Does SF/IRA actually want a conclusion to the peace process?

billy the squid

FTA69 wrote:

What has the UN got to do with anything, the fact remains they aren't the Óglaigh na hÉireann who fought and died in 1916.

well if they died in 1916 they would be of little use to the army now now wouldnt they.

Okay screw you FTA go into details or I am presenting the list of surprious unsupported allegations that you constantly present as facts, and I'll argue that your consistent assetion of statements that you cannot support aside from your own allegations is justification for your banning from this forum.

I'd feel better if it were presented to the Guards to give them the choice whether or not to take defamation cases against him.

FTA69

mycroft wrote:

Hey FTA seeing as you're ignoring my demands from earlier in this thread care to provide proof of this accusation?

Well sorry for not hot-footing it back to answer your queries and assertions mycroft, but considering I've been conducting multiple debates with multiple people it is inevitable that I'll miss one or two. The Special Branch are a feature of every Republican commemoration, usually in the form of vans with tinted windows and Ford Focuses packed with men in cheap suits with worse facial hair. They take photos of all people attending such activities as well as drawing out lists of people in attendence, car registrations etc.

http://cryptome.org/special-branch.htm This has a few pictures of the Branch at anti-war marches (probably there to observe IRSP and Sinn Féin participants).

http://cryptome.org/special-branch2.htm Here is another few, note number 10, the future documentarist.

Furthermore can you not get it into your head that in the interest of avoiding further terrorist attacks and deaths a police force must feel that examiniing who attents republican commemorations to track potential terrorists is justified.

What attacks would these be? The IRA has not launched an attack in 8 years, besides, the Branch show up at all demonstrations that include Republicans eg the one for the Talbot Street bomb. You can be sure that their northern counterparts will be there in droves this weekend during the Bloody Sunday commemoration despite this being co-hosted by the SDLP. I suppose they're planning a few attacks as well are they?

You do not adhere to the laws of either country yet at the same time demand that the governments of both countries adhere to the version of their constitutions that suite you.

Not really, I just don't like seeing people battered to a pulp and then seeing "the law" being cited as a result.

Okay screw you FTA go into details

Not a chance.

or I am presenting the list of surprious unsupported allegations that you constantly present as facts, and I'll argue that your consistent assetion of statements that you cannot support aside from your own allegations is justification for your banning from this forum.

Fire away boy.

FTA69

true wrote:

Not all Guards, FTA, not all Guards. Thetre has been collusion between the Guards and the IRA in many instances ( murders of Justice Gibson and his wife, murders of numerous RUC men in different incidents , the house search at Claremorris etc etc ).

Intelligence has reached the IRA coming from the direction of the Guards, that is indeed true, but there is no comparison between RUC/UVF collaboration and the very occasional incidents involving IRA/Guard collusion. Guard collusion was not directed by various intelligence services in the 26 Counties that would have been answerable to a government cabinet. There may well have been Guards who aided the IRA in some way or form but that doesn't change the fact that the force they were a part of remained anti-Republican. Eamonn Collins worked for the customs in Newry while supplying intelligence, that doesn't make that body or the state it works for supportive of the IRA though.

Then again , you are probably too young and too far from the action in "Free West Waterford" to be familiar with these

As opposed to you is it true? A man with lots of "experience" on the subject but who didn't even know who Frank Ryan was. And what connection do you have with any of the organisations you frequently defend? Or are you simply another Sunday Independent reading bigot who thinks he knows everything? Again I see you cite my youth, age is not indicative of political acumen or judgement true, you're living proof of that.

FTA69

jbkenn wrote:

Neither are the class A gob$hites you keep waxing lyrical about.

You can call them gob****es all you want jbkenn, but it won't make them so. Are people like Bobby Sands or former members such as Danny Morrison "gob****es" in your opinion?

had, past tense now committed to a 50/50 membership

Whether they have more Catholics on the force is irrelevant, they would still be serving the same rotten force. What the religion of the man beating people into comas for trying to calm a situation at an interface is matters little to me.

Ye should write in and complain.

It might seem of little importance to you but your opinions on a matter are not the deciding factor of an issue's gravity.

