psychic or mentally unbalanced

rcunning03

What is the difference between a person who can hear the dead and a person with a psychological disorder.

Is it just a case of labelling depending on your beliefs, or is there actually a difference ?

What defences are there to stop a spiritual journey (e.g. Taking a fly agaric mushroom) from sending you to a mental hospital

landser

rcunning03 wrote:

What is the difference between a person who can hear the dead and a person with a psychological disorder.

none, they're both psycho, or the former's a fraud and the latter unfortunate

Oryx

Troll, troll troll troll troll

I am MAN

I dont believe in psychic people they look and sound silly.

I do believe in coincidence though.

stevenmu

rcunning03 wrote:

Is it just a case of labelling depending on your beliefs, or is there actually a difference ?

I think that most people who believe it's possible to communicate with the dead would accept that some people are just mentally ill and hallucinating. People who don't believe it's possible, such as landser apparently, would claim that it's all mental illness/hallucinations.
I don't know of any firm, fast way to tell the difference between the two. I think you'd just have to try and judge it on a case by case basis, probably looking at things like the character, belief systems, and other behaviour of the person involved and the nature of the messages they recieve. I think anyboy who recieves messages saying they should hurt themselves or others is probably ill and needs urgent professional help. On the other hand someone who recieves a message saying to tell someone that their grandmother loves them very much and their missing cat is trapped down a well is possibly recieving genuine messages.

<edit>
It's probably also worth pointing out that everybody has a mental illness of some form. Landser, for example, is obviously very insecure in his/her belief system and unable to deal with the paradigm shift that believing in paranormal phenomena would bring
</edit>

rcunning03 wrote:

What defences are there to stop a spiritual journey (e.g. Taking a fly agaric mushroom) from sending you to a mental hospital

Not taking them !
There are ways of protecting yourself on genuine spiritual journeys but by definition drugs remove the control of your mind from you and can render them useless. It's generally recommended not to use drugs for spiritual journeying. Those people who would use them as an aid generally recommend that you be very experienced (on the spiritual side ) first.

I am MAN wrote:

I do believe in coincidence though.

Me too ! What a .... erm ... never mind

landser

stevenmu wrote:

. People who don't believe it's possible, such as landser apparently, would claim that it's all mental illness/hallucinations.

i do indeed, or they are complete fraudsters preying on the vulnerable and usually grief stricken bereaved, like that blind cow from derry.
any of these mediums, psychics what have ye peddle lies and false hope. i'm not saying that there's no after life (i have no way of knowng) but i do know that if i walk into a room full of people and say "i'm getting a msg from mary, does that mean anything to anyone", chances are it will.

psychics me ar*e

GuanYin

landser wrote:

i do indeed, or they are complete fraudsters preying on the vulnerable and usually grief stricken bereaved, like that blind cow from derry.
any of these mediums, psychics what have ye peddle lies and false hope. i'm not saying that there's no after life (i have no way of knowng) but i do know that if i walk into a room full of people and say "i'm getting a msg from mary, does that mean anything to anyone", chances are it will.

psychics me ar*e

Just before I decide if you are trolling or not.

Are you saying that anyone anywhere who perceives dead people is a psycho, a liar and a fraud or are you just suggesting that the mediums who perform grandiose seances are?


Are you saying that there is no way anyone could perceive the dead or communicate with them or are you saying that you don't believe the commercial ones can.

How can you back up this viewpoint.

Oryx

landser wrote:

i do indeed, or they are complete fraudsters preying on the vulnerable and usually grief stricken bereaved, like that blind cow from derry.
any of these mediums, psychics what have ye peddle lies and false hope. i'm not saying that there's no after life (i have no way of knowng) but i do know that if i walk into a room full of people and say "i'm getting a msg from mary, does that mean anything to anyone", chances are it will.

psychics me ar*e

I accept that there are fraudsters out there and I hate them as much as you do and wish them an eternity of misery. BUT to class all psychics as fraudsters is ignorant and cynical

landser

syke wrote:

Just before I decide if you are trolling or not.

Are you saying that anyone anywhere who perceives dead people is a psycho, a liar and a fraud or are you just suggesting that the mediums who perform grandiose seances are?


Are you saying that there is no way anyone could perceive the dead or communicate with them or are you saying that you don't believe the commercial ones can.

