Hezbollah pager explosions

tayto lover

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648014#Comment_122648014

Go back in the thread and you'll find that I did criticise any crimes committed by anyone.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648115#Comment_122648115

It's a very good question. Supporters of the regime in Tel Aviv appear to be saying that the only solution going forward is for Palestine and Lebanon to accept whatever Israel imposes on them (including a 'one state' solution for Palestine).

Adherents to this belief would say the 1916 Rising and Irish War of Independence was criminal and illegal, carried out by evil terrorists and never should have taken place.

Cordell

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648120#Comment_122648120

Stop murdering Palestinian's when not at war

The thing is, they're always at war. Some of you seem to think that Palestinians were peaceful before 7/10, but the truth is that in the last 20 years Palestinians launched tens of thousands or rockets. And that's why the Iron Dome is a unique defense system that no other country was forced to develop. Unfortunately kids are dying, but you can't blame the Israeli - they are doing whatever any normal parent will do to protect their own children, that is, whatever it takes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_rocket_attacks_on_Israel#History

dmcdona

Haaretz:

Defence Minister Yoav Gallant said that "in the days ahead, 

the public will need to show calm, discipline, and full compliance with Home Front Command instructions

…We are 

intensifying our strikes in Lebanon

; this series of actions will continue until we achieve our goals, bringing the residents of the north back to their homes safely."

I'd imagine people in the North are rather sceptical given a year's worth of War Cabinet promises to bring the hostages safely back home.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648347#Comment_122648347

If Israel stops bombing Gaza, Hezbollah stops bombing Israel. Instead of this Israel has bombed, Syria, Iran, Yemen and Lebanon and killed 750 people in the West Bank.
Israel is not going to become more secure by killing more people. They have tried it before. It failed then and it will fail this time too.
Invading Lebanon yet again will not achieve long term security for Israel anymore than America invading Afghanistan again would increase US security.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648010#Comment_122648010

I asked two genuine questions - what was disingenuous about them?

The tone of the questions comes across that way: the "But why now?" sounds like you have a different explanation in your own mind, one which for some reason you don't want to share.

But maybe I'm wrong and you really do have a better explanation, and are just waiting for a chance to tell us what that might be? If so, I'm all ears.

I won't repeat the analysis about the pagers as it's well-known, and not mine anyway. If you think it's silly, again, I can only suggest you provide a more plausible one. I don't claim to be an expert on military matters generally, nor on middle eastern politics for that matters, so I may well have missed another reason.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648207#Comment_122648207

You're showing your ignorance of Northern Ireland here. The IRA very rarely gave no warning for bombs that targeted non military targets, and when that did happen it was generally through mix-ups and mistakes - and not always just the IRA's mistakes either.

Moreover it was always very controversial within the nationalist community whenever civilians were killed by the IRA - even English or protestant civilians (I'm excluding part time members of the RUC and UDR, who weren't considered to be civilians), so no-warning bombs were never the norm from republicans, not even in England in bars where the army drank. I can't actually think of one such happening in Northern Ireland at all.

You mention Manchester and Canary Wharf - there were warnings given for both of those. The only ones I can think of where bombs were actually "thrown into pubs" were as part of a shortlived campaign in Englans against pubs where servicemen drank. General warnings were given telling people that drinkning in bars frequented by the army was not a good idea, so even then, while it was certainly reckless (and controversial within the national community) English civilians were not targeted per se.

Like I say, you don't have a clue.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648241#Comment_122648241

The lack of understanding of history here is so egregious that there's not a lot of point in even trying to explain where this is wrong.

dmcdona

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648581#Comment_122648581

No - they were two genuine questions. whatever "tone" you thought was in there was a function of your imagination.

I can't see any other reason for the "now" than Israel is simply carrying on its modus operandi - terrorism, genocide, murder of innocents. And why did they kick it off with the pagers? Why not just go in all guns blazing, as normal?

