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U2 Mime on Jonathan Ross !!
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05-12-2004 5:07pm#1Did anybody see U2's performance on Jonathan Ross this past few days (I saw the repeat last night) ??
They performed 2 tracks -
Sometimes you can't make it on your own,
and
I will follow.
Bono was most definately not singing a number of sections of the I Will Follow and at one point he did make a seriously obvious lip sync error!! Is Bono joining the elite lip sync error greats from recent times such as Ashlee Simpson and Posh Spice ?!? (Both recently made serious errors while lipsynching)
At the end of I Will Follow, Bono and Edge were singing through the same mic for about 10 seconds - and the effect on Edges voice was not on Bono's voice - and as a recording person, I can tell you it is impossible.
So there we have it - the "best band in the world" following the trend of not wanting to risk a mistake on television. I understand the need for U2 Ltd as a business to have everything looking perfect and sounding perfect so they can sell more copies of the new records and more gig tickets, but I did hold them on a pedastle for a few years because of their live performances. Last night changed all that for me - and they have confirmed their position in the sell-your soul-for-cash chart ! With 750 Million euros in the bank I'd like to think that at this point in their career, they would be thinking of artistic integrity and not more cash. I guess that's the problem. O yeah, and the fact that Bono can't sing the high parts of the tracks he wrote years ago means he now has to mime!
I'm gutted
I pose the following question.
Are U2 the biggest whores in Ireland ?0
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What have I started
!
To the guys that claim his poor crackly vocals isn't exactly trademark of pre-recorded vocals I refer you to my initial post.
I said - parts of the track - not the whole track. Parts of the track were of great quality, parts were not. The parts that were not were live, the parts that were good were recorded. It's 100% pre-meditated by them as they are actively plugging their album at the moment and would play the local spar if they thought it would sell albums.
They brand themselves as a band of artists with integrity, when infact they are not - that was my point. Isn't it a shame they got to this when they obviously are past it. Slane was another example. He screached and screached throughout the gig - it was a great gig - because Larry is rock solid, Edge's delay is suited to a big venue, and well..clayton....yeah. Bono is an actor, not a singer anymore. He has spent years creating an image of the hard working humble rock star, and it appears he is finally on the way down. Many of you will be delighted with that. I think they should have quit a few years ago, but this is what happens when you don't.
Artistic Integrity - Zilch !!0 -
Conspiracy wrote:Artistic Integrity - Zilch !!
My friend, there is no popular musician with artistic credibility, it's merely a matter of how good their PR is and how well they sell it. U2 sell it well and they've done a ****load more good on the back of it than so many others. **** it, let them mime all they want. Credibility is a myth created by record companies to help usher out the old acts so they can introduce you to new young commericial opportunities who are credible until the next fad rolls in. Doesn't anybody burn NME any more?
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Doctor J !
BTW, I'm a recording professional - and not just a music fan. I have a good knowledge of the industry, and contacts that have been involved with acts including U2.Doctor J wrote:Man, I don't know about you, but I give up on bands being 'groundbreaking' after the third or fourth album. Am I the only one who heard Zooropa? Was that not enough of a departure from the norm?
You give up on bands? You mustn't hold these bands in high esteem then.
U2 have always tried to be trendy. Zooropa was exactly that. They got a dance album recorded as dance music got popular. They even got David Holmes to do remixes for the tracks. It was strategic - not artistic.
U2 have made a career out of revolutions every album. The fact that music has reached a stalemate in terms of "dance is has landed, what's next", U2's new album sounds like they weren't sure what to do at all. The trends set the pace for them before - this time they had no market trends other than Britney etc, and they couldn't enter that market.Doctor J wrote:How long have U2 been at it, over 25 years? You expect a revolution every album?
What makes you think I don't like their music? I love their earlier albums like my left leg !! You reading someone elses post?Doctor J wrote:You may not like their music, but they've been on the top globally for a long time, Irish musicians, Irish management, Irish setup, yet all they seem to get is this constant whining from so many Irish people begrudging them their success. I don't get it.
I'm not begrudging their success, I'm questioning the way they are now milking it.Doctor J wrote:You don't have to like their music but FFS don't bitch just because they are successful. Same goes for the Corrs. Can't stand their music but fair ****ing play to them, they've gone from nothing to be internationally successful, why the **** would I begrude them success just because they're Irish? That makes no sense. If U2 are a bland and mediocre as is being made out here, how come they're still a big name after 25 years? Can someone explain that please? Let's look at the facts, a purely marketing driven musical act has a shelf life of, what, seven years tops? Let me assure you, U2 were certainly not subject to large sums of money a la pop idol and that other ****e back in the late 70's. So Island markets the new album, duh. Island is there to make money. Would it be more artistically credible if they only released the album in Road Records and only on vinyl too, cos cd's are corporate bull****, yeah!
OK. You don't seem to know much about the industry afterall. In the late 70's early 80's, not every person could record. If a band were picked out by a record company, money was pumped in - of that be sure. In the late 90's, that all changed with computer aideded audio production. Suddenly, the cost of demos were gone, and it was made even harder to make it. The cost of launching an artist soared, and thus the amounts that would be spent on pop-idols etc. You think Steve Lillywhite was cheap for the recording of War? No. Do you think that U2's Joshua Tree was done on the cheap? I assure you, it cost a fortune to record. The gigs that followed cost a fortune to put together, but they paid divis once tickets were sold.
U2 are still such a big name, because they have a personal wealth of 750 Million Euros. When you have that money, and the people involved with you have that much money, anything you do - along with the correct advertising - will work. It's very very simple. They have the money from when they were great, and they can use that money as collateral to keep themselves up there.