You dont know much about police training, do you, bit more to it than giving a couple of morons baseball bats, and, sending them around to beat the living $hit out of some young fellow

Again a petty insult backed up with no argument whatsoever. The police on both sides of the border are well able to batter young people as well.

Maybe they just want to swap stories with the 3 bird watchers from Colombia, or maybe they are doing their duty and gathering intelligence on people who pose a threat to the state.

I love this "threat to the state" rubbish, by that logic the wish for a unitary Ireland would pose a threat to the state because it seeks to alter the current status of the 26 county state. It is an absolute non-argument.

You dont have to go into detail, a simple yes or no answer will do

A yes or no answer to what question?

FTA69

billy the squid wrote:

well if they died in 1916 they would be of little use to the army now now wouldnt they.

Hilarious, you still ignored my point though.

I'd feel better if it were presented to the Guards to give them the choice whether or not to take defamation cases against him.

Ring them and them tell them sure.

jbkenn

FTA69 wrote:

http://cryptome.org/special-branch.htm This has a few pictures of the Branch at anti-war marches (probably there to observe IRSP and Sinn Féin participants).

I haven't got their photographs but I can give you the names of some branch men.

1) Det Ins John Jordan

2) Det Sgt Walter O'Sullivan

3) Det Sgt Brendan Bunton

Here is a name of the guy which you may find interesting;

Walter Kirwan: I think he is attached to C3, but he has information linking the explosives used in the Dublin and Monaghan bombings of 17th May 1974 to a commercial explosives facility in the Irish Republic: Irish Industrial Explosives at Clona, Enfield, Co Meath.

http://cryptome.org/special-branch2.htm Here is another few, note number 10, the future documentarist.

Where do you find these sites?, number 10, I'd say he is definitely CIA, see the initials on his hat NY, definitely CIA.

Those photographs could have been taken at a football match for all you know.

jbkenn

mycroft

FTA69 wrote:

Well sorry for not hot-footing it back to answer your queries and assertions mycroft, but considering I've been conducting multiple debates with multiple people it is inevitable that I'll miss one or two. The Special Branch are a feature of every Republican commemoration, usually in the form of vans with tinted windows and Ford Focuses packed with men in cheap suits with worse facial hair. They take photos of all people attending such activities as well as drawing out lists of people in attendence, car registrations etc.

Uh huh I charged you on specifics you answered other posts on vague matters to others.

Furthermore seeing as the fact the it's becoming readliy apparent the IRA are paying just lip service to the GFA agreement I think that a mild police prescence supervising such events seems like its justified

http://cryptome.org/special-branch.htm This has a few pictures of the Branch at anti-war marches (probably there to observe IRSP and Sinn Féin participants).

At ANTI WAR MARCHES AND "PROBABLY" THERE TO INVESTIGATE IRSP AND SINN FEIN thats the motherf*cking? The best you can do? Not even at republican events? general anti war events. Many anti war activists have undergone intimidation from the branch this is the best you can offer theres no supporting evidence that this was specifically pointed towards republicans??? This is just laughable.....

Even for you

What attacks would these be? The IRA has not launched an attack in 8 years, besides, the Branch show up at all demonstrations that include Republicans eg the one for the Talbot Street bomb. You can be sure that their northern counterparts will be there in droves this weekend during the Bloody Sunday commemoration despite this being co-hosted by the SDLP. I suppose they're planning a few attacks as well are they?

The facts that the Provos have been continuing puinishment beatings and criminal activitises such a rackettering among communities. Like your TD counterparts you can only respond with bluster to respond to specific allegations,

Not really, I just don't like seeing people battered to a pulp and then seeing "the law" being cited as a result.

Fantastic utterly brilliant. An IRA apologist utterly outraged at random violence which there is no court of appeal and if the person who has been shot beaten or both tries to go to the courts they get killed.

Yeah huh uh, share your outrage for the dozens of youths who suffer a padre pieo (two bullets to the wrists) every year.

Fire away boy.

Already have; you've made anonymous allegations unable to support them and then when accused of making such a thing you ignore the accusation.

