(Site is a graveyard - How can boards save itself?) Any update?

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122491772#Comment_122491772

Someone on the same side of the debate as you on here said last night, unprompted, that Boards reflects Irish society in that it is broadly Left leaning.

Do you not think it is possible that moderators likely reflect the same society in which they, the site and other posters mostly exist? Why must it be that 'they are influenced by a cabal of activists'?

Suggesting that moderators aren't capable of forming their own opinions is one thing, but the bigger thing for me is the suggestion that we can only adopt views on the merits of what constitutes acceptable ideals and discourse if a group of activists put on enough pressure to force us to do so.

This, I feel, is what several posters (including me) have alluded to in the shift in consensus on the site. There was a time when certain ideals were very much in the minority, we have seen that shift to some degree, they are still minority ideals (thankfully) but the people expressing them are more vocal than they were in the past and are growing in number as we have seen particularly in the UK recently.

Talking politics on here isn't like discussing a movie, it is very much real life with real life influences and outcomes. I don't want to see the site turn in to a place where unpleasant views are tolerated just so as to not be accused of being influenced by a cabal of activists.

Irish Aris

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122491835#Comment_122491835

I think we have established that mods actively monitoring threads won't happen.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122491900#Comment_122491900

If posters were to refer repeatedly by name to another poster as to what they would say on a topic, without them having done so.

Anything else, responding to posts, is that not what a discussion is? Should people from one side of the argument nominate a responder and have them posts so the person on the other doesn't feel overwhelmed?

Ahwell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122491772#Comment_122491772

What the hell is "a cabal of activists"? Whatever it is, I'm fairly sure it doesn't exist.

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122491970#Comment_122491970

In the same way boards policy of encouraging far right rhetoric doesn't exist?

We could all benefit from not being so entrenched in our own little groups on this site, that's why people make statements like the one you quoted, because that's the perception people understandably have.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492009#Comment_122492009

Has anyone said it's a policy? Can you show me this policy?

Personally, I would prefer if the far right didn't exist on this website.

anewme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122491970#Comment_122491970

Once I hear people people going on about "the cabal", I immediately think conspiracy theories and tin foil hats.

JP Liz V1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122491395#Comment_122491395

Maybe apply to Catherine Martin for funding, Boards would be cheaper than RTE 😁

As for merchandise, make Boards great again baseball caps, tshirts, cups, umbrellas, flip flops, hell yes

Does Boards make money from adverts?

Slightly Kwackers

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122491762#Comment_122491762

I doubt it makes much difference. They should know what they are wiping and why though. There is little evidence of knowledge of the subject sometimes or consistency of approach by whoever does the deleting. I know nothing of Irish politics and never use the politics forums, but I cannot understand how a thread could be maintained on "boards" if people were discussing their political differences.

Frankly the corpse looks well beyond the Lazarus stage. It was o/k a a source of advice once, but replies to "help" and advice requests have dried up.

I will give Reddit a try, I don't know if it will be much different, but sadly Usenet is now virtually useless it became a home for spam and just died away.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492116#Comment_122492116

I think flip flops got us into this mess

Ahem

Edited to add: I think I'd settle for, "make boards.ie relevant again"

MisterAnarchy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122491762#Comment_122491762

Of course they should.

However they should be seen to be neutral or hold moderate views on the forums they directly moderate.

For example if someone openly makes a widesweeping statement that all Trump voters are fascists or racists, or conservatism is dead, that person is clearly unsuitable to moderate any forum with political content.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492136#Comment_122492136

Disagree 100%. All mod actions are appealable. If a mod gets overturned too many times, their modship gets removed.

Asking a user to no longer have an interest or to deflate their interest in a subject they have been offered a modship in, lest it upsets some people that break the rules, is a completely unfair request to make of a volunteer.

JP Liz V1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492129#Comment_122492129

Crocs then

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492136#Comment_122492136

Mods can mod without their personal views interfering. It should be perfectly acceptable for mods to post in whatever threads they are interested in and just 'put on a mod hat ' when they need to.

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492035#Comment_122492035

They don't exist on this website.

You conflate moderate conservatism with the far right.

MisterAnarchy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492171#Comment_122492171

Im not surprised you disagree.

A moderator should not be seen to have outspoken or prejudiced views on a subject they moderate.

Even if they do, those views should be tempered and they should not act in an aggressive manner towards differing viewpoints.

For example if I repeatedly said all Liverpool supporters were fascists or racists could I expect to moderate in the soccer forum ? Or Man Utd supporters were as dumb as rocks, how would that go down.

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122491905#Comment_122491905

I don't frequent CA much, and have never posted in Politics. I'm not overly interested in politics so have no skin in the game.

I have a question though - you have claimed that "unpleasant views" are becoming more prevalent in society and that shift is reflected here. That is surely a current affair topic, and those "unpleasant views" should merit a discussion regardless of whether posters here happen to agree or disagree with them?

You can have zero tolerance for overt hate speech, but a group of like minded posters who think they have "pleasant views" shouldn't dictate what is and isn't an acceptable topic of discussion.

Many people can have moderate or centrist left or right leanings. Not every right leaning person dons a balaclava and threatens the Taoiseach, no more than every left leaning person lives like a hippy. You'll also have people who can be right wing on some topics but left on the other. Disagree with each other, but let the other side have their say.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492207#Comment_122492207

The difference is that Trump's public racist comments are on record, as is his involvement with fascist acts and policies.
Why would someone be going around saying that about Liverpool supporters? It would be absurd.

That's where your analogy falls down completely.