How can you back up this viewpoint.

i'm not trollin. this is my belief. EDIT out the unsubstantiated insults WARNING you will be banned for future offenses i can't back this is up as you would like me too, no more than you can prove that there is an after life, a tooth fairy or an honest politician.

there is NO empirical evidence to say that psychics, medians or whatever they call themselves can communicate with the dead. i have seen many of these so called gifted people and they deal in banalities EDIT out the unsubstantiated offensive remarks

i haven't classed all psychich as frauds, EDIT out the unsubstantiated remark

i don't want to rant about it, but it's all BS

Oryx

landser wrote:

i'm not trollin. this is my belief. i believe all psychich are either loons or con men. i can't back this is up as you would like me too, no more than you can prove that there is an after life, a tooth fairy or an honest politician.

there is NO empirical evidence to say that psychics, medians or whatever they call themselves can communicate with the dead. i have seen many of these so called gifted people and they deal in banalities and generalities to which the vulnerable or feeble monded can attach any significance they wish to.

i haven't classed all psychich as frauds, there may well be some people out there who genuinely believe that they can speak to the dead.... but they can't.

i don't want to rant about it, but it's all BS

Thanks for calling me a loon

All I can say is how little you know. When you die your in for a BIG surprise

GuanYin

landser wrote:

i'm not trollin. this is my belief. EDIT out the unsubstantiated insults WARNING you will be banned for future offenses
i can't back this is up as you would like me too, no more than you can prove that there is an after life, a tooth fairy or an honest politician.

Gross generalisation and your beliefs are fine but I'd like to point you towards the forum charter. This isn't the place to make those accusations and if you can't put your points forward in a civil manner you will be banned. As such I'm editing the offensive remarks.

there is NO empirical evidence to say that psychics, medians or whatever they call themselves can communicate with the dead. EDIT out the unsubstantiated offensive remarks

Not quite true, there is quite alot of physical evidence that has yet to be debunked. Topically (with the advent of the movie) EVP is something that has in several cases, produced evidence that cannot be explained by paranormal/skeptical investigators.

i haven't classed all psychich as frauds, there may well be some people out there who genuinely believe that they can speak to the dead.... EDIT out the unsubstantiated remark

i don't want to rant about it, but it's all BS

Well its ok, because you're ranting is about to be removed.

Zillah

I'm wondering what the hell these mean strangers are doing on our forum...

Carpo

stevenmu wrote:

I think anyboy who recieves messages saying they should hurt themselves or others is probably ill and needs urgent professional help. On the other hand someone who recieves a message saying to tell someone that their grandmother loves them very much and their missing cat is trapped down a well is possibly recieving genuine messages.

eh? Are you saying that if someone recieves a 'nice' message then they are probably genuine psychics/mediums/whatever, but if they recieve a 'nasty' message they are probably nuts?

I'm just curious why you might thik this.

keu

not sure where to start.

What is the difference between a person who can hear the dead and a person with a psychological disorder.

most people who have psychological disorders are on some form of medication or (the dangerous ones) are locked up. But, classing mediums and psychics as having some type of mental incapacity might be better worded as having a higher mental capacity.
for example..do you think blind people don't know the difference between red and white? Do you believe that they might have developed other senses to substitute. (maybe you could ask the blind cow in derry)
same with deaf people (I've met lots of deaf "mediums"), can you not understand that they might be able to use other senses to determine what they can't "hear"?
They can sense how someone is feeling ten times better than people who dont need to rely on those senses .
Over time they learn to trust these other senses and the information it provides.
I think mediums and psychics have learned to trust their other senses too.
I have given quite a few messages in my time (been actively involved since i was 23 will be thirty this year) and I'm not sure that I believe in the afterlife.
I know I used to, but I have managed to change my understanding as to where those messages have come from. Your body emits an energy, a particular signature and if like a palm reader I were to read those lines, I would be able to determine information regarding you. This takes away the involvment of having "dead people" around. Any information regarding "spirit" is just an echo of them, imprinted into your energy.
So, there's no heaven and when you die the worms just eat you. Happy now?

Oryx

Carpo wrote:

eh? Are you saying that if someone recieves a 'nice' message then they are probably genuine psychics/mediums/whatever, but if they recieve a 'nasty' message they are probably nuts?

I'm just curious why you might thik this.

Anyone causing harm to themselves or others needs help regardless of where its coming from. Nasty or nice, the only messages worth considering are those verifiable and understood by the recipient. And anyone passing messages from spirit should 'above all do no harm' so nasty messages should not be passed on. Thats my bit dont know about stevenmu

Nevyn

IT is hard to tell sometimes,

I have meet people that think/say they are phsyic or a witch when
quiet frankly they need to talk to a theraphist and an analyst
and get medication, And it is thier belief in this that stops them getting the help they needs.

Like wise I have meet people that are genuine cases of mediums ect that have been mediacted up to the eyeballs by family and doctors living a miserible life until they got off the meds, got some training and now live happy lives comfortible with thier skills.

Or then there there are people that only after going through trama or a break down are opened up to thier skills and have to fight thier way to getting off meds and dealing with how thier life has changed.

There are no easy answers to this but you soon learn to tell the difference once you have meet enough people.

stormkeeper

Hrm... I'd like to believe that I'm psychic, as opposed to mentally unstable. But that said, I noticed that people who are intuitive seem to have a disability or condition... I'm not sure if it's all people or just some, but it's an observation I made.

