Ticketmaster and dynamic pricing

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589430#Comment_122589430

Even if every ticket price tier were advertised in advance(as they should have been) the mechanics of an in demand and oversubscribed event would mean that it would only be when you got to the top of the queue before you know what options were left from that pre published list of tickets prices.....you'd still have to make a decision with the information available to you at that point in time. It is very obvious to me based on the example from earlier today when people had plenty time to make decisions that there are enough people out there willing to pay big money for tickets no matter what queues exist.

Thats the crux of this issue, setting enforced top prices for tickets may solve it but is that right?

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589430#Comment_122589430

and again Irish consumer law is that price at point of purchase is all that is required. Which Ticketmaster did give to people. So I don’t think there is any real substance to complaints.

ledwithhedwith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589604#Comment_122589604

not the same in the UK apparently.

ledwithhedwith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589541#Comment_122589541

It’s pretty simple to lay out the prices or the potential prices before the queue begins , and then you can choose to take your chances queuing or not. That isn’t what happened last Saturday.

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589430#Comment_122589430

It was though. Giving you the price before you check out is sufficient to meet the requirements of being informed of the price in advance of purchase. It's black and white in that sense. It would only be a problem if you pressed 'Purchase' on a face-value ticket of €150 and THEN they charged you €450.

When you have the ticket in your basket, the full and final price is broken down with the service charge and delivery charge (if any) - BEFORE you commit to the purchase. THAT is sufficient for you to be told of the price.

ledwithhedwith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589628#Comment_122589628

god how many times. You should know the price range before you enter a 4 hours queue ffs. It’s common sense. I got mine on presale anyway but it’s left a sour taste .

ledwithhedwith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122575605#Comment_122575605

not even close lol

Pauliedragon

The CCPC are having a look it seems. I can't see much coming from an investigation but you never know.

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2024/0906/1468795-oasis-ticketmaster/

forumdedum

Remember years ago when Ticketmaster set up a resale company. I think recent laws stopped it. I recall because I got ripped off on it by Ticketmaster when I resold tickets. I had to cough up money.

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589641#Comment_122589641

I agree that it would be good to know. I think it would be a great idea and that transparency would be great.

I was simply pointing out that it's not a legal requirement to know. They haven't broken any laws despite how irritating the process is.

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589699#Comment_122589699

Yep, Seatwave. The new ticketing law made it no longer viable to run (for them).

ledwithhedwith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589713#Comment_122589713

yeah that’s a fair point, but the uniqueness and extreme irritating nature of it , it looks possible that it will be stopped in future. As I think you said it won’t alter overall prices or anything for something that’s in demand but it will be a lot more transparent and if you see yourself in a big queue number at least you can say ah they’ll probably be the mad dear ones, I’ll duck out.

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589731#Comment_122589731

Fully agree. The sales process doesn't bother me much at all. But the queuing for hours seems so needless and a waste of people's time. They need a better infrastructure for handling more users at a time and get people through the queue quicker.

Zardoz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589720#Comment_122589720

Seatwave closed in 2018, 3 years before the Irish legislation was introduced.

mazza

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589690#Comment_122589690

The CCPC investigated Ticketmaster in late 2021…and here we are today.

https://www.ccpc.ie/business/enforcement/civil-competition-enforcement/civil-court-cases/ccpc-publishes-report-on-ticketing-investigation/

The report is well worth a read into how the industry works behind the scenes.

mcdonut

There was a parliamentary question regarding this subject in February.

As I see it the law doesn't properly protect consumers. If your exercised by the issue of platinum tickets and dynamic pricing, I'd suggest contacting local representatives and lobby for the law to be changed.

https://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2024-02-27a.479&s=Dynamic+pricing+models#g480.q

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589617#Comment_122589617

It doesn't change the fact that you have no idea what options you will actually get when you get to the top of the queue untill you get there. All you know is the range you might get, you'll still have to make a decision.

There's obviously enough people out there for an event like this who are willing to pay four or five hundred euro for a ticket and if the artists wants to they will take advantage of this, no matter the pricing details.

ledwithhedwith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589829#Comment_122589829

It changes the fact that you know the range of options. It is 100% better than not knowing before a lengthy queue. Course you still have to make a decision lol.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589641#Comment_122589641

But all you will know is the possible list of options. You won't know what options are available to you until they are available to you, at which point it will be very clear what is available to you. What I am saying is they should publish the price ranges but for a gig like this it doesn't make a blind bit of difference to the issues of not enough tickets for demand or indeed the cost of the tickets.

ledwithhedwith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589836#Comment_122589836

ah you don’t get it. It is a small difference but an important one.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589782#Comment_122589782

Literally a first world problem. Go back twenty years and see how painful actual queueing is.