You're a liar, a contemptable liar at that, an apologist for a group of murdering thugs, and shrill demander for the rights for thugs and murders rights the self same "heroes" denied the people they inflicted their "justice" upon.

You sicken me you contemptable sniveling curr.

jbkenn

FTA69 wrote:

You can call them gob****es all you want jbkenn, but it won't make them so. Are people like Bobby Sands or former members such as Danny Morrison "gob****es" in your opinion?

Yes

Whether they have more Catholics on the force is irrelevant, they would still be serving the same rotten force. What the religion of the man beating people into comas for trying to calm a situation at an interface is matters little to me.

Dont know what they can do to satisfy you so, short of disbanding the Police Force altogether, and replacing them with the baseball bat "Sporting Heroes" of the "Republican" Community Police

It might seem of little importance to you but your opinions on a matter are not the deciding factor of an issue's gravity.

They have recourse to the Police Ombudsman

Again a petty insult backed up with no argument whatsoever. The police on both sides of the border are well able to batter young people as well.

You deny "Republican" Community Police punishment beatings?

I love this "threat to the state" rubbish, by that logic the wish for a unitary Ireland would pose a threat to the state because it seeks to alter the current status of the 26 county state. It is an absolute non-argument.

The IRA is a threat to the State, fact. I like many, would welcome a 32 County Republic, but only by consent.

A yes or no answer to what question?

The question was, were you, as you stated, arrested for legitimate political activity?


jbkenn

FTA69

mycroft wrote:

Furthermore seeing as the fact the it's becoming readliy apparent the IRA are paying just lip service to the GFA agreement I think that a mild police prescence supervising such events seems like its justified

The IRA never signed up to the GFA at all by the way but they are supportive of it. Their 3 acts of putting arms beyond use demonstrate that.

At ANTI WAR MARCHES AND "PROBABLY" THERE TO INVESTIGATE IRSP AND SINN FEIN thats the motherf*cking? The best you can do? Not even at republican events? general anti war events. Many anti war activists have undergone intimidation from the branch this is the best you can offer theres no supporting evidence that this was specifically pointed towards republicans??? This is just laughable.....

So who else were they there to view mycroft? Those state threatening anarchists of the Workers' Solidarity Movement? Rich Boy Barrett and co?

rackettering among communities.

Absolute rubbish, along with the accusations that the IRA are drug dealers this is an absolute fabrication. What IRA members have ever been convicted of racketeering?

Fantastic utterly brilliant. An IRA apologist utterly outraged at random violence which there is no court of appeal and if the person who has been shot beaten or both tries to go to the courts they get killed.

You're misrepresenting me now, I do not expect any semblance of "lawful" behaviour on the part of the establishment, I was simply pointing out that the Guards are the hypocrites in this scenario for pretending to be bound to the law while routinely breaking it.

Yeah huh uh, share your outrage for the dozens of youths who suffer a padre pieo (two bullets to the wrists) every year.

And why do you think people recieve this treatment mycroft? It is because desperate communities with no police force turn to the IRA to act against those who would rip communties apart with their muggings, death-driving and drug dealing.

Already have; you've made anonymous allegations unable to support them and then when accused of making such a thing you ignore the accusation.

Right so.

You're a liar, a contemptable liar at that, an apologist for a group of murdering thugs, and shrill demander for the rights for thugs and murders rights the self same "heroes" denied the people they inflicted their "justice" upon.

You sicken me you contemptable sniveling curr.

As I said before, you are entitled to your opinion.

true

FTA69 wrote:

[I]. Eamonn Collins worked for the customs in Newry while supplying intelligence ( to the IRA ), that doesn't make that body or the state it works for supportive of the IRA though.[/I]

No, and if a RUC man leaked the identity of an IRA man to the UVF that is mere speculation more often than not on your part, is it not FTA69. It does not make that body or the state it works for supportive of the UVF though.



