Siptu Strike AGAIN

dabhal

Is it just me or is everyone else sick of the unions in this country?
We suffer while they hold us to ransom. Irish ferries is the latest to be hit.
The company is tryin to save money and they strike, well that's clever!!!!
The company is going deeper into debt while they keep this crap up.
COP ON Strike shouild be the absolute last line of defense not the first.

Dabhal

chewy

unions hardly ever strike here, they hardley ever...

dabhal

intu, an post, dublin bus............all in the last year we could go on

loz_the_boz

dabhal dont be an arse,

People are fighting to save thier jobs !

ixoy

Boo! Hiss! I won't get some of my Xmas presents if those An Post strikes go ahead. They may be striking to save a job but SDS isn't profitable and so it gets shut down - that's the economy for you. Tough apples.

Anyway SIPTU why not come over and save my job? 2/3 of us just lost our job on Tuesday (120 people) and barely a blip in the papers because we're apparently in a sector that doesn't neeed unions (did we get in the pay agreement? Hah! As if). Grrr...

dabhal

that my point pleb read the tread.
There are good and bad ways of doing things.
If the company keeps losing money everyone will be out of a job

gom

Don't think this is in the right forum.

I completely disagree with you dabhal. While you sight several companies they are mostly in the Public Sector. Maybe you are proposing the wrong arguement. These are state run companys not businesses.

General Strikes have been illegal in this country for 14 years now. How would you like to live in germany where there are general strikes all the bloody time. Ireland has it easy, trade Unions can not hold this country to ransom and have not done so since the 80s. Perhaps if you study the cases in point you will discover that the respected parties could not enter into talks as the bosses didn't want to negotiate(such is the way with Public Firms).

Dublin Bus went on strike because after numerous calls Seamus Brennan refused to meet them, even though he was making plans to break the profit making company up. Dublin Bus went on strike again about 2-3 months ago because the company wouldn't give a bus driver leave to see a councillor after he was PISSED on. I think the way Dublin Bus treated that Driver is a measure of how crap staff relations must be in Dublin Bus.

I get very frustrated reading rants about how Unions are holding this country to ransom and how unions are crap etc etc etc. You have no idea the good work unions do. For example all the Construction Workers Unions gathered together to form a Health Promotion unit(Construction Workers Health Trust) for Construction Workers. Offering free Health Check ups on building sites, prostate cancer screening campaigns which have shown conclusivly that Prostate Cancer is much higher than the Government or Health Boards let on. Some of these men have never been to a doctor before and most only go once they are half dead. This is one of the many trade union iniatiatives that are out there doing the job that the government should be doing instead of financing stud farms and facilitating Net earners of 120,000+ to pay no tax what so ever..

ixoy

gom wrote:

Dublin Bus went on strike because after numerous calls Seamus Brennan refused to meet them, even though he was making plans to break the profit making company up. Dublin Bus went on strike again about 2-3 months ago because the company wouldn't give a bus driver leave to see a councillor after he was PISSED on. I think the way Dublin Bus treated that Driver is a measure of how crap staff relations must be in Dublin Bus.

Yes but the thing is the word "compromise" often doesn't seem to be in a union's dictionary. Market conditions demand certain changes, or result in them (case in point: ME! Lost my job despite the company turning a profit). For what could be the good of the people, Brennan wanted to tender new routes to other people - to give someoen else a chance. Rather than listen, the unions wanted to fling all their toys out of the pram, and smack any child who wanted to have a go.

Also the guy who was pissed on wasn't as clear cut as you made out. I posted a link about this a while back, but what happened was that people upstairs urinated and the urine travelled downstairs. The media made it out that he was directly attacked - there was quite a difference in what occurred. And wasn't his dispute not about counselling but instead that he wanted to receive payment for the time he took off - without management approval might I add - because he felt he had been attacked. He didn't go through the authorised channels. Yet the unions twisted that story and made him seem like only a victim without him accepting any culpability for how he mishandled the affair afterwards.

I get very frustrated reading rants about how Unions are holding this country to ransom and how unions are crap etc etc etc. You have no idea the good work unions do...

