Is it worth buying a new Graphics card?

GazaM

I was just wondering is it worth buying a new graphics card within the next few months? I am planning on getting a new PCI Express graphics card (building a new system) sometime between now and the summer and I was wondering should I go for the high-end graphics cards like the 6800 Ultra or the X850XT PE or should I buy a cheaper one as a temp until the next-gen cards are released, as the next line of high-end cards will be announced soon (as far as I've heard) and should be released near Christmas or early next year. I just don't want to spend a fortune on a high-end card only for it to be out-of-date within a year !

Nukem

Nearly all graphis cards are out of date within a year of buying them.
As there is always a bigger and greater card within a year.
Have similar prob want an x850xt but no one has them so might buy a 6600gt/6800(non gt) for the time being and buy an 850 in the Summer.

GazaM

Well, the X850XT isn't set to be released for a month or two on komplett.ie so I suppose that's why no one has them :rolleyes: . I'm thinking of going with an X700Pro just until Christmas or so when I'll probably get one of the new high-end cards. Is the X700Pro a good mid-range card or has anyone got any other suggestions at a similar price?

I know most graphics cards go out-of-date within a year or so, but I mean really out-of-date as in not being able to get playable framerates on medium settings in new games (eg. my current GeForce FX 5200 ).

Azza

I was faced with the same option. Was looking at getting a 6800GT which has several strong points. It supports vertex and pixel shader 3.0 in the flight sim I play Pacific Fighters. It also supports them to a lesser extent in far cry but there was no real difference in performance. Also better OpenGl support which is better for linux users But according to people who play my flight sim niether the 6800GT or the 6800 Ultra can handle the game at hi-res with those features with or without aa and af. That game was particularly cpu restricted. I doubt even a 6800 Ultra SLI rig with an FX 55 would get that working at full detail and full aa & af at 1600x1200.

So the sapphire X800XT seemed the best bet. Basically only alturnative I could find and its fairly easy to overclock to pe levels. The X850XT PE and its spin offs are impossible to get currently and don't offer much improvement. I would of opted for a 6800GT still so I could go SLI down the road but I hit a snag there. I would need to get a pci card which means a new motherboard. Since SLI boards are impossible to get at the moment (and expensive)I would need to change motherboard twice in the near feature which was a hassle coupled with a burden I did not need.

Asides from this looking at the SLI benchmarks the X850XT and X800XT out preforms the 6800GT SLI on numerous occasions. X850XT aint too far behind the SLI 6800 Ultras either. I still may opt for SLI in the future. The plain is to stick the X800XT into my second machine in a few months time. While I get a sli motherboard with pci 6800 card....which one I don't know see what price is like. Then a few months further on get a second card to complete it.

Nukem

GazaM wrote:

I'm thinking of going with an X700Pro just until Christmas or so when I'll probably get one of the new high-end cards. Is the X700Pro a good mid-range card or has anyone got any other suggestions at a similar price?

Came across this link a while back here
x700pro (make sure its a 256mb one) but the 6600gt seems to be slightly better

Azza wrote:

Asides from this looking at the SLI benchmarks the X850XT and X800XT out preforms the 6800GT SLI on numerous occasions. X850XT aint too far behind the SLI 6800 Ultras either

Why would you go near Ultras in Sli if the x850xt pe is nearly as fast and way cheaper as well. If i was you (wish i was with a x800xt) i would just wait for the 850 to come into stock. You'd have to but to Gfx and a new mobo when you could just get one Gfx :eek:

ViperVenoM

Azza so youve dumped the 9800xt or is that in your other comp now (was it a 9700pro in there before)

whats the x800xt like compared to the 9800xt...i really am tempted myself to upgrade to 1 myself as im not prepared to go SLI yet ..not for a damn long time

if its WAAAYYY better...then ...hmm i may have to get saving im in enough debt but the next step of my uni loan comes through..tomorrow...uh oh

but er..speaking about graphics cards is there anymore AGP ones coming out soon after the x850xt thats gonna be better as faster..and better as bringing the x800s down in price?

gline

Nukem wrote:

Nearly all graphis cards are out of date within a year of buying them.
As there is always a bigger and greater card within a year.
Have similar prob want an x850xt but no one has them so might buy a 6600gt/6800(non gt) for the time being and buy an 850 in the Summer.