I think they were great. They were the best thing. I love the Coors - again they have a big advertising budget. There is nothing wrong with my music taste, and a good song is a good song. The passion is gone from U2. However, they can't let go. So now, they market themselves as something they are not. They use the money from the people who supported them all the years, and they present an image of themselves that is not accurate. They present the image, because they can't live up to it, and they are afraid they will loose money if people heard Bono sing out of tune. To be a great band, these things are not acceptable. No singer who walks into my studio singing out of tune will ever be taken on for anything. That goes for other studios too. If however that singer had 750 Million Euros and a reputation, my mind could be altered!!!Doctor J wrote:The crux of it is this, some Irish lads made it big. OK, maybe I think Cynic are much more artistically valid but they didn't even sell 10,000 albums so what? Insert whatever band you want to harp the merits of there. U2 made it. Fair ****ing play to them, they've stayed at the top when so many others have disappeared into the dirt. Some Irish people have worked the ****ty system to their favour. Personally, I'm impressed. Why are so many against that?
U2 will eventually need to hang up the boots, and I suspected it would happen after the last album. I missed the gig (I've never seen them), and thought I'd never see them live. I was shocked to see the new album on it's way out - and hearing their guitar techs saying "the album is totally hot - pumping etc" I expected more than what they recorded. However, my new contact with their tour financiers will ensure I get to see them this time and I will probably cry when I hear With or Without You and countless other classics (I'm serious - I get a lump in my throat thinking about it). However, I won't be emotionaly moved by most of their new tracks, and the same for the last album. I enjoy singing A-Ha's "Sun doesn't shine" over Beautiful day when I get the chance. I'm not begrudging them anything - fair balls. I say the same for Bill Gates, and for Dick Cheney (who both came from nothing). I really dislike what they have done, and I don't like the way any ot them are going about it.
Bono, I have on good information, would have you believe that he is the humble White Dove - while the truth is he is one of the most ignorant ruthless people in the industry. There are not many Humble White Doves with as much money as him.
No More, bed for me 0 -
Heh heh heh, you make your initial post like you're stunned that they've mimed on TV, like this is their greatest sin, now you've been disppointed with them for years, so why are you making such a meal of them miming on TV, surely with Bono being no white dove this is the sort of thing they'd have been doing for years? You say you're gutted? Surely you've seen this fateful day coming through the years of mediocrity? Now they finally went and mimed and oh woe is me! How could they do this to us. Bastards. They mimed, a knife through the heart of all that was left of honest Irish music. It seems to me you're just looking for a reason to gripe about them. If you're a recording professional then I'd hazard a guess that it hasn't been for long. Not taking a swing here, but you've changed your arguement since this you started this thread from "I'm gutted" to "They've been **** for years" and Bono can't sing. Studio etiquette is a big part of recording, my friend, don't find that out the hard way. You're an engineer, right? Do you know what kind of facilities were available in the Jonathan Ross studio? Do you reckon they would've been able to push the amps up without the floor manager ****ting himself? Do you know if it's that show's policy to have live music? Most TV shows are very definitely against it, in my experience. Do you reckon, if Bono had instisted on singing live with the band playing live and the studio manager was arguing against it, that you'd be calling Bono a whore and an arsehole because he said "do you know who we are?" in that big headed way and put his foot down like an arsehole and we've got to play live or we're walking way blah blah blah If you're really an engineer you should be very well aware of this stuff already. Why should they stop? Just because you think they've sold out? Come on, are you 15? If you work in the music industry you should know better, a lot better. I guarantee your studio has no issue sucking corporate cock to get paychecks to record the next pop boy band bull****. And I guarantee your lips will be puckering up too. "Would you like milk with that tea, Mr McFadden, sir?". Gotta get paid, right?
You question the way they milk it? Why would they not milk it? What do they owe you? Why would any band not want to make the most of their opportunity for as long as they can? As for artisitic credibilty, as you're a pro you'll be aware he records with a 58? No expencive tube mics here, just a 58 with the monitors blaring. Not exactly prissy prima donna type of stuff. The guy records vocals in a way he's happy with despite the leared opinion that he should be wearing cans and isolated. Is that not even a teeeny bit artisitic? I've heard plenty of stories about Bono, I have contacts too, and as I said before, I hear he's a **** but I've never met him myself, so I'm going to refrain form making any judgements about the guy until I can say it for myself. If you want to make a career for yourself you'd do well to not get into the habit of slagging people who may one day be paying for your bread and milk, especially when you're only passing on second hand info.
As I said, do you seriously expect a band in their 40's who've knocked out that many albums to re-invent music with each release? I'm long enough in the tooth to remeber people who said they had sold out long before The Joshua Tree was released. Meh, it doesn't sound like their old stuff whaaaa whaaa whaaa! For some reason, Irish people seem to reserve a special kind of pettiness for Irish bands, which I just don't understand and they dig up all these petty reasons to try to make out such and such a band are arseholes. It's tiring. Bono, regardless of what sort of personality he is, has expoited his postition to try to alleviate thrid world debt. That's alot more than you or I have done. If they only put out one **** album after another just so he can keep in the news and bringing this shameful issue to the medias attention then that'll do for me. U2 are never going to keep everyone happy. They manipulate the filthiest business there is to their advantage. Get over it. If only more Irish bands would do the same. Artistic integrity? That doesn't exist in the music business. It's a business. Music is the commodity. That's the real world. Shift units. Your job, as an engineer, is to record the ****e that will shift units and lap it up and to come back for more. So who's the bad guy now?0 -
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