MisterAnarchy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492249#Comment_122492249

The statement was all Trump voters are fascists or racists, not whether Trump was a racist or fascist.

Alot of people vote for the Republican candidate irrespective of who they are, they follow a party, like people follow a football team.

If a politician is corrupt or a womaniser, does that mean all his supporters are corrupt or womanisers ??

Of course not.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492201#Comment_122492201

Wheres the policy?

RobbieTheRobber

Dragging in other right left threads to have a go at each other in the feedback thread.

I was originally going to argue the moderation was the problem.

But after reading the thread I might be siding with them.

🤣🤣

Ahwell

I'm just reading about the Online Safety Code that is supposed to be brought in by the end of year. I know it's being discussed primarily in relation to Facebook and Twitter, but it's bound to have a knock on effect on Boards.ie - how it is regulated/moderated.

The "era of self-regulation is over" apparently.

odyssey06

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492357#Comment_122492357

If the supporters know he is corrupt \ womaniser, then at the very least they are condoning it in terms of character as a politician.
And if the politician makes public speeches extolling the virtues of corruption or womanising… or telling stories about some great strokes or affairs he had. Then inferences can be drawn.
If they vote for a candidate of Party X regardless of the conduct of policies of the candidate, well, it seems reasonable to call that either 'dumb' / ignorant actions or condoning \ approving of that.

And in terms of this thread, I don't think any of the issues with the site in CA, Politics, After Hours are due to moderators stepping outside the lines of the charter when moderating due to personal views.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492235#Comment_122492235

There are many places on the internet you can air unpleasant views. Theres nowhere where it's written that they have to happen on here.

Letting each other have their say was the policy. Sunlight is the best disinfectant and all that.

We now have years of evidence to show that it doesn't work.

They don't engage.

They don't argue in good faith.

They dump videos without explanation.

They never admit when their wrong after it's been pointed out.

They never apologise.

"Unpleasant views" (as you put it) doesn't need an outlet here. It needs a lack of oxygen.

Flaneur OBrien

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492357#Comment_122492357

If you support a fascist, you may not call yourself a fascist, but you do support fascism

If you support a racist, you may not call yourself a racist, but you do support racism.

You cannot be anti-fascist, and support a fascist.

You cannot be anti-racism and support a racist.

If you know a politician is corrupt, and you still support them, you support corruption in this instance or you should be demanding they're held accountable.

As for your last point, womanising? What is this, the 1950's? I mean in the case of Trump, if you support Trump, yes, you support a rapist in this instance. I'm not saying you support rape as a whole, I'm saying you support this rapist and if you have an issue with his raping ways, he should also be held accountable. If you don't have an issue with the rape he committed, that's between you and your conscience.

Leg End Reject

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492403#Comment_122492403

I used "unpleasant views" as it was used in the post I quoted. I don't share these views but I don't think it's fair, or conducive to discussion, for one group to dictate what can and can't be discussed.

Each side thinks their views are the right ones, and each side is capable of posting in bad faith, refusing to openly engage, being curt, being passive aggressive and every other description that's been used in this thread to describe "the other side". The only difference between each side is their underlying beliefs.

nullzero

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492375#Comment_122492375

There is no policy.

Thats the point I was making.

You're more interested in scoring points than offering anything constructive here.

JP Liz V1

Can we get back please to talk about Boards as a whole, genuine feedback not talk of rapist support, far right, far left, etc., it just an easy out now to label a poster far right or lefty, we all have opinions and different views and everyone should be allowed express them on the site given it follows within the guidelines and regulations

OscarMIlde

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492403#Comment_122492403

What's unpleasant to one person might be a perfectly reasonable to another person. The issue is how to express the difference in opinion. To take possibly the most contentious issue on boards, transgender issues. There is a huge gulf from posters who think any questioning of gender ideology is transphobic and should not be tolerated, to posters who think biological sex trumps gender beliefs and another subset of posters who genuinely hold hateful views about gay people, trans people etc.

Outright hateful posts should (and indeed are) banned as soon as possible. But there is no reason the first two groups cannot debate the issue while staying within site rules.

The issue is with lack of active moderation, with an issue where posters genuinely are deeply entrenched and committed to their beliefs there can be groups of posters who take turns in bad faith posting in an effort to win or stymie the discussion; sly insinuations about deeper motivations, speaking in generalities about how such and such is racism or Russian propaganda while being careful to never ever outright accuse anyone in particular of such an offense, mocking posts about hurt feelings and consistent sea lioning. It is clear to people posting within the thread it is happening and over time the thread is either shut down or everyone moderate leaves. I've witnessed it plenty of times in heated threads, and I've seen it from posters who regard themselves as right wing and those who regard themselves as left wing.

I rarely bother to report as I don't want threads shut down. I have also witnessed highly partisan mods come in and side with their favoured 'side' and ignore bad faith posting if it aligns with their views and I'm sure I'm not the only one who has.

To be fair I've also witnessed posters being threadbanned when it becomes impossible to ignore, but it's not always the case and it often takes far too long for it to happen.

Tell me how

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122492235#Comment_122492235

I've also said I've many right wing friends. Particularly in the left including some who campaigned for Trump and believe it or not, 1 who interned for a still sitting US GOP senator. I've also an acquaintance maybe more so than a friend who is a former cop in a major US city and who is very much MAGA leaning. I can engage with all these to various degrees without major issue.

But the unpleasant views I was alluding to (as most people would know) is the outright bigotry and racism that has led to hate speech and violence.

Say I'm right in my classification of these, do you think they should be allowed just because more and more people are expressing them?