U2 Mime on Jonathan Ross !!

Slutmonkey57b

Congratulations, "comedy" has passed over your head.

I'm not maddox in case you're interested.

Third_Echelon

Well said dublinario.

Are you a pyschologist by any chance?

Mr. CooL ICE

Conspiracy wrote:

Flagrant accusations about double accounts, people comparing fully grown adults to 15 year olds - and such other ridiculus comments that cannot be backed up such as :"Maybe that applies to you, but I happen to really like the last two albums. And guess what? I'm not the only one, the majority of U2 fans all over the world have too.".
An utterly useless unsubstantiated comment if ever there was one. No figures or basis for it - but "it sounded good" !!! Useless comment!!!!

Figures? WTF??? Music is a form of art, and logic doesn't necessarily have to apply to art. And what right have you to comment on what a U2 fan thinks of U2 albums?

To me, it seems that you have turned this thread from its subject ("U2 mine on Jonathan Ross !!") into an attack on the pride of Irish people.

eoin5

Ignore the unreal tournament bit

Third_Echelon

Do you see conspiracy??? I told you it was all about maths

Kali

Did nobody else notice The Edge singing backup vocals?

Sister Ray

What a joke !!

Conspiracy

dublinario wrote:

Well, not everyone is flaming you Conspiracy

I agree - and you will see that I didn't suggest that everyone was. But the people that did, and i'm not talking about the people who challenged my opinions, were harsh. In fact, you Dublinaro were not one of them, but your complete character assisination of me warrents a well worded response.

dublinario wrote:

"you don't necessarily have to be a mechanic to know if a car is good"

No, but if you are a mechanic, you have a far better chance of spotting when a second hand car salesman is pulling a fast one !!

dublinario wrote:

"You're just a begrudger"

Not at all. As I have said numerous times - fair balls to them for making the money. Fair balls to Dick Cheeney for coming from nothing and making the money. Fair balls to Bill Gates for making his money. However, I don't have much respect for the way that any of the above named went about making that money - but I certainly don't begrudge them that they got there. I do hate the way they have all used the media to sell their product.

dublinario wrote:

"Seriously, almost every posting cited U2's earnings. "

No they didn't - only in responses to that repeat statement about my comments - because that very relevant. Money is power - and without the money, they would not have been able to control the media like they have done.

dublinario wrote:

"You don't think it's a reasonable assumption, based on sales (the new album is currently number 1 in countless countries) alone, to say that U2 fans all over the world have predominantly enjoyed the last two offerings? You really believe that statement warrants backing up? Are you delusional Conspiracy?

Before the last election in the USA, 60% of americans surveyd (+-3%) believed that weapons of mass destruction were found in Iraq. That idea was sold - and sold well. It was not the truth, but it sold well due to media. You claim because something sells well is a testiment to it's true merit ??

dublinario wrote:

And by God Conspiracy, you definitely display traits of the Ireland that I dislike! If you are going to keep insulting the intelligence of posters by implying they are too stupid to discern good music, and then insult us again by proxy whilst casting aspersions on the population at large, then kindly quit whining about flaming. At least flaming is honest and up front. Your flaming is more insidious and condescending.

You can see from the whole thread that I too waited and waited before I started flaming - and it was only in self defence. I didn't want to single out people, but it appears that people who were insecure about their own opinions felt they were being flamed too !! They weren't !! My flame was directed at only some people - but now everyone feels the victim?? I never pointed at everyone.

dublinario wrote:

I wasn't aware of any rampant anti-Irish sentiment throughout the world. I think most of the anti-Irish sentiment I would see comes from Irish people themselves, like you and your cohort of success hating begrudgers.

Again - you group me with some clan of begrudgers????? Hmmmm.
You are correct here though - I never said anything about throughout the world. There are many people who now dislike Ireland - the Ireland that has emerged over the past 10 years. Self-hating Irish if you like - but they do exist, and for the reasons I stated above too.

dublinario wrote:

No, I simply think that people don’t take kindly to being told that they are imbecilic for liking a particular brand of music, or that they have to have an esoteric understanding of a particular industry to appreciate it’s produce.

This was never an attack on people who like the music. Like it away if you want. e.g. I like westlifes music. The production is absolutely wonderful. However, they are marketed artists. Not true artists that made it up through the scene the hard way like U2 originally did. However, they are extreemly successfull. Why? a)money and b)marketing. Would Westlife sell as many albums and tickets if their image was not marketed as heavily as it is in every single possible way available? Probably not.

dublinario wrote:

What evidence? Conspiracy, you are the one acting like a petulant, tantrum throwing lunatic here. All evidence points AWAY from your argument. I repeat: U2 albums are virtually always universally critically acclaimed. Are all critics idiots? Have none of them a shred of integrity? And the albums are selling huge too. So you can babble on about the U2 marketing machine, and regurgitate your obsession with U2’s “750 million” ad infinitum, but the fact is that people are still buying and enjoying U2’s critically acclaimed albums. You sir, are the one who seems to be following an argument devoid of evidence, and seemingly driven by emotion.