As I've said elsewhere, maybe having exhausted Gaza, the IDF just need some fresh meat.

I certainly do not understand opening up another front at this time when Israeli objectives in Gaza are clearly unaccomplished and the hostages and their families are abandoned.

Grayson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648442#Comment_122648442

It's such a boring tactic. Israel bombs a hospital and the reaction is to say, why aren't you criticizing Hezbollah/Hamas?

Then when you say the October attacks were horrible, they say why aren't you calling for the release of the hostages.

If you condemn the killing in October, they ask why you're not condemning sexual violence.

If you condemn every horrific thing that Hamas, Hezbollah etc have ever done, then they'll just assume you're lying. And 20 pages later it starts again.

There's a certain mindset here that just can't grasp that killing civilians, no matter who does it, is bad. And they also seem to believe that if one side kills civilians, it means that their side has free reign to kill as many civilians as they want.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648720#Comment_122648720

But neither you nor I are military experts, so if it's a genuine question, why are you even asking me? Or other posters, come to that.

Ans: because it's not really a genuine question. If it were, you'd ask an expert. Or read up about it and share your evidence.

Because if you were actually interested in answers, you'd easily find lots of analyses by people with some specialist knowledge - for instance someone posted a comment by Shashank Joshi which on its own doesn't say much but I'd imagine he has written more about it than that one tweet. And there are lots of others.

But this, below, is not a serious attempt at understanding anything. It's merely projecting your existing opinion about Israel in general onto these events.

I can't see any other reason for the "now" than Israel is simply carrying on its modus operandi - terrorism, genocide, murder of innocents. And why did they kick it off with the pagers? Why not just go in all guns blazing, as normal?

As I've said elsewhere, maybe having exhausted Gaza, the IDF just need some fresh meat.

IOW you've proven my initial suspicion about your "questions" to have been correct.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648462#Comment_122648462

Again with the Ireland/Palestine comparisons. You guys really have to stop seeing this conflict through the myopic lens of Ireland's past conflicts.

Did the War of Independence feature a day of rape, pillage, mutilation and murder of random innocent people? Fairly sure it didn't and if it did, I'm also fairly sure history would have a different view of it.

Grayson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648656#Comment_122648656

I'm not displaying my ignorance, but thanks for the insult and for ignoring the point.

The point was that in the worst year of the troubles, there were more civilians killed than were killed by Hezbollah in the last 10 years. And yet the british never started bombing civilian areas. In fact we condemn all the civilian deaths that occurred because of British actions at that time. The UK has even prosecuted some of the perpetrators and held investigations/inquiries into the events. Something that Israel never do. Actually, that's not quite true. there was the time they chased down a fleet of clearly marked cars with humanitarian workers. Tell me, how many of the people that were responsible have been charged with crimes? Wasn't it all just a mix up and nobody was charged with crimes. Can you remember the reaction when the British tried the same thing in Northern Ireland. When soldiers got off scot free.

You seem to think that Hezbollah missiles are bad, IRA bombs ok. Even through the IRA's bombs killed far more people.

The IRA called in warnings, sometimes. But those warnings were incredibly bad. That's why there were so many civilian deaths.

But hey, if you think bad warnings absolves the actions of the bombers, then I guess you see a moral equivalence between the IRA throwing a bomb into a pub and the Israelis bombing a hospital and think they're both ok.

My stance is that killing civilians is wrong. I will condemn the actions of Hamas, Hezbollah, the IDF, the IRA & the British army when civilians are targeted and/or killed.

nacho libre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122647146#Comment_122647146

And just for balance you might also point out you won't get change with Likud led By Bibi. This is the man who has stated openly there will be no Palestinian state under his watch. He'll be happy to prop up Islamists again if that prospect looks likely. He'll also probably hold another mock funeral for any Israeli leader that tries to come to an accommodation with the Palestinians.

dmcdona

50 children murdered in 2 days. The crimes just keep racking up…

I guess no-one will be calling the Lebanese Health Ministry figures as "suspect seeing as they are in fact Hezbollah". Or will they?