I amnt a complete tech head but I know that for something like the situation you had Saturday and the amount of moving parts, it's not as straightforward to scale to the levels you are looking for.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589838#Comment_122589838

It's not really when you see 6 days later people snapping up tickets at 400 and 500(probably one of the worst seats in the place) euro when they are fully informed and have had plenty time to consider their options(buy or don't buy) the length of queue, time to purchase etc make no odds. There are just people willing to do that.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589832#Comment_122589832

In this instance it wouldn't have made a blind bit of difference. Gig would have sold out same as, and people would have been complaining anyway of the high prices.

People need to stop paying these prices. Only way to change things.

ledwithhedwith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589855#Comment_122589855

what are you saying like, I know people loads that baulked at the 400 standing, if they’d have known the range they could have taken into account right im 40k in a queue no way am I getting original face value ill duck out and won’t waste Saturday. You just seem intent on defending a practice that is not seen in any other retail sale in history apart from other dynamic priced gigs.

ledwithhedwith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589863#Comment_122589863

Jesus Christ , it would have made a difference to plenty of people , how can you not understand that.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589870#Comment_122589870

Were people naive enough to think that all tickets were priced at 89.50?

Look, I can't see how it would have made any difference to the end result.

Ticket prices seem to have been 90, 120, 156, 170, 210, 415, 500 and possible a few in the middle of those. Even the "demand pricing" points seemed to be in an around there.

Do you think that information would have made any difference to how people approaced the sale? It was common knowledge that the starting point was 90 odd euro.

I am not saying they were right in not publishing the figures - they should be made publish them - my point is for a gig that was ridiculously oversubscribed and where people are still paying 400-500 euros it wouldn't have made a blind bit of difference.

forumdedum

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589720#Comment_122589720

That's the one. I was delighted to see the end of them. Awful crowd

ledwithhedwith

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589904#Comment_122589904

You are arguing something completely different. Enjoy your weekend.

dulpit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589904#Comment_122589904

If tickets were sold on the basis that x were €85, x were €110, x were €250 and so on and that was flagged in advance it would have allowed the consumer to know, in advance, what the ranges were, what the likelihood of getting a ticket in a particular range was and decide, in advance, what range they were happy with.

Not knowing, having a massive queue which crawled and then getting presented with an expensive ticket with 6 or 7 minutes to decide is a massive pressure tactic. Yes, the tickets sold. Yes, they would have sold regardless. But the consumer is not being protected here, and they should be.

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589846#Comment_122589846

Jeez…hostile much? Was just pointing out it was a pain in the ass. Chill out a bit.

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589787#Comment_122589787

Yes that's true but it did closed down as the bill was introduced to the Dail (which was in 2018).

SchrodingersCat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122576815#Comment_122576815

What if the tickets are the same price from all vendors? €250 € 400 and 500 for example? This would be defined by the artist. Granted there might be fee differences to the artist and the consumer.

If there was more than the one company, Ticketmaster, selling the tickets, there would be more competition between them to provide lower prices and a better service to customers. If a company develops a bad name for its service or high service costs, i.e. Ticketmaster, customers would be more likely to go to one of the others for their purchases. If a company brought in dynamic pricing and the other didnt, I know which company I would be going to.

There is no way that Ticketmaster could not have announced the prices or a more accurate list of their prices before the gig. Customers would have a better idea of what they would have to pay before sitting through the indefinite queuing. They could decide then if it was worth their while or not and not waste their time. As an example, it was done for the Garth Brooks gig in 2022.

Even with standard tiered pricing, where the prices are published prior to going on sale, the customer doesn't know what they will be presented with until they get to the top of the queue -you get this -right?

Patronising much? -Don't attack the poster if you cant attack the post.

Zardoz

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122590053#Comment_122590053

Just a coincidence, the bill had nothing to do with them closing.

Seatwave operated across Europe, and its sister site GetMeIn was Uk based.

Decisions by Irish politicans had about as much effect as a fly on an elephants back.

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122590128#Comment_122590128

Fair point! Didn't think about the non-Irish side of it.

Jaffa3000

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122590097#Comment_122590097

Tickets were provided by another company is the UK, don’t change anything. That other company (SeeTickets/Gigs and Tours) provides a (imo) much more frustrating experience than Ticketmaster

Water John

Well the high paying fans get the usual regard from Liam:

https://www.joe.ie/entertainment/liam-gallagher-tells-oasis-fans-complaining-about-ticket-prices-to-shut-up-816993

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122589713#Comment_122589713

yeah uk and ireland have invitation to treat as basis for purchase laws I.E the price on shelves can be wrong and you’ve no right to the advertised price on the shelf, it’s only price once on the checkout Till that matters. As TM clearly state the price on the checkout screen I don’t see how either Irish or uk authorities will find wrong doing on that aspect.

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122590097#Comment_122590097

to be repeated for the millionth time, ticketmaster have no involvement in the ticket prices. Competition to ticketmaster would have zero impact on ticket prices

There is the case here that venues themselves knock a quid or two off the ticket fee from what TM charge. That’s about height of reduction.