Quote FTA69 : As opposed to you is it true? A man with lots of "experience" on the subject but who didn't even know who Frank Ryan was. And what connection do you have with any of the organisations you frequently defend? Or are you simply another Sunday Independent reading bigot who thinks he knows everything? Again I see you cite my youth, age is not indicative of political acumen or judgement true, you're living proof of that.[/I]

I THINK I know who Frank Ryan is, is he not some dodgy IRA character from sixty years ago that was associated with Sean Russell the Nazi callaborator?
He is no hero of mine, I cannot be bothered learning off the name of every IRA man that ever was. Although I am a lot , lot older than you, it was before my memory if it was the early forties.
As regards being a bigot who thinks he knows everything, no I am not, thank you. I keep an open mind and have probably met more people from all corners of the North than you ever will.

FTA69

jbkenn wrote:

Yes

Fair enough, but bear in mind that the vast majority of right-minded people would disagree with you.

Dont know what they can do to satisfy you so, short of disbanding the Police Force altogether, and replacing them with the baseball bat "Sporting Heroes" of the "Republican" Community Police

As I said before,
have full and public inquiries into the force in the hope of rooting out collusion. Grant more powers to local policing boards and disband the Special Branch.

They have recourse to the Police Ombudsman

Who is hopelessly ineffective.

You deny "Republican" Community Police punishment beatings?

No I don't deny them at all, but I analyse the reasons behind their occurence and propose measures to create a scenario where they will no longer be needed. Besides, Republicans have high hopes for the CRJ project.

The IRA is a threat to the State, fact. I like many, would welcome a 32 County Republic, but only by consent.

Whether by consent or not it would still usurp the 26 County state and as such could constitute a threat. That is the illogical nature of the "threat" argument.

The question was, were you, as you stated, arrested for legitimate political activity?

You don't have to be charged with anything to be lifted, I can also say that I never broke a law during the course of my political activity.

true

FTA69 wrote "You don't have to be charged with anything to be lifted, I can also say that I never broke a law during the course of my political activity."

LOL. FTA69 never broke a law. I suppose the people who murdered and tortured a mother of ten never broke a law either, as it was not a crime. Oh dear.

FTA69

true wrote:

No, and if a RUC man leaked the identity of an IRA man to the UVF that is mere speculation more often than not on your part, is it not FTA69. It does not make that body or the state it works for supportive of the UVF though.

Peter Cory stated that collusion was evident in many cases, there is no longer any "speculation" regarding collusion true, it is accepted as fact. The Force Research Unit also ran Brian Nelson as an agent within the UDA who were supplied with hundreds upon hundreds of files regarding Republicans. The FRU was a part of the British Army which was directly answerable to the cabinet.

I THINK I know who Frank Ryan is, is he not some dodgy IRA character from sixty years ago that was associated with Sean Russell the Nazi callaborator?

A man who fought facists in Spain by the way, and was frequently beaten and almost shot for repeatedly refusing to give the Nazi salute.

As regards being a bigot who thinks he knows everything, no I am not, thank you. I keep an open mind and have probably met more people from all corners of the North than you ever will.

I couldn't care less how many people you met throughout the course of your lifetime to be honest, it still doesn't have any relevance on your political argument though.

FTA69

true wrote:

LOL. FTA69 never broke a law. I suppose the people who murdered and tortured a mother of ten never broke a law either, as it was not a crime. Oh dear.

Oh I broke laws alright, I broke several today by smoking and purchasing alcohol while under the age of 18. I never broke a law connected with my political activity is actually what I said true, to quote yourself, "learn to read"

true

FTA69 wrote:

Oh I broke laws alright, I broke several today by smoking and purchasing alcohol while under the age of 18. I never broke a law connected with my political activity is actually what I said true, to quote yourself, "learn to read"

First you say you did not break a law, and I repeat that.

Now you say you "broke laws alright". I think it is you who should learn to read , FTA69, or at least take it easy on the booze until you are over 18 and a bit more mature and can handle it better.

