French man accused of drugging his wife and inviting men to rape her

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122586951#Comment_122586951

Why would rapists report their own crimes?

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122586930#Comment_122586930

There are more than 50 perps in this case alone,

there are certainly more sexual violence cases in france than the one case,

the short version is translation of this crime to Ireland in crude form, 83 perps in male pop (age 15+) of 25,729,140

becomes in Ireland (male pop 15+ of 2,033,994) about 7 perps.

I don't know what points this makes or anything, but I did the math. It's still 83 perps in a criminal conspiracy (at least through the husband, idk how much they knew of one another all).

Musicrules

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122586304#Comment_122586304

This is getting sick now. The continued outrage over someone having a go at rapists who happen to be men is scary.

Musicrules

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122586956#Comment_122586956

Could one of them not somehow manage not to rape and report the sicko husband? Not one of them had any form of conscience?

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122586991#Comment_122586991

You think rapists would voluntarily hand themselves in?

That adorably naive tbh.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122586970#Comment_122586970

read the second post. That’s it. What more can be said. It’s some serious evil sick behaviour by 71+ people.

however some posters including the now silenced OP keep pushing the evil men agenda.

Musicrules

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587122#Comment_122587122

Well they couldn't be rapists if they reported the husband and didn't touch his wife. Why hasn't that occurred to you? Unless you know that all 70+ men had already raped women?

Musicrules

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587161#Comment_122587161

*Evil rapists who happen to be men agenda.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587175#Comment_122587175

how do you know they identify as men? Evil indeed that are.

Musicrules

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587208#Comment_122587208

I was just correcting your post.

marilynrr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587122#Comment_122587122

It seems that some men were in contact with this man and didn't go through with it once they realised that it wasn't actually consensual roleplay.

He said that 3 out of every 10 men refused his invitation when he explained what he was doing to his wife was not consensual.

Now we don't really know anything about that 3 out of 10 men, maybe some of them would have wanted to but thought it was some kind of sting so they didn't go ahead with it.

But presumably some of them were genuinely only after some kind of consensual roleplay and when they found out the wife wasn't actually consenting they weren't interested, but none of those men reported it. Maybe they didn't want their own accounts looked into even though they had never done anything illegal or maybe they had done some illegal stuff like view and share non consensual pictures or something but actually physically going through with it was a step too far with them.

Impossible to know really.

marilynrr

Edit, read posts wrong!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587221#Comment_122587221

nah you weren’t. Dodging you are

Vestiapx

I like playing certain board games. If someone found me on a forum for those board games and then met me and it turned out that I wanted to play that board game and then they met 70 more people and they also wanted to play that board game.

Would that have any statistical impact on the number of people who have ever played the game ?

Self selected group is self selected that's how numbers work.

The whole thing is horrible and everyone involved should be shot in the dick but don't blame normal people for the behaviour of a certain group.

marilynrr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122586849#Comment_122586849

I haven't read Dr. Marie Cassidys book but it's supposed to very interesting. I've heard and read some of her interviews over the years and she said you need to have a bit of a strange personality to do that job, she was intending to be a GP I think but hated it and didn't feel like she was good at helping people and she was better with dead patients, she also said if you need counselling or therapy after it then it's not the right job for you!

She seems to be very matter of fact about it and was well able to do her job without emotion when she was dealing with bodies, but she said the sad part was seeing the impact on the families during the trials or inquests etc.

_H80_GHT

Yes, unfortunately. It's hard to argue with your 'if the opportunity presents itself' point. The facts are the facts.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587279#Comment_122587279

so all men are rapists or potential rapists! Got it.

Don't you sit on the fence with your opinion!

downthemiddle

What happened to this poor woman is horrific and beyond the comprehension of any rational human being. That should be the only topic of discussion on this thread.