If another ticketing company sets up tomorrow and negotiates an allotment of oasis tickets the price they charge will be the exact same as TM. The promoter/artist isn’t going to give discounted tickets to new ticket company over TM.
this was a revenue maximisation exercise by oasis, truthfully they could have reduced the flat pricing allocation an throw thousands more on vip or dynamic and made a few million more for Croker.

crl84

There's also several other ticketing companies operating here and in other jurisdictions.

Artists/promoters overwhelmingly choose to go with Ticketmaster, as despite whinging about the occasional huge gig from people who have zero clue about the process, Ticketmaster does a perfectly good job for the thousands of events it sells tickets for in Ireland every year, on behalf of their customer: the promoters of those events. Those customers are perfectly happy with the service they get.

And for the people buying tickets, Ticketmaster works exactly as it should for the dozens of events being held every single day. People who think TM deliver a "bad service" have clearly never had to regularly deal with SeeTickets, AXS or Dice.

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122605258#Comment_122605258

now ticketmaster is a monopoly here and has achieved it through practices the competition authority and equivalent bodies across the world have deemed un competitive such as long term venue/promoter exclusivity deals.
ticketmaster pays healthy rebates to promoters, venues and artists for using them.
honestly out of all aspects of live nation monopoly ticketmaster is probably the least objectionable part. They charge fees and sell tickets.
every year there will be issues about their service when you have a Taylor or oasis show as any system probably couldn’t handle such sales. You now have artist management developing ways and means to deal with such crazy situations and none will figure out a good and fair way when you have demand that 5x -10x the venue capacity.

Exclamation Marc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122605388#Comment_122605388

I think that the biggest issue re: the Live Nation monopoly is how they've tied up certain venues in Ireland when there are a distinct lack of alternatives. Would agree that Ticketmaster is the least of the industry's problem - whilst they could do better in some aspects, they just become the fall guy.

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122605468#Comment_122605468

I just don’t see any alternative ticketing company doing a better job for lower ticket fees.
the industry has priced in this rebates into their operational model/budget.
Ticketmaster is a handy fall guy for a ton of artist mangt decisions, it’s also deflects the fact that artists get rebates on the €7-10 fee per ticket for those big shows.

tom1ie

Folks i got a presale link to imagine dragons and I tried to get tickets on Wednesday.
To cut a long story short I selected two tickets and the TM website said “we are securing your tickets”

I went through my PRSB authentication process and the TM website then continued processing my tickets, but then I got a message on the screen from TM saying “it’s not you- it’s us, we are currently experiencing an issue with your order”

No money was taken out of my account and I have no tickets.
Is this just a case of the TM website being a joke shop, or was I unlucky or what’s the craic.
I don’t hold out much hope of securing two tickets in the general sale.

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122610098#Comment_122610098

it’s happens to people. Authentication does cause the order to time out the connection etc

dulpit

I was buying a ticket for Linkin Park presale today in London. Joined queue, was number 8k or so, got to top of queue. Very little available. Every seat I clicked disappeared. Then I got kicked from queue. Rejoined, now I'm 33k in the queue.

Got back to top of queue, more seats available now than earlier. But weird restrictions. I was only buying 1 seat. I was told I couldn't buy a seat it if left only 1 seat available in a row. I was told I couldn't buy an aisle seat unless I bought 2 seats.

Kept refreshing the page and finally for sorted, but what a pain in the hole. Are these weird scenarios likely to be a ticketmaster policy or a venue policy I wonder?

And what's the story with seats randomly appearing and then disappearing while you queue?

Fanirish

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122610539#Comment_122610539

ticketmaster standard policy is not to allow single seats to be left in a row on presales or on initial sales. Reason being that it doesn’t want dozen or hundreds of single seats left to be sold as for obvious reasons they are nearly impossible to shift.

Not all presales tickets are made available initially, they release blocks of them at a time during the morning of presales.

Seats appear and disappear as they can be in other people’s baskets and when they get released they go back into circulation.

Also the ticketmaster system is not 100% live, it can show tickets that have been bought a minute or two ago. Ghosts in the system essentially

BaywatchHQ

I also had issues buying a Linkin Park ticket, I kept refreshing and by the time I got zoomed into the section the seats were gone. I did this over 20 times. Then half an hour new tickets came up via AXS and had to make do with a standing ticket. I wonder why standing tickets are more expensive when you are almost guaranteed a worse view?

dulpit

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122623054#Comment_122623054

Closer to the stage though. Plus jumping around.

geographica

I got two tickets for a concert from ticketmaster today and it says mobile only (FFFFFS) does this mean I have to be there with my phone (they aren't for me) or give my phone to the person, or can they download the app and I give them my log in details to show on their phones on entry?

Ash.J.Williams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122575429#Comment_122575429

That's a great idea,