Incidentally, it is funny that you consider smoking under the age of 18 is breaking the law, while presumeably you think the murder of Jean McConville was not a crime.

billy the squid

Oh I broke laws alright, I broke several today by smoking and purchasing alcohol while under the age of 18. I never broke a law connected with my political activity is actually what I said true, to quote yourself, "learn to read"

How about libel laws claiming without evidence that you were mistreated by the gardai. you claim that it was because of your membership of sinn fein. so I guess breaking libel laws is connected to your political activities. no?

true

QUOTE=FTA69 Peter Cory stated that collusion was evident in many cases, there is no longer any "speculation" regarding collusion true, it is accepted as fact. The Force Research Unit also ran Brian Nelson as an agent within the UDA who were supplied with hundreds upon hundreds of files regarding Republicans. The FRU was a part of the British Army which was directly answerable to the cabinet.

Waffle waffle.... out of the tens of thousands of security force personel in N. Ireland over the years, tell me the names of those who colluded. Then we will work it out as a percentage of the total force.


Quote FTA A man who fought facists in Spain by the way, and was frequently beaten and almost shot for repeatedly refusing to give the Nazi salute.

That has no relevance to the topic we were discussing. Everything I said about your man was correct.


Quote FTA [I]I couldn't care less how many people you met throughout the course of your lifetime to be honest, it still doesn't have any relevance on your political argument though[/I].

You accused me of being a **** bigot and I replied by saying I am open minded and have probably met more people from N. Ireland than you ever will.
I am far from being a bigot, I have plenty of very good friends up North from both sides of the religous and political divide. I think if 90% of people, at least , from N. I. heard your opinions they would classify YOU as the bigot.

mycroft

FTA69 wrote:

The IRA never signed up to the GFA at all by the way but they are supportive of it. Their 3 acts of putting arms beyond use demonstrate that.

UH HUH and when will SF and the IRA quit there transubsantiation. SF are at the table because they are the IRA political wing,

So who else were they there to view mycroft? Those state threatening anarchists of the Workers' Solidarity Movement? Rich Boy Barrett and co?

Once again you're having in your cake n eat it. Why are they following you and not RBB, is it because you're linked to active paramilitary groups. Besides as I pointed out earlier in this Irish anti war movement members including Ed Horgan and Fintain lane have recieved branch intimidation.

You claim you've done nothing wrong, while at the same time demand to know who else they are following. Whats your point.

Absolute rubbish, along with the accusations that the IRA are drug dealers this is an absolute fabrication. What IRA members have ever been convicted of racketeering?

And how many branch members have been convicted of intimidation of SF members? Are the IRA beating people to a pulp and shooting them, justg becuase they can't serve community service notices? (frankly I'd assume after years of this kind of RA behaviour if someone in the IRA offered a teenager a chance between doing say 200 hrs volunteer community service (say helping out eldery members of the community) or shooting both their ankles, I'd take the service. Nevertheless after years of crippling the teenagers of communities across the north the IRA are still doing it. Why? Well my opinion is the IRA still want to instill an atmosphere of fear a classic part of a rackettering syndicate.

Which is circumstantely evidence of rackettering, which is more evidence than you've evidence you've presented to support your alledged campaign
of intimidation of SF members in free west waterford.

You're misrepresenting me now, I do not expect any semblance of "lawful" behaviour on the part of the establishment, I was simply pointing out that the Guards are the hypocrites in this scenario for pretending to be bound to the law while routinely breaking it.

While utterly failing to provide any evidence to support your claim.

Further the IRA have consitently claimed to not be a criminal group but a army at war. A army that captures kidnaps and tortures civilians, tries them in secret miltary courts and and dumps their bodies in unmarked graves.

An organisation which targets civilians, intimidates them, beats them and murders them. An organisation which robs and steals from the citizens of the country they claim to represent, and which holds itself responsible to no one but an unelected unknown body that is answerable to no one accountable

And you have the audacity to condemn a police for unnecessary force, a police force you can't find a single example of an elected representive of your own party supporting you allegation of a systematic campaign of intimidation of your own party.

And why do you think people recieve this treatment mycroft? It is because desperate communities with no police force turn to the IRA to act against those who would rip communties apart with their muggings, death-driving and drug dealing.

Communties where the police are intimidated threatened and cannot go into.
You're part of an self fufilling sequence, the police can't enter because you don't trust them, therefore you must (and I use the word "you" in the loosest sense after all you haven't been able to show any proof of allegations of this sort in "free west waterford') resort to the tactics the IRA diem necessary because of the lack of law and order.