Unfortunately, we are seeing how toxic the internet can be with some individuals using this thread in a pathetic attempt to score points.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587268#Comment_122587268

that last bit is the hard bit for me here too. I remember how naive I was when I was younger when one of my closest loved ones passed in a tragic accident and she had a really harrowing Irish wake (wasn’t expecting or ready for that) at home but it felt like everyone we had ever met, personally professionally and academically etc. had come for miles to pay respects and we had a frankly a touching ceremony at the church in Clarecastle and then we… had to do it all over twice because her mother wanted her buried in Dublin so we had another open casket there and another funeral and it was just a big punch in the chest…

I say all that because it doesn’t hold a wet candle to what this woman this victim she went through, hundreds of rapes and now she’s going to have to sit in court and proceedings (and has been) for gods know how long and likely be present when all that evidence and play it for the jury, 51 at least, maybe eventually 83 people raping her, some of them multiple times, and just being re-exposed to the grief over and over and over for what will probably feel like eternity. It’s beyond true comprehension what she’s still having to go through to at least get some paltry justice. And yet I think any words of encouragement or condolence outside people can offer her would just land flat, she’s on an island of one in so many ways over what’s happened and happening. It’s just all so **** miserable and sad.

_H80_GHT

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587322#Comment_122587322

Don't be silly. Only morons would deduce that from what I said. My point is that the number of willing rapists in such a small area are disturbingly high. That's what I'm referring to.

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587228#Comment_122587228

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587171#Comment_122587171

so you appear to have been misled by the OP's fantasy normal men narrative.

None of the people on that website were innocents. It was a site designed for criminality. Not bondage or roleplay. They knew what they wanted and what they were doing. Maybe she just wasn't their type or didn't want to be recorded. Unless one of the suspects has a severe mental disability they knew it wasn't a dating site ffs.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587353#Comment_122587353

I quote you “Yes, unfortunately. It's hard to argue with your 'if the opportunity presents itself' point. The facts are the facts.”

And I am the silly one👍 nice one!

marilynrr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587384#Comment_122587384

According to wikipedia it was often likened to a dating site, and it links to this website where they said people used it to chat and make new friends but they warned of the dangers. If you read the comments it seems some people said they were just chatting also.

https://www.journalduweb.org/coco-chat-cocoland-pourquoi-faut-il-etre-prudent-sur-ce-site/

It apparently had at least 850,000 users in France alone! Were all of them there for criminality? I suppose it's possible if you want to add in minor things like buying and selling weed I suppose.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587268#Comment_122587268

Dr Cassidy's casebook is still available on RTE Player, Season 2 is the femicide cases. I think she's brilliant.

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587405#Comment_122587405

The article you linked to paints a very different story of the place.

The fact that the site is accessible to everyone, including minors, makes the Coco chat a veritable hunting ground for sex offenders and pedophiles.

As recently as 2019, Ouest France reported that a Brest man had managed to download 3,000 images and 160 videos of children from the Cocoland chat site between 2013 and 2016. To do this, he connected to the site daily, even going so far as to stay there 8 hours a day when he was not working. Apprehended by the Brest police station, he admitted the facts in court and the prosecutor requested an 18-month suspended prison sentence, a work obligation, care and his registration in the sex offender register.

But this is not the only case surrounding the Cocoland site . In 2014, according to a case reported by Le Parisien , two pedophiles regularly chat with minors on the online chat. A gendarmerie cyber patrol pretended to be a 13-year-old girl on the site. During the exchanges, the pedophiles quickly told the little girl that they wanted photos of her, that they wanted to teach her fellatio and even teach her how to make love. The two were sentenced to 3 years and 18 months in prison respectively by the Compiègne criminal court for corruption of minors.

Another case. This time in Troyes and reported by l'Est Eclair , involving underage girls at the time of the events who forced two fragile and vulnerable 16-year-old girls into prostitution. They all lived in a shelter in the Troyes area, but the two pimps were responsible for writing ads and making appointments, again on the Cocoland website.

According to Ouest France , it also happened in Cholet that two high school students trapped adults by posting false ads for paid sexual encounters on Coco tchat and then arrived to rob the "victims" of their money.

Even more alarming (information relayed by BFM ), the tragic death of a man. Four teenagers had set an ambush for him under the pretext of a meeting, only to end up beating him with fatal violence...

These stories are far from isolated and paint a dark picture… They remind us (and it is imperative that we never forget this) that the internet can be a dangerous place when arranging meetings with strangers.

And the name of the specific chatroom the perps used in the case was called “a son insu,” which means “without their knowledge.”

We don't need to speculate it about it here though, the investigators who shut down the site also almost surely have access to all the records they need for the trials, it is they who will sus out if any of the accused have exculpable defenses against their criminal charges.

marilynrr

@Overheal

Yes I did say that the article warned of the dangers, it obviously described a lot of awful stuff and we know it was full of awful stuff, but it does appear that alongside all of that that some people did use it to chat.