BBC:

Lebanese health ministry says 558 killed since Monday strikespublished at 11:21 British Summer Time11:21 BSTBREAKING

In their latest update, the Lebanese health ministry says 558 people have been killed since Monday after Israeli strikes in the country.

Lebanese health minister Firass Abiad says of those killed, 50 were children. 

As a reminder, Monday was the deadliest day in Lebanon since the end of the civil war in 1990.

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648916#Comment_122648916

There will be no 2 state solution, whether Bibi or Likud disappeared.

The people who were hit hardest on Oct 7th where the heart and soul of the left and progressive side of Israeli society.

Not by accident, by design.

Besides no one on the Palestinian side is interested in a 2 state solution either, Oct 7th just forced a lot of Israelis who wanted it to cop themselves on.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648786#Comment_122648786

It's not why there were so many civilian deaths though, is it?

You're making the usual free stater "mistakes" about who did the killing of civilians.

And a member of my extended family died in the Omagh bombings - to mention just one of the people I knew who died in the troubles, so I'll take no lessons from you on that score.

So yes, civilian deaths are terrible. But unlike you, I see a difference between deliberate targeting of civilians because they are easy targets, and all deaths in a conflict - and that's not to justify them.

But there is a difference all the same when you're living through it. It's the difference between "Someone wants to kill you" and "You can generally keep out of the way if you understand what's happening."

dmcdona

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648747#Comment_122648747

The questions I asked were to another poster - not you.

You just jumped in and answered with a "plausible" reason even though you're not a "military expert".

The questions were genuine - so far, no answers. I can only assume Israel are capable of pretty much any large scale attack on anyone they don't like, and brush it off as self-defence with civilians unfortunately as collateral damage. That is immoral.

Happy to hear any cogent reason to the contrary.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648774#Comment_122648774

Do you accept that Irish independence could not have come about without an "illegal" war of attrition against the occupying power, often using unconventional means such as gun attacks, assassinations, arson, road ambushes etc?

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648774#Comment_122648774

Comparing the Palestinian movement of today Vs the 1970s and 80s is even more bizarre than comparing Irish history and that region.

People need to stop pretending that there is anything socialist, anything left wing, etc about the modern Palestinian movements.

Ultra conservative, ultra reactionary, religiously motivated more than by western concepts about nation states.

nacho libre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648943#Comment_122648943

There are Palestinians in the PA who are interested in a two state solution.

Bibi propped up Hamas to undermine them. Whatever chance there is for a settlement we need to see the back of Likud and Hamas for that to happen

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648958#Comment_122648958

I said I'd read it, not that I was an expert. More poor reading skills from you, it seems.

Are conversations strictly one-to-one on here now anyway? I thought it was open to all - my mistake perhaps? But if the question was genuine, why would it matter who responded?

And if you really were looking for an answer, you wouldn't really to get one on here. I even gave you the name of a defence expert who I know has commented on it - did you look him up yet?

Or do you just want to complain because nobody on here has given you a reply that satisfies you?

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648965#Comment_122648965

They are just a mini bus crash away from being wiped out though and if they ever had an election they would be shortly tied to the back of motorbikes and bounced off the road till death like their past comrades when their people got a hold of them.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648965#Comment_122648965

This is true. But here's the thing: many of the people Hamas kidnapped or killed were exactly the sort of left wing peaceniks who despise Likud and Netanyahu and who want (wanted) peace with the Palestinians.

There were Israelis out marching against Netanyahu and the rightwing/religious element in government the summer before Oct 7th.

Here is the bedroom of one of the hostages shot dead by Hamas to prevent them from being rescued (Hersh Goldberg Polin) - what does that tell you about his attitude towards Palestinians?