As I said before, you are entitled to your opinion.

And right now i'm off the opinion you need to be run out of this country and dumped in the ocean. You and your ilk talking about "noble blood spilt by Irish patriots" Ignores this simple fact. We, the majority, Irish, British, Catholic, and Protestant, just want to get on with the future, we're tired of both sides speaking of history as a justification for your and your killer mates behaviour.

We want to get on with the future. We're tired of your politics and we want a future where you are irrelevant. You'd like to think you aren't. But you're intimidating communties like the UVF and UDF and expecting them to toe the line, and the sooner we force guns out of Irish politics the sooner people will realise SF are a opportuntiest cyncial bunch of gun running thugs.....

jbkenn

FTA69 wrote:

jbkenn wrote:

Fair enough, but bear in mind that the vast majority of right-minded people would disagree with you.

Bobby Sands died on self imposed hunger strike for "political status", why I dont know, perhaps it was because of the realisation that without "political status", he was just a common criminal, all I do know for certain, is, he is long dead, and those who profit from his death are not.

As I said before,
have full and public inquiries into the force in the hope of rooting out collusion. Grant more powers to local policing boards and disband the Special Branch.

The Special Branch in police forces in the U.K. and Ireland are tasked with gathering and interpreting intelligence, a police force without an intelligence service are just glorified traffic wardens, but, as Mitchell McLaughlin said there is no crime only "wrongs" I suppose the rest could be sorted out by the muppets with the baseball bats, saves a fortune, no wasting time on police investigations, lengthy and costly trials, legal fees and expensive prisons, puts a bit of pressure on the A & E services alright, but, what else would they be doing anyway?

Who is hopelessly ineffective.

Why did I expect that answer?

No I don't deny them at all, but I analyse the reasons behind their occurence and propose measures to create a scenario where they will no longer be needed. Besides, Republicans have high hopes for the CRJ project.

There is no need for analysis,they are not needed now and were never needed.

Whether by consent or not it would still usurp the 26 County state and as such could constitute a threat. That is the illogical nature of the "threat" argument.

A consentual unification by the will of the people would not in any way usurp the State, and would be welcome by all democrats. The threat comes from armed groups bent on unification by force of arms and the imposition of a Marxist Socialist regime, that no one in their right mind wants.

You don't have to be charged with anything to be lifted, I can also say that I never broke a law during the course of my political activity.

Then you have nothing to fear from An Garda Siochana

jbkenn

Cork

jbkenn wrote:

FTA69 wrote:

he is long dead, and those who profit from his death are not.
jbkenn

How much does the retail devision of SF make selling IRA nick nacks.

A so called polical party selling that thye of stuff is very telling about that organisations atitute of victims of IRA crime.

Now, Garda Siochana have done this country some service.

Yes - no organisation is perfect but using these forums to bash an Garda Siochanais wrong. The Garda Siochana have precious little to do with politics and using a politics forum to discuss same is not logical.

TheDoc

I havnt read the whole post but I just want to say **** the ira. They are a pack of gangsters and a disgrace. For the valiant men that gave their lifes to save ireland, people like Sands, people that died in the days of the war of independence etc. The IRA is a sham and all they want is wealth, I hope they are all caught and shot dead they are a pack of gangsters. Robbing banks, killing children and innocent people, is this to save ireland? No to ****ing line their own pockets.

Cork

[DM]-TheDOC- wrote:

I havnt read the whole post but I just want to say **** the ira. They are a pack of gangsters and a disgrace. For the valiant men that gave their lifes to save ireland, people like Sands, people that died in the days of the war of independence etc. The IRA is a sham and all they want is wealth, I hope they are all caught and shot dead they are a pack of gangsters. Robbing banks, killing children and innocent people, is this to save ireland? No to ****ing line their own pockets.

That indeed is the sad reality of the IRA which has to stop.

Continued punishment beatings, rackets, bank robberies etc are been carried out by this pack of thugs.

They now have some hard choices to make about whether they want to go the policital or criminal route.