Yes I know that that was the name of the chatroom but then I don't know what else was in that chatroom, could there have been erotic fiction or some kind of consensual stuff also? Who knows really!

I don't think any of the accused will have any kind of defense. I certainly hope not.

I was discussing the other 30ish men who came into contact with him and refused the offer and who haven't been accused of anything in the trial. Someone up thread asked did none of them have a conscience at all so I was just pondering it.

I'm not sure if the police could access much of the data, the messages disappeared after a few hours which is presumably a big reasons why it was so popular for all the sick ****, are they able to get messages from snapchat etc?

marilynrr

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587351#Comment_122587351

Sorry that you lost your loved one 💐

Yes what happened to her was the most unimaginable betrayal, it's hard to imagine anything even being able to take the edge of the pain and suffering she went through. So many lives ruined here. The daughters experience is also sickening, it would be hard to imagine how you could trust a man again after her own father drugged her and took pictures of her. And the sons/brothers too. It's hard to imagine them being able to ever get past these horrors.

marilynrr

In this article of the daughters account it says 'He did not have to go far to find willing participants. Most of those who responded lived close by' so it seems that most of them were in fact locals.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/09/03/french-family-date-rape-case-gisele-pelicot/

Mr Disco

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587530#Comment_122587530

we are unfortunately living in an age of peak deviancy, the woke anything goes attitude that now pervades society allows justification and encourages these awful behaviours

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587563#Comment_122587563

No one is justifying their behavior.

Mr Disco

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587564#Comment_122587564

they self justify

Overheal

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587565#Comment_122587565

then I have no idea why you are blaming it on wokeness or society and not them. bullshit argument. Go on and blame GTA Vice City next for all the use.

kaymin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587530#Comment_122587530

The daughter didn't say that though - that's a remark from the journalist. I'd be surprised if it is correct.

Musicrules

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587254#Comment_122587254

Rapist hate is not man hate, no matter how often that gets repeated.

Musicrules

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587384#Comment_122587384

Stop backtracking. You said they were all rapists, how do you know this?

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587624#Comment_122587624

From reading about the actual case not the OP's nonsense version that they were normal. If you want to keep banging the OP's fantasy drum to further your agenda then fire away.

FishOnABike

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122585483#Comment_122585483

It is a matter of perspctive. From the victim's perspective it is unimaginable in its enormity.

From a population wide perspective it is tiny.

From a poulation of near 70,000,000 within a self selected sub group within that population who had the disposition to contact similar people on an online forum the main protagonist found, on average, seven people every year over approx. ten years. It is a tiny fraction of one percent. Another poster calculated 0.0013%.

How does society deal with such a tiny, unrepresentative section of the population?

Musicrules

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587655#Comment_122587655

Avoiding the question eh? How do you know they were all rapists? That was your reason for none of them reporting the husband.

Musicrules

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587663#Comment_122587663

The OP was clearly talking about 70+ men involved in this case. That is a heck of a lot of men. You're continuing to misrepresent that as others have. Very poor form.

We also have reports that most of the men were in the locality, do you know different? And stop trying to downplay the issue of sexual assault against women. That's disgusting. It's not just 70 men who rape women and it's not just based in France.

2smiggy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587667#Comment_122587667

they were all connected to the same website. Does it make sense to you that maybe all sicko's may tend to use the same sick websites ? In the same way like minded people used 4chan ? I don't have a sock puppet demonstration to make it easier for you to understand unfortunately. Maybe there is someone there to help you ?

KaneToad

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587500#Comment_122587500

I think Cassidy is an attention seeking media daaasrling.

Musicrules

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587683#Comment_122587683

Well then we have a real issue don't we? If you're saying the sickos are confined to this site, there were 850,000 users so 850,000 sickos. Do you all think 850,000 is a heck of a lot of men?

2smiggy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587699#Comment_122587699

math's doesn't seem to be your friend. The opening poster said 50+ men, which to them is 'a heck of a lot of men'. They also implied they were local, which isn't the case it seems. The website was one where sick minded individuals could connect, also like 4chan. That does not mean that everyone that used the website was a rapist. You understand this, or again try find someone to help you understand. You quoted 850000 users, how many of those were female ? You said 850000 is 'a heck of a lot of men'

Musicrules

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587726#Comment_122587726

You're just lying. I'm not sure why? The OP said 70+ men, which is a heck of a lot of men. Reports are saying that most may actually be local. I didn't say 850,000 were rapists. You said sickos use the same sick website so you were saying there was 850,000 sickos. Do you think that's a lot? I'd say as the members list would be about the same as the stats on rape, overwhelmingly male dominated.

