Pistol License Applications

Vinniew

So.....how many here have applied for Pistol licenses and how much opposition did you meet from the nice people who have the power to say yes or no?

civdef

Have an application in at the moment. Whole process has been smooth so far I have to say, in fact the Gardai have been helpful throughout.

Irishglockfan

Application went in today.Now we will see....

GreenGun

Pistol application went in mid 04
License granted late 04
Article 7 authorisation, euro pass and NI license to bring it home.
Monitored alarm inspected and had some detectives keeping tabs on me for a while!
Get those applications in now!

GreenGun

Horeb

GreenGun wrote:

Pistol application went in mid 04
License granted late 04
Article 7 authorisation, euro pass and NI license to bring it home.
Monitored alarm inspected and had some detectives keeping tabs on me for a while!
Get those applications in now!

GreenGun

Did you need to provide information that you are a member of a Pistol/Gun Club etc ??

civdef

Monitored alarm inspected

Was it indicated to you that the application would be refused without this? It strikes me that it kind of makes a mockery of things if the Guards were enforcing what has already been judged to be an illegal policy in the supreme court - before any amendment to the firearms act requiring security has been passed.



Horeb - I've had to provide evidence of membership of a shooting club anyway.

civdef

http://www.bailii.org/ie/cases/IESC/2002/35.html

Worth a read. It seems to indicate that individual requirements as to the provision of safe storage may be acceptable - but that would take further court cases to decide. It certainly seems to rule out a blanket policy of requiring all pistol licence applicants to have monitored alarm systems though, for example - and leaves the way open for every such decision to be contested in detail. The Dept seems to have decided that such a situation is too messy, hence the proposed amendments.

Sparks

Out of interest GreenGun, two questions - firstly, it's not an air pistol that you got, right?
Secondly, ballpark figure, how much is the secure storage setting you back (if you don't mind answering).

GreenGun

Hi All,
Will try to answer all questions.
Firstly it’s a 9mm not an air pistol.
I have tried to import my air pistol but the DOJ haven’t given me the import yet.
I am a member of a few Clubs and was asked where I intended to use the pistol.
In my case the monitored alarm was already installed and inspected by the CPO but reinspected by two detectives for the application.
I know at least 3 applicants who have been told they won’t be granted a license with out one. However I do know one who got his with out (I think he was subsequently told to get one for a second application).
Until the new bill comes into force security is not something they can legally turn you down on (but when has that stopped them before!).
My initial cost of installation was around 1000 euro (as far as I can remember).
Expect to pay around 600euro a year for your alarm.
Shop around you will do better!
Surly some of our National shooting organizations can get a deal for shooters.

GreenGun

Horeb

I wonder if I was to get permission to store the pistol in an army magazine would this be more in my favour mmmmmmm.

Well my dad is still in the army hence, we could get a joint application and store there, very safe as it is guarded 24 Hrs a day

Irishglockfan

Horeb,
as a "mere civillian"though,can you actually go down to the armoury and check it in or out?or would your dad have to do this?I dunno if the situation has changed,but I always thought it was almost impossible even for authorised personel to get near the armoury,not to mind civvies.Then isnt there somthing about non issue weapons being stored on govt property?Just curious.
Glock

Horeb

You just have to get permission of the CO, a lot of lads do it and I did it myself for a while as we thought it was the safer option.

You just cannot store ammunition....

A Civilan type armourly like in Bisley in England would be a great idea, weapons stored under security and person's to sign in/out weapons.

Gun Shy

Short Story :

Want to Import pistol from Germany so wrote letter to DoJ requesting details as to being granted an Imp Cert (I would have complied with all licencing requirements etc)
I know the section 7/9 route (may end up going that way) but just wanted to get some official view point. 3 weeks later a nice reply from DoJ and at least I have a contact name to send letter 2 and clarify a few points and attempt to clear up matters.

Short Reply

A Few Paragraphs of the usual preamble followed by

"In any event, were an application to be made by you for the importation of pistols as outlined in the attachments of your letter, the Minister would not grant an importation licence for the firearms. In making this decision, the Minister has taken into account that the Oireachtas has, under the Firearms (Dangerous Weapons) Order 1972, declared pistols to be especially dangerous and considers that the importation into the state of such pistols would represent a threat to public safety."

Working on my reply right now and hopefully will bring them up to speed, I have no doubt that they are aware of the current situation but its a normal standard reply hoping to brush you off letter no 2 will address the above and other points

Will keep ye Posted

civdef

Thanks for posting that gunshy, it's nice to see what the train of thought is over at the Dept, even if the content is depressing.

Couple of points they seem to have missed though- the 1972 order was in the context of sentencing policy for the criminal use of firearms, not the legitimate use by target shooters.

Secondly a condition of being granted a firearms certificat is that in the view of the superintendent of the district, the applicant can possess carry and use the firearm without posing a threat to public safety.