What effect do you think those attacks will have had on that left/right peace/war divide in Israeli society, and do you think Hamas didn't know that beforehand?

nacho libre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648981#Comment_122648981

Because they are seen as aiding and abetting the Israeli occupation in the West Bank. Abbas and Israel have a great relationship.

The likes of Barghouti is far more popular than Abbas. So it probably suits Abbas that the Israelis don't release him. It probably suits all three- Bibi, Abbas and Sinwar that he isn't released

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649001#Comment_122649001

They are also seen as captured by western colonial ideals like socialism, ideas of nation state, rights etc.

They were yesterday' men long before 2023.

Wouldn't it be great if they were ascendant but if wishes were dishes beggars would eat like kings.

TheRepentent

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648462#Comment_122648462

There's a reason those orange w@nkers up north fly the israeli flag….they identify with other unwanted colonists

nacho libre

I will recount the story of the brother of a person killed in those attacks. He was heckled by mourners while giving the eulogy for his brother. Why were they heckling him? He said his brother would not want hate spread in his name nor innocent people killed in his name. There is an Israeli man in his 70s who goes to the West Bank each day to protect Palestinian farmers from attacks by Israeli settlers. Who just want to farm in peace.

These types of people are likely in the minority now on both sides due to the past nine months. We need to try and get to a situation where the extremists on both sides are sidelined, as they are wedded to their ideology and have no interest in reaching an accommodation with the other side.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648995#Comment_122648995

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649037#Comment_122649037

I mean, you're making my point for me. October 7th, and Hamas, are what put the cause of peace back for years, maybe decades. I can only suppose that Hamas did that deliberately. And yes, if they'd had a left wing Israeli government responding to the attacks, perhaps Israel would have responded differently.

But for all the supposed puzzlement of some posters on here about why Israel attacked Hezbollah now, there seems to be very little curiosity as to why Hamas attacked then.

Because if they'd waited a few months, they might well have had a different Israeli government to negotiate with. They clearly didn't want to risk that.

Danzy

Saw an analysis from Israel .

They want to end Hezbollah as threat for 10 plus years, to do that they must kill 3000 and injure 12k of Hezbollah.

They will look to soften up targets for a few weeks and then send in 100 battalions to take the south,so destruction of tunnels etc can be carried out expecting 1000 dead of their own.

Civilian losses estimated at several thousand up to 5000 if evacuation orders not followed .

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649028#Comment_122649028

And this of course is the real reason why so many Irish people support the cause of "Palestine" - because the Orangemen don't like them.

How could anyone possibly go wrong with such clear, nuanced logic.

It's all just football teams for people like you. "My side" no matter what. 🙄

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649056#Comment_122649056

An unnamed US spokesperson is quoted today as saying he has never heard of a scenario where dramatically escalated military action (and accompanying chaos and tension) has led to peace and stability - it nearly always makes things even worse.

markodaly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648120#Comment_122648120

Right, so Hamas and Hezbollah should be rewarded for targetting civilians.

Do you honestly think that being nicer to Hamas and Hezbollah will stop them?

markodaly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648183#Comment_122648183

And what about the other 35 years or so when Hezbollah was fighting the IDF? No comment on that?

Its so 'simple'!

nacho libre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649050#Comment_122649050

I am agreeing with you. Hamas wanted an overwhelming response from Israel in the hope it would draw in other states.

They also probably wanted to sabotage Israel and Saudi Arabia coming to an accommodation. They have succeeded in putting that on the long finger for now

As I have said repeatedly Hamas and the Israeli right have no interest in a two state solution. Whatever prospects there are for a settlement needs both of them to leave the stage.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649114#Comment_122649114

Tell you what Markodaly. Why don’t you read why Hezbollah was founded, share your new knowledge with the class if you’re not too embarrassed.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649115#Comment_122649115

I agree. I'm just not sure how you think that will be achieved.