Basically, everything you said in your post was either a lie or just wrong. Are you busy doing something with a sock or something that you keep talking about?

where has the OP gone? Or are they sitting back enjoying the car crash thread?

Feisar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587726#Comment_122587726

In fairness I ran the numbers there and it doesn't make for pretty reading. 51nr on trial and another 20nr could not be identified. so 71nr in total.

According to the BBC all this occured between 2011-2020. Started in Paris and continued after move to Mazan in 2013. 71nr rapists over nine years, two years in Paris and seven in Mazan so all else being equal 55nr in Mazan. BBC also said most were local so is 90% a fair representation of "most"? That gives 49.7, so say 50nr. Population of Mazan is 6,269, divide by 2 and that's 1254 men living in a 37.92 km2 area. That's 4% or 1:25 which is pretty shocking.

I say this as a man who gets mildly annoyed when men get painted as as evil and "men need to do better etc etc"

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cd9dwxexp77o

2smiggy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587816#Comment_122587816

waste of time engaging with the simple minded

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122587688#Comment_122587688

It was actually a really good series, I don't watch much tv least of all RTE but I watched that twice probably because I had a vested interest in the subject matter and it was a very well put together documentary series.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122585025#Comment_122585025

I don't know who "they" is but nobody said it was a local newspaper. It was a meet-up site, and what I said was that the men involved were all from the region. That's because I read that in some of the earlier coverage long before the trial started. France is a big place, so that does NOT mean the same village, which only has 6000 people in it. It does mean they weren't coming from the other end of the country, they were apparently coming from within driving distance.

I already linked to the victim telling the court that one man was a neighbour whom she knew from speaking to occasionally at the local shops. She said he was always pleasant and polite. She had no idea that he was also coming to her home and raping her.

Here's another example: a man was interviewed on the radio talking about a very close friend of his who is one of the accused. Again, he had no idea, he said he wouldn't have hesitated to leave his own children with this man.

And, talking about the man's defence that it was basically a single unfortunate attack of momentary madness, this man was not convinced and he says "He had to search online, … he had to (drive) 20 minutes to get there and he wasn't to wear any scents etc…"

https://rmc.bfmtv.com/actualites/police-justice/faits-divers/viols-de-mazan-de-la-colere-de-la-haine-le-temoignage-d-un-proche-de-l-un-des-51-accuses_AV-202409030498.html?dicbo=v2-8TEf4op

"A priori, il n’y est allé qu’une fois. Mais sur ce site pourri, il faut faire une recherche, il a dû faire 20 minutes pour s’y rendre, et il ne fallait pas mettre de parfum, etc. ils y sont allés en toute conscience."

Twenty minutes to get there?? It takes about 10 hours to drive from the north to the south of France. 20 minutes is local. And that's just a random guy being interviewed. He wasn't chosen because his former friend was different from the others. He's typical of the 50 accused. That's the point.

So yes, they were recruited locally. Which TBF makes sense, since it was a site that was set up for hook-ups. The main reason it was finally shut down, apparently, was nothing to do with this scandal: it was because it was being used to target gay men for robbery - again, they weren't crossing the whole of France for a gay hook up. It was local.

And anyone who tries to claim that I've ever said "local newspaper" or "same village" etc is lying and I'll report that as a lie.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122584983#Comment_122584983

To be fair to the cops, there's also the fact that they didn't just write that incident off either, as often happens.

According to the evidence being given in court, something about him when they interviewed him (not sure what) gave them the intuition that they were dealing with a sexual predator. That's why they seized his computers, hard drives, phones etc. If they'd just done what the Metropolitan Police in London would no doubt have done, given their record on sex offenders, they'd have shaken a finger at him and let it go at that, and it woudl still have been going on.

If she hadn't died in the meantime - the medical expert said, from watching the videos, that much of the time she was so deeply unconscious that she would been safer put in the recovery position, to stop her suffocating. The judge asked if she was in danger of dying each time, and the doctor said "Yes".

I wonder how the husband would have explained it away if she had died. Suicide?