Lets us hope they give up their criminal past and focus on democratic politics.

TheDoc

I bet not one of them could even ****ing name the IRa leaders of the olden days, the valiant men that gave their lives in 1916. I bet they dont even know what the fields of athenrye means. Just no good ganster punks they are, I ****ing hope the UVF kill them, atleast they are staying with their original goals.

Cork

I can't believe that they tought they could continue with their criminality while at the same time "supporting" the Good Friday agreement.

I don't know if this was sheer stupidity or arrogance.

But both governments are now insisting to an end to IRA activity - and honestly it is about time.

oscarBravo

FTA69 wrote:

Not really, I just don't like seeing people battered to a pulp and then seeing "the law" being cited as a result.

...but you've no problem seeing people battered to a pulp as long as it's outside the law?

FTA69 wrote:

I do not expect any semblance of "lawful" behaviour on the part of the establishment, I was simply pointing out that the Guards are the hypocrites in this scenario for pretending to be bound to the law while routinely breaking it.

So violence is OK, as long as it's not hypocritical? We're supposed to admire the IRA because they make no pretence about the fact that they're violent thugs?

FTA69 wrote:

And why do you think people recieve this treatment mycroft? It is because desperate communities with no police force turn to the IRA to act against those who would rip communties apart with their muggings, death-driving and drug dealing.

The "desperate communities" in question would have a police force if they'd only acknowledge the validity of the one they have. Better again, they'd have a police force whose role is to bring offenders before the courts for a fair trial, instead of summary maiming.

FTA69 wrote:

Fair enough, but bear in mind that the vast majority of right-minded people would disagree with you.

Provide a source for that statistical assertion, please.

FTA69 wrote:

You don't have to be charged with anything to be lifted, I can also say that I never broke a law during the course of my political activity.

It's obvious that you did something to attract the attention of the police. I somehow doubt it was entirely innocuous, since you're ashamed to discuss it - even anonymously - in a public forum.

FTA69 wrote:

Whether by consent or not it would still usurp the 26 County state and as such could constitute a threat. That is the illogical nature of the "threat" argument.

Oh dear - your political naivety is showing:

Bunreacht na h&#201 wrote: »

Article 3

1. [font=&quot] [/font]It is the firm will of the Irish Nation, in harmony and friendship, to unite all the people who share the territory of the island of Ireland, in all the diversity of their identities and traditions, recognising that a united Ireland shall be brought about only by peaceful means with the consent of a majority of the people, democratically expressed, in both jurisdictions in the island. Until then, the laws enacted by the Parliament established by this Constitution shall have the like area and extent of application as the laws enacted by the Parliament that existed immediately before the coming into operation of this Constitution.

How could a united Ireland pose a threat to the country whose consititution opens with a wish for such unity?

Stabshauptmann

The arguement commonly used is that the IRA campaign poses a threat to the state, not the goal, but the means. A good example would be the death of Garda McCabe.

billy the squid

Cork wrote:

jbkenn wrote:

How much does the retail devision of SF make selling IRA nick nacks.

A so called polical party selling that thye of stuff is very telling about that organisations atitute of victims of IRA crime.

.

Bobby Sands T-Shirt €15

there is a whole section of hunger strike related trinkets there for you to help "the cause"

and then they go on to say their not related to the ira when they sell parafinalia (sp) in their online store.

and just to stop any confusion as to which IRA these trinkets are related to you have this on a nice t-shirt

Villain

billy the squid wrote:

and then they go on to say their not related to the ira when they sell parafinalia (sp) in their online store.

Who ever said there not related??

Come on dig up something new, we've seen these T-Shirts before

irish1

irish1 wrote:

Who ever said there not related??

Come on dig up something new, we've seen these T-Shirts before

Well ok let me ask you a question directly Irish1-Do you believe the IRA are an army?
And if you do on whose authority do they act?

Villain

Earthman wrote:

Well ok let me ask you a question directly Irish1-Do you believe the IRA are an army?
And if you do on whose authority do they act?

The IRA are an illegal organisation who act on their own authority. I do not support them and you know that, I have said it here many times.