By far the simplest way would be for Israel to be "allowed" by the international community to destroy Hamas' military force in Gaza, and for there then to be a normal investigation and electoral process in Israel. Netanyahu was disliked by many in Israel before Oct 7th, and was blamed by almost all after it. He'd have been kicked out by a massive majority in the months after it. Because it's a democracy, unlike any of its neighbouring Arab states.

But instead, the response in many western countries to Oct 7th (minimising the attacks or even making comments like "a jailbreak by the oppressed") means he's been allowed to create a narrative in Israel that the whole world is still ready to see another "final solution" if they get a chance. And so he gets to stay in power "until it's sorted". And of course he's making sure it won't be.

If the international response had been immediately and genuinely sympathetic* to Israel, Netanyahu would not have been able to exploit Oct 7th for his own interests as he has done.

Hamas and Netanyahu are co-dependent to some extent, but it's the reaction by many in the west that has enabled that. Because it fed into the rightwing Israeli narrative of "Us against the world" - and TBF they are not entirely wrong. And they made it impossible for other parts of Israeli society to make a convincing case that they were wrong. The antisemitic attacks in Europe and the US against non Israelis prove it.

• If they had ever been genuinely sympathetic, nobody in Ireland would contemplate a "day for Palestine" on Oct 7th this year. Because the fact of those attacks hasn't changed - whatever someone may think of what's happened since then it cannot retrospectively make Oct 7th acceptable. That can only mean that they always found it ok really, but weren't sure about saying it openly.

dmcdona

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649106#Comment_122649106

I don't see where the poster mentioned either Hamas or Hezbollah?

But certainly, no terrorist should be rewarded for targeting civilians - including Israel.

And all the cajoling from others to get Israel to stop have clearly fallen on deaf ears.

Perhaps it will end with Israel being found guilty of genocide and any who have committed war crimes punished. Israel thereafter being an international pariah.

perhaps it ends with Israel just bombing Lebanon and Gaza into the stone age of course. And Israel thereafter being an international pariah. And more terrorists rock up to harry israel?

Or is there another outcome where all terrorists are neutralised and Israel gets the peace and security it craves along with the civilian populations of its neighbours?

Whatever the solution is, the current actions of all are not it.

Danzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649088#Comment_122649088

It gives Hezbollah encouragement to stop. If they choose not to stop then any chance of avoiding escalation becomes impossible.

Hezbollah could have stopped weeks or months ago.

They refused .

So Israel has only one choice keep going till they are destroyed. Lebanese society must also understand that tolerating/enduring Hezbollah is also no longer an option and while Hezbollah has destroyed the economy of the country. That they will also bear pain .

Very encouraging to see Christian, sunni and druze communities blocking Hezbollah supporters from entering their areas.

If they do not then the next war will only be even bigger. Israel only gets to lose once.

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649157#Comment_122649157

It would be like if you were having a dispute with your neighbour and thinking the solution is to go around with a baseball bat, smash in the windows, kick down the front door and smash up the living room and say 'Great, that's that dispute settled….we can live in peace and harmony now'.

dmcdona

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649157#Comment_122649157

Given the original Israeli war aim of 12 months ago (destroy Hamas) is far from complete, do you have any idea how long Israel will continue to fight?

Of course they will fight until they have "won", whatever a win in the horrors of war is, but will it be months, years, decades?

To be clear - I'm talking about all-out war not just skirmishes here and there.

thatsdaft

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122648538#Comment_122648538

Pity you couldn’t apply same logic to Russian invasions (plural) of various countries and their bombing (including use of chemical weapons) of Syria up the road from Lebanon for a decade

Cordell

Very encouraging to see Christian, sunni and druze communities blocking Hezbollah supporters from entering their areas

Just like people of Gaza are blocking Hama…oh, wait.

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649181#Comment_122649181

This is like politicians who claim to think that running a country is like managing a household budget. It's simplistic nonsense.