I agree. GazaM if you are building a new system soon, just buy an SLI ready mobo and buy one decent card, that means if you feel it is getting two out of date lateer on down the line you can slap in another card. SLI seems the way to go if you are building a new rig and can afford it.

jessy

GazaM wrote:

I was just wondering is it worth buying a new graphics card within the next few months? I am planning on getting a new PCI Express graphics card (building a new system) sometime between now and the summer and I was wondering should I go for the high-end graphics cards like the 6800 Ultra or the X850XT PE or should I buy a cheaper one as a temp until the next-gen cards are released, as the next line of high-end cards will be announced soon (as far as I've heard) and should be released near Christmas or early next year. I just don't want to spend a fortune on a high-end card only for it to be out-of-date within a year !

Really depends on what kind of game player you are (do you really need that kind of power). If I were you and was a bit worried about buying a card that is going to be outdated in a year or so then I definitely would not get the most expensive card there is now. Play it safe for now and get a 6600GT (~€220) which is more than enough to play any game with decent FPS.
(Said me who just bought a sapphire X800XT ) :eek:

GazaM

Well my choice seems to be between a 256MB X700Pro and a 128MB 6600 GT. I know that the amount of onboard memory doesn't make a huge difference but in the game I'll be playing most (Half-Life 2) it does. It's only a temporary solution anyway, and the X700Pro got some good reviews and benchmarks so I think I'll go with that for the meantime. Jessy, I know what you're saying, it may be overkill getting a high-end card but for me I just like being able to play even the newest games on max settings. There's a lot of people who don't mind playing with low settings, but I'm not one of these people, even at medium settings I feel as though it's not at the level it was designed to be played at.

jessy

you might want to read this review

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=2281

GazaM

Well, I've read it and the x700xt is better than the 6600GT in Half-Life 2 and taking into account that I can overclock the X700Pro to X700XT performance or near enough means I'm still going for the X700Pro. The only thing I need to do now is learn how to overlclock the CPU and memory. The motherboard I will be getting is an MSI nForce4 motherboard and it has their usual D.O.T. (Dynamic Overclocking Technology) and I was wondering if maybe that is a better alternative than actually manually overclocking the CPU etc. as the Dynamic Overclocking automatically changes clock speed and all that depending on the load and the temperature so should I just turn that on and leave the BIOS alone?

gline

GazaM wrote:

Well, I've read it and the x700xt is better than the 6600GT in Half-Life 2 and taking into account that I can overclock the X700Pro to X700XT performance or near enough means I'm still going for the X700Pro. The only thing I need to do now is learn how to overlclock the CPU and memory. The motherboard I will be getting is an MSI nForce4 motherboard and it has their usual D.O.T. (Dynamic Overclocking Technology) and I was wondering if maybe that is a better alternative than actually manually overclocking the CPU etc. as the Dynamic Overclocking automatically changes clock speed and all that depending on the load and the temperature so should I just turn that on and leave the BIOS alone?

I doubt you would get as much speed using D.O.T, your better off learning how to overclock yourself properly (its not hard at all)

Infini

If your getting part for your computer you should consider getting parts with a relevant usage life. You should wait for the newest cards to come out first and then buy those as they'll last at least 2 years until cards become available that outdo them by a significant speed.

GazaM

The X700Pro will have a relevant usage life for the price, about a year, I don't use AA or AF and the resolution I play games at is 1280x1024 (max supported by 17" Flat-screen), so it should be perfect for the meantime. The only thing I'm worried about now is the CPU limiting my performance in games, but as far as I've heard anything from the 3200+ upwards is fine for games. Even if it is slightly lowering performance I can just learn how to overclock it and it should be ok.

Infini

GazaM wrote:

The X700Pro will have a relevant usage life for the price, about a year, I don't use AA or AF and the resolution I play games at is 1280x1024 (max supported by 17" Flat-screen), so it should be perfect for the meantime. The only thing I'm worried about now is the CPU limiting my performance in games, but as far as I've heard anything from the 3200+ upwards is fine for games. Even if it is slightly lowering performance I can just learn how to overclock it and it should be ok.

If the processors around 2.5 Ghz then you should be fine but if your considering buying a new processor as well then you'd probably have to look at 64-bit compatable processors. And then there's the motherboard too...

