a constructive, engaging discussion.

This is not the fault of Boards.ie moderators, admins, management or owners. It is now how the internet is.

I don't think it can continue as it is. It will depend on a complete shift in attitude in a huge portion of the userbase. That's not going to happen. So the site, and moderators are going to have to change from what it always has been.

Updates will be provided when they are available.

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122490049#Comment_122490049

I think a benchmark is a good idea for CA if it was possible.

A new account (I won't say poster) can't post links until they have 50 posts, so a similar threshold might help with CA. Moving political threads from CA to Politics might also be good idea.

My issue with it is where would a thread like the Enochh Burke thread fit in a place like the politics Board though? As I see that thread, it's not about politics. I don't think I've ever posted in the politics forum (unless I did so unknowingly, I usually just go to "recent discussions" so its possible I might have).

As a rule, I tend to avoid political threads, as i've found they always just descend into "right versus left", and bickering as per the last few pages of this thread! 🥱

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122489939#Comment_122489939

Odhran Ginnity bought Boards to much fanfare, he promised lots of engagement and change but disappeared quickly.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122489976#Comment_122489976

How? It's not going to be cheap to run.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122490215#Comment_122490215

Nail meet head.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122489993#Comment_122489993

Boards is Boards. It shouldn't try to be anything else but it's locked into a downwards spiral. Mods are drawn from the pool of users and good users are just not bothering any more meaning that mods are harder to find. Nothing will change without an investment of people, money and tech and there is precisely zero sign of that happening.

Ezeoul

I'm going to post my own personal opinion here, not as an admin. This is a free discussion forum run largely by volunteers. Moderation here is open and visible. Posters have the opportunity to dispute warnings and bans.

The user base here I believe have no entitlement to know how, why etc decisions are made. Yet the mods, admins etc are very open and accessible. They constantly engage with the userbase.

Apologies in advance, but I have to disagree with the statements in bold above, BBOC. I appreciate that is your personal opinion, and given from your perspective, but it is the opposite of my experience. In some forums yes, that might be the case (PI being one of them) but not in others.

It has been stated on these threads many times now, posters feel there is not enough engagement from the mods, and moderation is not visible.

While I do not have a very high opinion of the current dispute resolution process, (I think it is overly complicated and needs to be revamped) but if DRP (such as it is) was removed completely it would allow mods who have shown themselves unable to mod objectively even more free reign to act with impunity. That would not, imo, be a good move for Boards.

In fact, I think there should be a category added to DRP (or feedback) where complaints or issues with Mods can be submitted to a CMod or Admin, instead of the current blanket "no complaints about mods will be tolerated" rule. If there was such an area, it might help weed out the mods who are not so great in the role. That could be kept with "no response", but at least it would give members a place to lodge their concerns and give Admins / Staff more insight. Just a suggestion.

And if there are not enough volunteers to mod, why not ask for more? I always thought it was by invitation only.

(Don't worry, I won't be volunteering as I already know what the answer would be).

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122490152#Comment_122490152

Part of the appeal and uniqueness of Boards is that moderators, cmods and admins are accessible.

Rather than change that, would you consider automatic site bans for anyone who sends an abusive PM after being sanctioned? That's completely unacceptable and abhorrent behaviour.

OscarMIlde

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122490152#Comment_122490152

Honestly I would disagree regarding dispute resolution. The one and only time I was threadbanned was posting a pic of Sleepy Joe billboard before the last election. I was actually mocking the group who erected the poster as it had so many spelling errors but I was threadbanned for violating a thread rule I was not aware of. When I explained, the post remained deleted but I was allowed back on the thread. I think some form of appeal should be allowed where a poster states their case but possibly not a back and forth beyond that unless the mod/admin instigates it. Would assist both sides. Posters do get to appeal but mod/admin time is not excessively taken up by each complaint.

Bobson Dugnutt

I think a lot of folks take this place far too seriously for their own good. Being in a permanent state of low level outrage must be tiring. Take your warning or ban and move on.
Chill pills needed.

Leg End Reject

My one suggestion to the DRP - the offending post should be looked at in context. I'm quoting myself here.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122487195#Comment_122487195

In this instance the sanction poster X received might be warranted and should not be reversed, but there may be a case to sanction poster A, B, C and D too.

I think a lot of the grievances about moderation is that the current system leaves one poster feeling they have been harshly treated while others get away scot free.

I know there's a shortage of mods, but us regular users can't resolve that.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122490183#Comment_122490183

Not sure if I would go quite that far.

Those threads could still be in CA but CA is not an auto right to any and all.

We could still have parallel threads in CA and Politics but perhaps some clearer rules on what goes where. An actual election thread - CA. Ongoing discussion of a presidency or particular party, Politics only.

More like soccer where access has to be requested.

It would shift some of the activity to Politics which could take some load off CA mods.

Big Bag of Chips

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122490241#Comment_122490241

That is the policy, but I decided to not siteban the user. I took it as a tantrum, knee jerk reaction to my post.

And imagine if I had sitebanned him... 'The victim' versus 'the goader'. Imagine the optics of seeing him sitebanned and 'the goader'still posting.

Nobody would know he was sitebanned for sending an abusive PM and everyone would just see it as the mods getting it wrong and banning the wrong person, again 🤷🏻‍♀️

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122490366#Comment_122490366

Update the charters and make it clear that an abusive PM will lead to an automatic site ban.

You could even have a stickkied thread in DPR where you post a screenshot of the abusive PM and a simply message "Username sitebanned". It might make some think twice, but it will show that the ban was justified. I know it could also be a way for serial rereg trolls to get their kicks but no one should have to engage with abusive PMs here.