Critics - who pays them? What is Virtually Always about? They are or they aren't !! Have a look at www.allmusic.com and search for U2. Have a look at the album ratings for all their albums. You will see that their albums have not all been critically aclaimed. They have perhaps by MTV, VH1, Rolling Stone, and the rest of that team, but those are all paid off - to think that they aren't is incorrect. That is again where the 750 Mil comes in. Again, I consider that figure to be extreemly relevant to their sales and success.

dublinario wrote:

What’s your end goal here Conspiracy? Are you trying to convince us that we don’t like U2’s music?

Why would I be trying to convince people that? You like it or you don't. But to think that this is a band who give it their all is incorrect. They give it feck all now - and that has been my original point. They were great, but now they are not. THere is absolutely nothing mind blowing about their new albums - they are average songs, but nothing remarkable.

dublinario wrote:

You talk about how our lives will not be rich because we don’t agree with your taste in music?!?!?

Not at all !!! Again - you quote me out of context.
Certain people's lives are not so rich because they don't see the puppet master pulling the strings. To live in ignorance is to live in prison. Nothing to do with the music you like.

dublinario wrote:

But from the limited information I have garnered about you from this thread, I certainly would not envy you your life. I see a man so insecure that he feels he must constantly give us his CV, constantly tell us he plays loads of instruments, engineers, produces, blah blah blah. I see somebody who is compulsively enraged by the success of others, and tries to find nitpicky little things to justify this rage. But worst of all, I see a narcissist who believes that any opinion that deviates from his own is child-like, juvenile, or ignorant. Take a good look in the mirror before you go talking about the richness of our lives Pal.

Ok - so here you attempt to diagnose my mind when you don't even know me. I love my life, and was as insecure as the next guy up until about 2 years ago - but since then I've been realising that all is not what it seems in this world. U2 are not what they seem - and I was stating my occupation again and again because it became evident that many people were not reading the entire thread and were therefore missing where I was coming from. It was information for those people - and also a number of people replied to me and their replies displayed that they did not know where I was coming from.

dublinario wrote:

I see somebody who is compulsively enraged by the success of others,

Why? Where have I said or suggested that their success enrages me?? I never said that!!! I've only repeated a number of times : fair balls to them!! I just hate the way that they have gone about it. It's not artistic - it's corporate !!!!

dublinario wrote:

But worst of all, I see a narcissist who believes that any opinion that deviates from his own is child-like, juvenile, or ignorant.

Incorrect - I can only say it's not correct. I love debate, but when something is incorrect, I point it out - thats honesty, not.
The people I made comments to were claiming that they didn't care whether U2 mimed - they still thought they were great. I think that is wrong. Especially if you give off the impression that you are something else. That is called deception.

dublinario wrote:

Conspiracy, I hope your personality outside of the forum is considerably better than what you have displayed inside of it. Sure, you personally may go on to be very successful and fair dues to you. But if you really are as patronizing and arrogant in real life as you are in this thread, I think it is the unfortunates who know you in real life who deserve to be wished luck.

Conspiracy

Dublinario. For some reason you took it upon yourself to speak for those who were not able to speak for themselves. Why you felt the need to personally attack me in the way that you did leaves me baffelled. I was initially very hurt by your comments, but I am seeing past them. I never attacked you, and the people that I was referring to are obvious by the way they posted above. To think that I was generalizing is naieve, and you appear not to be able to see that yourself. The post descended into a flaming post. When it initially started, I sent two messages to moderators, but they let it continue. The flaming continued, and only then did I deliver my piece which under the circumstances I felt was only fair. That you disagree with me is fine, say that, but to character assinate me personally when I was only making my points (up untill my last "anti-irish" post) seems a little harsh. Again, it doesn't bother me as I am confident I know exactly the person who I am, and thus can confirm your diagnosis is wrong.

What I don't understand is why boards.ie allow such flaming to go on for such a period of time - withouth locking posts like they should. Because this is what happens when you allow flaming to keep going. I wanted to leave this thread so many times over the last 48 hours, but as each flame appeared in my inbox I felt I had to defend myself. As you will see from the entire thread, it is ME that has been on the defensive for the entire time - just like now. Why? Well, thats up to the readers.

Moral of the story - Concerning U2 - Never criticize them, whether your points are valid or invalid, as they are gods in too many peoples eyes and those fans will not tolerate it.

What a mess of a thread.
:C:


Many Thanks to :
: Doctor J (for acknowleding the way it is in the industry - for sharing recording techniques - and for trying to extinguish the flames)
: Slutmonkey57b (For flaming and quoting me out of context - and for continuous personal insults)
: Papa Smut (For good facts - but why wasn't the thread locked?!!!)
: John2 (For this classic link about U2 Ltd: U2 Ltd sue a band off the planet
: Phil321 (For believeing in the Edges "great" talents - and for being the most ignorant contributer to the flame throwning)
: Sister Ray (For not being me)
: Dcully (For his insults and also for not looking the flaming thread - )
: Third Echelon (For sound logical comments)

: Dublinario (For also believing in the Edges "great" talents and thinking Noel Gallagher is talentless (which he most definately isn't and i'm not an oasis fan) - For repeatedly accusing me begrudgery and of attacking Bono individually and not U2 Ltd. - and of course for your outright personal attack on my character)

Karl Hungus

Christ, I'm locking this.

Not because of flaming, but because Conspiracy is an absolute twat giving me about 50 reported posts when there's barely any kind of personal insult whatsoever. If I see this kind of tit-acting again, I'm just going to ban the offender.