ViperVenoM

Infini wrote:

If your getting part for your computer you should consider getting parts with a relevant usage life. You should wait for the newest cards to come out first and then buy those as they'll last at least 2 years until cards become available that outdo them by a significant speed.

i wish they did last 2 years i got my 9800xt when they was pretty new around a year ago....and im finding games its struggling on now..MOHPA...the new vampire game...er it slows down on BFME when theres like ...hundreds on screen

etc etc ok maybe im picky but this is struggling on a few of the new games now and i dont even enable AA or AF :rolleyes:

Infini

You must be using a pretty powerful system. My desktop's built from mid-range parts that I put together last february but it still plays new games grand (Although there is a little slowdown on the odd game that runs a lot of NPC's at the same time).

GazaM

Infini wrote:

If the processors around 2.5 Ghz then you should be fine but if your considering buying a new processor as well then you'd probably have to look at 64-bit compatable processors. And then there's the motherboard too...

Well, the AMD Athlon 64 3200+ is a 64-bit processor :rolleyes: . I also said earlier that I'm building a new system, so naturally I'll be getting a new PCI-Express s939 motherboard (I stated earlier that it will be an MSI one).

ViperVenoM

try MOHPA in 1024x768 with high details and no AA and AF..it drops to like...25 :eek: i dread to think any higher!

GazaM

Well, I think after all of the overclocking is done with the graphics card, cpu and ram it should run fine. In your sig it says you have a 9800xt, in a few reviews I've read it states that the x700Pro runs slightly better than the 9800xt and when it's overclocked it should run pretty fast, anything over 40fps is acceptable to me at 1280x1024. Also, if it drops to a low framerate it doesn't really bother me, once the average framerate is over 40fps.

ViperVenoM

oh but mines overclocked quite a bit too

well its 412 stock and ive got it about 460 (best it will do)

i think ive gone too picky...and i want something faster already

GazaM

ViperVenoM wrote:

oh but mines overclocked quite a bit too

well its 412 stock and ive got it about 460 (best it will do)

i think ive gone too picky...and i want something faster already

lol, I know how you feel :rolleyes: . I've been looking at benchmarks and the average fps of the games I will be playing on my system with the X700Pro are very good, even without being overclocked, with only Doom3 showing as a problematic game for the card. Since I don't like Doom3 it means that is not a problem. I think the reason for the low performance in Doom3 and MoH:PA is due to the fact that they are OpenGL based and ATI cards have never been great with OpenGL, although performance in my OpenGL games (Call of Duty, MoH: AA) with the X700Pro is fine in tests in reviews and stuff. Anyway, I'm not interested in buying a super high-end card for Doom3 and Quake 4, I'm interested in saving my money for the real next-gen cards, like the ones which will feature in the next consoles (in modified form of course) .

ViperVenoM

good idea but..can i hold out :eek:

its a good enough card ive got..but meh..doesnt have the shine it use to :rolleyes:

GazaM

ViperVenoM wrote:

good idea but..can i hold out :eek:

its a good enough card ive got..but meh..doesnt have the shine it use to :rolleyes:

lol, Just have a look at some of these pictures the new Unreal 3 engine and maybe you'll be able to hold out for the next-gen cards .

ViperVenoM

yeh but i could get an x800xt now...then be on another card by then !!!..looking good thhoouughh

gline

i think an x800 xt will last a year no prob, sure a 9800 xt can stay play games fine at high res

BadCharlie

I only have the 9800np video card. I dont even have it a year and now want to trade it in. Is there much of a differince between a 6600GT/LE and a Ati9800Pro? I can overclock my video card to a Pro.

ViperVenoM

i think the 6600gt is slightly better but imo if your gonna upgrade a 9800pro you wanna go for something that will REALLY make a diff...6800gt+

Azza

Well did abit of tasting with the X800XT everything running stock on the machine specs below. Using ATI catalyst 4.12. Mostly for Viper Vemons benefit.

First game I tested was my merged install of 1C MADDOX's combat flight sim IL2 series. This sim is a very CPU intensive game.

IL2FB + AEP + PF 3.03M.
Various Maps
(TEST PEFORMED ON 3400 CLAWHAMMER 2.2GHz 1MB Cache None DC Memory)
Seems playable at 1280x960 on perfect settings(highest you can get on ATI cards) with 4x AA and 8XAF. Talking 45+frames. Odd bit of slow down when lots of anti aircraft fire.