It's nothing like smashing your neighbour's windows in because that means whoever got violent first failed to call the police. And will have to answer to the police at some stage anyway. There is no international police force though - not one with anything like the power of a national justice system, so your analogy breaks down right at the start.

The truth is, sadly, that in international terms, might often is right. Ask the Armenians of Nagorny-Karabakh.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649189#Comment_122649189

I condemn all illegal invasions and bombing of other countries. Unambiguously. I condemn the illegal US/NATO invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan. The NATO bombing of Serbia and Libya. No ambiguity. Do you also condemn all illegal invasions or only non US/NATO ones?

Strazdas

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649207#Comment_122649207

There are very few mediators who think that escalation of violence ever succeeds in resolving a dispute between two parties. If anything, it will make things much, much worse - the party on the receiving end of the escalation will be seething with resentment and likely to retaliate.

How did Hamas's escalation of violence go for them in the aftermath of October 7th?

volchitsa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649236#Comment_122649236

If you attack a force many times larger than you, that's unsurprising, and hardly proves a general truth about all attacks.

It also showed clearly that Hamas - the government of Gaza - treats its citizens as tools to be exploited for its anti Israel agenda, rather than developing a military agenda that is in favour of its citizens.

If you want to look at forces that are, in theory, rather more evenly balanced, then what about Nagorny-Karabakh in September 2024? Why do you think Azerbaijan attacked when they did, if not because they felt they could now beat the Armenians - and did? And how do you explain why the entire population of Stepanakert fled in just a few hours to almost zero reaction from the rest of the world? Why does nobody care about dispossessed Armenians?

And did Armenian forces use Nagorny civilians as human shields or did they try (albeit they failed in the end) to protect them?

riffmongous

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649056#Comment_122649056

The dichotomy of Israeli policy, one of the most intelligent and at the same time most stupid states there is.

thatsdaft

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649219#Comment_122649219

I marched against the invasion of Iraq, it was extremely stupid war to start

Leaving the Middle East to rot and stew in its own bullshit was one of the smarter moves by us in west in last decade, sadly tho it allowed evil **** like Putin to kill hundreds of thousands in Syria

But far leftists put a blind eye on that as some piggies are more equal than others in this region aparently

nacho libre

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649146#Comment_122649146

I personally don't know anyone who agreed with October 7th. I wouldn't want to associate with anyone who did either.

Most right thinking people are appalled by the killing of women and children in particular. When Russia kills Ukranian civilians no one believes them that they kill civilians unintentionally. Yet the Russians always insist they don't target civilians.

With this in mind we have seen in this war and too often over the years civilians killed by trigger happy IDF soliders. This at best points to gross incompetence in training or something much more sinister. If it's the former there should have been mass sacking of IDF commanders over the years, but we rarely see it.

The latter maybe the reason why the ICC prosecutor hadn't dropped the arrest warrants. Perhaps he has seen a culture of imputiny in the IDF whereby IDF solider by and large are not held to account for transgressions.

I have never had a problem with Israel defending itself, just the manner in which it does it. Which even their closest ally has rebuked them for at times, most recently over the killing of the US citizen in the West Bank. So it has to be more than bias or an agenda when other organisations have come to similar determination regarding the IDF.

We didn't see Peggy decry the international courts as biased and having an agenda when it found against Putin, but now it suddenly does. Is this really plausible?

Hamas and the Israeli right have always been co dependent long before October 7th. As long as Hamas were around Bibi could always point to Hamas and say we can't have a settlement with these people. He was right of course but this is exactly the way he wanted it in my opinion.

SafeSurfer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122649302#Comment_122649302

You think the west didn’t interfere in the middle east in the past decade? Was the CIA a bystander during the Arab spring? Is the US not occupying a third of Syrian sovereign territory?

Was the democratically elected government of Egypt deposed by accident?

Iraq wasn’t a “stupid” war. It was an illegal invasion . Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11 but Iraq was invaded to make Israel more secure.