Would be nice to see if the Minister considers legitimate target shooters to be a threat to public safety, and how this tallies with his statements in the Dail.

What sort of level in the Dept was this letter coming from?

Nybras

What is this, we aloud have pistols in this country, what’s the situation then?
This is new to me, well this kind of news.

civdef

Nybras, there's a whole heap of relevant threads on this topic - browse through some of them and you will find the information you're looking for. Let's try not to clog up the current thread thoigh.

Sparks

GreenGun wrote:

Until the new bill comes into force security is not something they can legally turn you down on (but when has that stopped them before!).

Er, actually it's not quite that clear - see paragraphs 38 and 39 from the Dunne v Donoghue case that civdef linked to above. If it's an individual precondition, it's not fully clear yet and still has to be thrashed out in the courts (myself I don't think any judge is going to say that the guy with the sole legal authority to grant licences isn't allowed issue preconditions on an individual basis, but there are those who disagree).
Thanks for the information, btw.

And gunshy, that response from the department is rather odd given that the Minister has stated in the Dail on Feb.26 last year that target shooters aren't a threat to public safety; you might want to mention that in your reply...

Gun Shy

civdef wrote:

What sort of level in the Dept was this letter coming from?

Dont Know what level just a name and "Firearms and Explosives Unit, DoJ"

Thanks Sparks but reply already sent, might save it for letter No. 3 or 4.

I do get the impression that the E.F.P. and an article 7 allow you to purchase and walk across borders.

BUT does it allow you to have the firearm in question sent to you (seems a bit grey)

Any ideas

Sparks

Gun Shy wrote:

Dont Know what level just a name and "Firearms and Explosives Unit, DoJ"

Sounds like the poor sods who actually have to do the work, which isn't to say that they're not putting forward the offical position, but just that there are higher levels in the Department.

Thanks Sparks but reply already sent, might save it for letter No. 3 or 4.

Planning for the long haul? I'd say "attaboy" if it wasn't patonising

I do get the impression that the E.F.P. and an article 7 allow you to purchase and walk across borders.

That's pretty much what the law says, yes. You might get a customs lad who's never seen this happen give you a few questions, but just because he's never seen it doesn't mean it's illegal.

BUT does it allow you to have the firearm in question sent to you (seems a bit grey)

Ah. Yeah, that one's a bit grey. Some say yes, some say no, and I don't have any definitive ruling one way or the other. There's an argument that you're here and you have the paperwork, so who puts it in the post is an irrelevancy; and there's an argument that if the firearms dealer is putting it in the post that it's not you transporting it from point to point and so an importation licence is needed.

Gun Shy

Sparks wrote:

Planning for the long haul? I'd say "attaboy" if it wasn't patonising

Think we all know where this is going anyway, just interested in the replies I'm going to get. But under no illusions.

Think I'll go a E.F.P. and have sig sent to NI and pick it up there but in the meantime will play some tennis with the DoJ

Sparks

Gun Shy wrote:

Think we all know where this is going anyway, just interested in the replies I'm going to get. But under no illusions.

Well, I wouldn't say it's hopeless, but I think perhaps assuming the moon and stars will be delivered via courier to your door would be a wee bit unrealisitc

Think I'll go a E.F.P. and have sig sent to NI and pick it up there but in the meantime will play some tennis with the DoJ

Sounds like a constructive way forwards. I would recommend looking at the secure storage bit though, just in case you haven't already done so. Not so much for to keep the Gardai satisified as for general safety, you understand.

.270 remington

hi all.
this is my first post so here goes
has any one had a meeting with there local super yet regarding pistol licence
my application is reaching this stage.
would like to hear how ye got on

Barry Aldwell

Irishglockfan wrote:

Horeb,
as a "mere civillian"though,can you actually go down to the armoury and check it in or out?or would your dad have to do this?I dunno if the situation has changed,but I always thought it was almost impossible even for authorised personel to get near the armoury,not to mind civvies.Then isnt there somthing about non issue weapons being stored on govt property?Just curious.
Glock

The only personnel who can sign weapons out of an armoury are Officers, Senior NCOs, and all members of the ARW.

les45

It seems that there is no clear understanding in the Dept on importation documents, they are allowing the importation of ammo, and I understand that if your local dealer applies for a import licence for ammo he or she must state that the rounds in question are for Mr Joe Bloogs cert no ,cal, and rounds allowed on the licence, the RFD can not buy for stock, again this may be untrue ! any one come across the same story.

Horeb

Barry Aldwell wrote:

The only personnel who can sign weapons out of an armoury are Officers, Senior NCOs, and all members of the ARW.

That's is truly amazing as been in the army for 9 years let me say your wrong personal no issue weapons can be signed out at any time and from private up.

the above can only access state issued weapons when mounting escorts, gurards and exercises and I know DFR backwards

.270 remington

hi all
have many people actually got the licence
and how long were you waiting for same
has any body been called in for a chat with there local
super about application
i would love to hear how ye got on