(TEST PERFORMED ON 3200 WHINCHERTER 2.0Ghz 512KB Cache DC Memory)
On my 9800xt I coud only do 1024x768 on max settings (second hightest) with no AA and AF.

(TEST PEFORMED ON 3400 CLAWHAMMER 2.2GHz 1MB Cache None DC Memory)
On my 9700pro I ran the same settings as the 9800xt (with a better cpu a 3400 clawhammer). Slghtly less frame rates than the 9800xt.
The 9800XT and 9700 pro where perfectly playble but none could handle any sort of aa. I could play perfect settings with the 9800xt but the frame rate was borderline (i.e 30fps). I could also run low 2Xaa on the 9800xt on maximum settings but again frame rate was borderline. With the advent of the pacific theatre in the series of games alot of ships mean't alot of flak which means sudden frame rate drops.


Battlefield Vietnam 1.21
Map Le Long Valley I think.

(BOTH TESTs PERFORMED ON 3200 WHINCHERTER 2.0Ghz 512KB Cache DC Memory)

Okay moving up from a 9800xt on the rig below which ran the game on the highest settings with no aa and no af at 1024x768.
The X800XT runs it at 1280x1024 at highest settings with 4xAA and 8XAF
High frame rate until alot of units on screen then it momentarily stutters.


Call of Duty United Offensive 1.51 (Multiplayer)
Map Carentan.
Game really did not challenge any card. Old engine. X800XT easily ran it at 1280x1024 with 6xAA and 16xAF. 9800XT made short work of it too. Easily run it at same with resolution with lower amounts of AA and AF. For the hell of it before I ran it with 9800XT at 1920x1440 with 6xAA and 16xAF and it was almost playble. Frame rate then was in the low 20's.

Unreal Tournament 2004 unknown version.
On my 9700 pro clawhammer machine. I can run at max settings with 1024x768 resolution provided wasn't more than 8 characters on screen.
Ditto for m 9800xt on the winchester machine....except it could handle more
characters before slowdown.
My X800XT on the whichester ran at 1280x1024 with 4xaa and 8xAF with only the smallest traces of slowdown on larger maps (face3) with 32 players.

Warhammer 40,000 Dawn of War 1.2
On whinchester machine running on my old 9800XT max settings with no aa and af on 1024x768. No slowdown on those settings with up to 4 players. Though it chuged badly on a friends pc a Sempron 2600 machine with a 9600XT in it. The X800XT running at 1280x1024 with 4xaa and 8xaf stutters a small bit at the start but runs more or less well with up to 4 players (its abit borderline probably around 30fps)


Going test Half Life 2, Rome Total War and Doom III tomorrow might run 3D Mark 2005 too. Only thing I well say did try to enable overdrive on the X800XT caused graphics errors immeadiatly and ATI Tool would not allow any overclocking which I reckon might be a drive issue. Will be playing around for the next few day with my machine. Final thing I say. Is you can run aa and af at very decent frame on this card but there is sudden brief frame drops. The old cards without running aa and af have lower frame rates but much more consistent.

ViperVenoM

cheers for that

hmm i dont usually enable AA or AF anyway...tis some interesting results there

the UT2004 benchie was a bit :eek: ..but im not in a UT clan anymore so :rolleyes:

..not sure tbh sounds like it craps on my card but only really with AA and AF which ive never bothered with..although i guess it would be nice

mind you who knows wot games are round the corner..all i know is it is nasty to play Medal of Honour Pacific Assault in 1024x768 high details but no AA of AF...it stutters quite noticeably

the new Vampire game is also a joke but i think thats just a damn buggy game tbh..

cant remember what else pushes the card...oh World Championship Snooker 2004 :eek: but only really in 1600x1200 it was fine for HL2 ...not going to mention Doom 3

cant think what else ive got on ere at the moment..

maybe i really dont need to upgrade just yet...but can i stop myself

gline

ViperVenoM wrote:

maybe i really dont need to upgrade just yet...but can i stop myself

Who can??? My pc doesnt stutter on any game at 1600x1200 full AA and AF and i still want to upgrade, lol

HL2 @ 1600x1200 FULL AA AND FULL AF @ 75-90fps