And I get frustrated by the unions demanding pay increases, and protecting workers, for no visible gain. I remember some of the improvements cited by civil services as being "worthy" of the benchmarking agreement (touch screen computers, I believe, was one - how long did that take...). I get mad as hell when I hear stories of inept workers being protected by these unions when they should be out the door. Noone is saying all union work is bad, but I'd really like to see a bit of agreement by their defenders that they can be over-zealous, make stupid demands, and are morally corrupt in certain attitudes.

dabhal

Thanks ixoy, I was about to reply when your post appeared, I think you put it very well.
I would also like to point out that the benchmarking argreement is a total shambles. The public is not getting any improvement from it. I know this because I have recieved numerous benchmarking payments and have not been asked to do a tap in return. Nothing has changed except the pay packets of my fellow workers and myself have been nicely padded.

Back on track, the unions do of course do some good work but they act like an teenager not listening to reason most of the time.
You are hired to do a job, you get paid for that job, you have the right to good working conditions and a fair pay, end of story.
Your job is on the line because the business is suffering for whatever reason.
Welcome to the real world. You move on and find a new job, not nice but hey S^%t happens.
It's not your right to inflict your frustrations on the public and the rest of the company. Your actions in this case will probably lead to futher or complete job loses.

Dabhal

billy the squid

I believe that unions are a good thing. They preven companies making complete pricks out of their workers. can you imagine what it was like to work for multinationals in this country without unions.

At first they came into the country giving loads of benefits and gradually taking them away due to budget cuts, until the only insentive was the pay packet at the end of the week.

When there were no benefits to cut back on they started to cut back on staff, and expect the same amount of work to be done. and it was not a case of getting rid of dead wood either. the better workers were being given the flick so that supervisors and managers could keep their own reletives and friends in jobs. and please do not tell me did not and does not go on. it did and still does.

one particular multinational which i have worked for before cut back its staff to a point where one person was carrying the workload of three people and was expected to keep going until exhaustion set in.

It got to a point where, with no union at the time, we had to bring production to a halt in protest before they would sit up and listen to us telling them that running people into the ground was neither healthy or safe. can you imagine someone half asleep driving a forklift around a factory. you wouldn't want to be in its path.

The dublin bus driver who was urinated on was wrong to go off on a wildcat strike because his company refused to pay him OVERTIME that he did not do. I wouldn't expect any company to pay someone for overtime they didnt do, even if they normally did it fifty-two weeks of the years.

It seems to be mostly in semi-state companies that these stupid strikes that give trade unions a bad name take place.

Oh and lets not forget how the workers at that bottleing plant got ****ed over by their employer. last year.

Those workers were unable to claim social welfare after the plant closed because they were technically still on strike, even though their employer would not even meet them to discuss redundancy.

dabhal

Billy,

I think your missing the point here, no-one is asking to abolish the unions I'm just making the point that they are getting out of hand and need a good kick up the arse.

Dabhal

flogen

There maybe a good debate to be had here, but there may also be the foundations of a flamefest. Either way it's not for this forum.....
Given that it's moved from a transport issue to a union debate, I'd say After Hours is the best bet (sorry mods )

flogen

billy the squid

dabhal wrote:

Billy,

I think your missing the point here, no-one is asking to abolish the unions I'm just making the point that they are getting out of hand and need a good kick up the arse.

Dabhal

meant to post today but boards went hormonal

What kind of kick up the arse would you propose that wouldn't infringe the rights of the worker.

Victor

You forget that strikes save businesses some money.

dabhal wrote:

We suffer while they hold us to ransom. Irish ferries is the latest to be hit.

Hardly. Go get Stena then or any of the other operators.

ixoy wrote:

For what could be the good of the people, Brennan wanted to tender new routes to other people - to give someoen else a chance. Rather than listen, the unions wanted to fling all their toys out of the pram, and smack any child who wanted to have a go.

Rather, Brennan refused to let the unions know what was going on.

John R

dabhal wrote:

Is it just me or is everyone else sick of the unions in this country?
We suffer while they hold us to ransom. Irish ferries is the latest to be hit.
The company is tryin to save money and they strike, well that's clever!!!!
The company is going deeper into debt while they keep this crap up.
COP ON Strike shouild be the absolute last line of defense not the first.

You suggest by this that the Irish Ferries strike has occoured at the drop of a hat, this is not true. There has been a dispute going on for months and this is not the first time strike action has been threatened.

In general we have had a very quiet period for industrial action recently, in comparison to other EU countries we also have a very good record.

How about you research some facts to back up your sweeping generalisations.

dabhal

Hi John,

U Seem to take this very personally.

I make the point that the unions use the strike too easily. I stand by that.
Do you really believe that they gave other avenues a fair try?

Dabhal