Always in black

landser has been lambasted for daring to express his opinion as contrary to the greater part of the forum. a difference of opinion does not imply that he is a mean stranger (and you are not six and hes not offering you a lollipop). he has not as far as i can see classedd all as frauds but is saying that a healthy majority are somewhat dubious in this ....ability...i suppose i would call it. to accuse him of trolling immediatly shows the kind of closemindedness that is contrary to charter of the forum. i have seen that lady from derry on the late late and when the phone in time came around, EVERY SINGLE CALL was to oust her as a fraud. it is easy to see why one would be cynical of physcis if she is a public representation of an already, in many peoples eyes, a dubious skill.

gogo

This thread is very curious, rcunning03 put across a very valid and interesting question, and i was looking forward to reading the answers as I don't know too much about the paranormal.

But regarding the previous post, how come landser did get heckles of troll for expressing his/her opinion?
Especially when i am man came in and said pretty much the same thing and got no lash back for it?
To be fair I can see why landser's responses are getting angrier?

So I feel that katiek response of troll troll troll should be equally greeted with a banning if any are to be handed out.



As for this?

phlematic wrote:

I'm wondering what the hell these mean strangers are doing on our forum...

Who's forum is this now, because the last time I looked you weren't in the equation (neither was i for that matter, but I'm not claiming it as mine.)

As for the inital question asked, an answer to that would be that I am really unsure, there are a lot of frauds out there, but then a lot of what some mediums come up with is uncanny, so I'm really out on the topic, and would like to see more revelant replys here to the inital question.

Oryx

landser wrote:

none, they're both psycho, or the former's a fraud and the latter unfortunate

My troll response was to the above remark which is unequivocally calling anyone with a belief in the paranormal a psycho. Thats trolling to me.

Always in black

it was a childish reply to a statement of opinion. that is intolerence.

gogo

rcunning03 wrote:

What is the difference between a person who can hear the dead and a person with a psychological disorder.

Lets read this again together shall we.- what is the difference between a person who can hear the dead and a person with a psychological disorder.

landser reply

landser wrote:

none, they're both psycho, or the former's a fraud and the latter unfortunate

Now how is that

katiek wrote:

unequivocally calling anyone with a belief in the paranormal a psycho

.

I'll give you time to read over it again katiek. seeing as you obvioulsy didn't read it right the first time, and as it was you who started this in the first place, i think you owe landser an apology as you were wrong.

Now as anyone got anything decent to reply to this thread or is it going to continue in this fashion for its indurance.

Always in black

/me nods head and agrees readily.

Oryx

In an effort to get this back on track, sorry landser, thought the whole argument was a stitch up yesterday, accept I misread the intent. OK?

As Ive said before, here and in other posts, psychic ability and mental illness are very close to each other, whether it drives you mad or you were mad in the first place is hard or impossible to decide as those with the power to decide dont always believe in the phenomenon anyway. There are always people who will hear voices that have nothing to do with the paranormal. In my case I thought I was going mad for years (maybe I am ) and I only got past that when I accepted what was going on might be paranormal, and from there I could deal with it.

Always in black

gogo wrote:

Now as anyone got anything decent in reply to this thread or is it going to continue in this fashion for its indurance.

/Me Nods hed and Agrees completly!!

gogo

Cool katiek, But an interesting point brought up somewhere is who does draw the line?
Are some people unfortunate and get put in mental institutes or who is it that says they are crazy, surely not all instiute Governors/doctors are disbeliving of the paranormal? where does one draw the line?

Oryx

Who can say? Hopefully with time tolerance and knowledge will increase. In the early 1900s promiscuity and post natal depression saw people locked up for life as incurable lunatics, and we now have a better understanding of that.

Always in black

has anyone here had an indisputable psycic incident. katiek...you last post was tantalizing!!more detail please.

Always in black

KatieK wrote:

In an effort to get this back on track, sorry landser, thought the whole argument was a stitch up yesterday, accept I misread the intent. OK?

As Ive said before, here and in other posts, psychic ability and mental illness are very close to each other, whether it drives you mad or you were mad in the first place is hard or impossible to decide as those with the power to decide dont always believe in the phenomenon anyway. There are always people who will hear voices that have nothing to do with the paranormal. [Quote=Katiek} In my case I thought I was going mad for years (maybe I am ) and I only got past that when I accepted what was going on might be paranormal, and from there I could deal with it.

i meant this!

GuanYin

Look READ THE CHARTER.

When you do, come back and read the posts I edited.

They violate the charter, end of story.

Always in black and gogo first friendly warning.

If you have a problem in future, keep it off the thread, either PM me or go to feedback.

S

Oryx

Yes I have had definite psychic experiences. I have had to deal with a lack of understanding and the type of comment made earlier in this post for a long time, which is why Im always reluctant to talk in detail about it. Put it this way I believe without a doubt, and so do a lot of people who know me well.