I doubt there are many, if any, genuine posters here who would condone abusive PMs.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122490152#Comment_122490152

I appreciate you taking the time out to give your personal opinion.

The user base here I believe have no entitlement to know how, why etc decisions are made.

I believe this is the nub of the problem. Older users see boards as a community and one admin, (in his personal capacity) sees it as a user base.

That's not an attack on you whatsoever. It's my reflection. I think those two beliefs are completely at odds with each other.

If you don't have an executive that sees boards as a community, we have an issue.

My personal opinion (not speaking as an admin) moderation should be anonymous and no dispute resolution. The userbase is not owed any explanations. They wouldn't get It anywhere else

I believe the community does have the entitlement to know how, why etc, decisions are made, because without the community, boards is nothing. The line they wouldn't get it anywhere else is not important, to be honest. One of the things boards prided itself on was it's openness and accessibility. It's noticeable that the site declined once it became more corporate when the original 3 "Gods" sold their shares.

This is not the fault of Boards.ie moderators, admins, management or owners. It is now how the internet is.

I cannot agree with that whatsoever. Boards.ie got lazy, didn't keep up with trends, didn't value what they had, didn't keep updating and enforcing charters. All of that trickled down from the owners, admin and mods. To shake your head and just say, "It's how the internet is" is just a complete cop out.

I don't think it can continue as it is.

Absolutely agree 100%.

It will depend on a complete shift in attitude in a huge portion of the userbase. That's not going to happen. So the site, and moderators are going to have to change from what it always has been.

First of all, why? Why does the "user base" aka the community that has been here for years have to shift their attitude? Who serves who here? With no community, there's no boards. With no boards, there's the rest of the internet.

We need to re-establish "what is boards.ie and what does it stand for?" Once that question is settled, the rest can be started on.

Updates will be provided when they are available

If the owners/management are always working in the background, there should be a weekly update available to all users. At times like this, it shows how important the role of community moderator was to boards.ie

osarusan

Anybody sending abusive PMs after a warning/card (or at any stage) should just be banned.

Tbh, not doing so just creates more work, and more ptential for abuse, for the mod receiving the PMs and other mods.

The whole system, almost collegial system of PMs and DRPs, might have been fit for purpose when the userbase itself was more collegial, but these days certain forums are filled with utter ****, and utter **** need to be culled, not indulged/cajoled.

It's time to acknowledge that not every poster getting into hot water is just in need of a second chance and a pointer in the right direction, and that some posters are here purely to poison debate and damage the site. Take steps to reduce the opportunities for consistently problematic posters to disrupt the site.

Big Bag of Chips

Why does the "user base" aka the community that has been here for years have to shift their attitude?

The attitude has already shifted. That's my point. In order to make Boards great again™ the attitude needs to shift back.

The internet is an angry place now. Boards is a far more angry and aggressive space than it was. I'd find it very difficult to call it a 'community' now in the true sense of the word. It's now a battle ground! With angry people being angry. Negative people being negative. And somewhere in amongst all that is a handful of people trying to hold on to some sort of constructive discussion. But that's the internet!

So yeah... It needs a shift (back) in attitude from a lot of people if it's to be anything like it once was. It's not going to happen though. So moderation will need to change to combat that.

And that won't be well received either 🤷🏻‍♀️

Edit: this isn't true for the entire forum. There still are areas of Boards that absolutely are communities. It's just a small area of the site responsible for most of the complaints in these threads.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122490463#Comment_122490463

Trust in your mods to make logical decisions that are in the best interests of their forum/ the site, and reduce the opportunities for consistently problematic posters to disrupt the site.

That can only happen if we know as users what metric mods/admins/owners are using to ascertain what is "in the best interest of boards.ie"

Is it to increase new users?

Is it to grow communities?

Is it to represent Ireland and all it's people?

Is it to be a warm, welcoming place to all regardless of race, sexuality, physical and mental ability etc?

Is it to increase revenue through advertising?

I have absolutely no idea what the mission statement of boards.ie is anymore, and I'm sure I'm not on my own with that.

ancapailldorcha

To add, the Boards.ie X account hasn't X'd in over a year now.

Big Bag of Chips

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122490463#Comment_122490463

If a moderator reports an abusive PM to me, I always siteban. That is our policy.

I used my discretion yesterday and opted to not siteban the user as I felt it was just a reaction out of frustration - For someone who was "fking sick of the site" they are still posting.

I assume they've calmed down.

You'd surprised how often people stamp their foot and declare their intention to leave!

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122490573#Comment_122490573

You've treated the poster who sent you an abusive PM differently to a poster who's sent one to a mod. There's an argument for someone to justify an abusive PM.

I'm not getting at you personally, but if I sent you an abusive PM would I get away with it? Would you siteban me if I sent one to a mod or cmod?

There's no valid reason for you to accept abuse.

Big Bag of Chips

If he sent it to another mod I'd have banned him. Or at the very least responded to him to ask why he felt entitled to send that to a volunteer moderator. Yesterday I chose to ignore it, not reply and let him calm down. We use our discretion all the time. If you sent me an abusive PM that I thought it crossed a line I would probably send it to one of the other admins to action rather than do it myself and be accused of something-or-other!

Moderation is not a straight line. This has never been claimed. Moderator discretion has always, and will always be a thing. Posters who constantly cause trouble will be treated differently to a poster who is generally a good poster and has a misjudged slip. One might get a 2 point warning , whereas the other might get a PM reminder to rein it in. Some posters will be instructed, some will be warned, some will have posts deleted and a PM asking them to be more careful etc. This has always been the way and is not any secret or conspiracy!

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122490619#Comment_122490619

That's all fair enough, but personally abusive PMs shouldn't be tolerated. It's an extraordinary overreaction to a warning.