Motions...

Crash

These topics are drifting way off course into flames, can we stick to the topic even a little bit?

ApeXaviour

crash_000 wrote:

These topics are drifting way off course into flames, can we stick to the topic even a little bit?

I'm not sure anyone has much anything else to say on it.. It happens to every thread here. I'll split it if you or Myth want?

Crash

I'm just sick of seeing every single thread, without exception, flowing over into flame wars or idle gossip. i mean i quite enjoy some of them but when it happens with everything it gets kinda annoying.

ApeXaviour

crash_000 wrote:

I'm just sick of seeing every single thread, without exception, flowing over into flame wars or idle gossip. i mean i quite enjoy some of them but when it happens with everything it gets kinda annoying.

Be honest, it only becomes annoying when it gets in the way of something you are interested in.

It's not hard to bring it back on topic. If the interest was there it would stay on topic, that's my philosophy on this n anyway.

As I said I'll split it if you want?

EDIT: Never mind, I'm splitting it anyway in a few mins..

Evilution

crash_000 wrote:

I'm just sick of seeing every single thread, without exception, flowing over into flame wars or idle gossip

You can't expect everyone to agree all the time. That said, maybe its some of that elitism from TCD flowing over onto boards?

Pet

These topics are drifting way off course into flames, can we stick to the topic even a little bit?

This is probably the first topic that has drifted into flames. Most go way off-topic, but that's because the original topic has been discussed enough. And there's no need for Nazi-esque moderation; it's not a busy forum and it's quite insular anyways.

Evilution, I have no beef with you, but I think you need to relax a little bit. This is quite a laid-back forum, if you're any way sensitive you'll just take things the wrong way and get offended. Even though we might seem serious, we're probably taking the piss, so chill, okay?

Crash

no, see i only reply when its something i'm interested in....mainly because, well, its something i'm interested in. and yes evilution, its my trinity elitism overflowing onto ....wait a minute, no, no it isnt. this is just added cock that you're talking once again. go have a break and sit down when you're not so pissed off at the world.

ApeXaviour

I split this thread so..

Back on topic:

Banning tobacco based products.. Hmm I wouldn't be against it. Though I'll probably abstain. It's the way Ireland is going, the gradual phasing out of tobacco. You notice less shops selling skins, taxes ever being hiked, age moved up to 18 to prevent kids from startin, smoking ban etc etc. Unlike the government's attempts to curtail our drinking, society is not resisting it at all. It's inevitable, your grandkids, if they be irish, will look upon tobacco as saudi arabia look upon alcohol.

ApeXaviour

ApeXaviour wrote:

I'm not sure anyone has much anything else to say on it.. It happens to every thread here. I'll split it if you or Myth want?

Bit late, but meh, I've no problem with it being split. The point of the thread was the first post anyways, not the 68th...

xeduCat

Evilution wrote:

Can you just remind us again why we're banning these things? Its hard work keeping up-to-date on which global conglomerates we're snubbing - is that why SU officers take a year out to work at it full-time?

No, my year out involves student appeals, sitting on too many Trinity committees, coordinating the class reps, being secretary for SU stuff like the Council and Executive, going to war with NRG Gestetner, giving advice on years out, course changes etc., and lots of other stuff that was never in the job description but is worth doing ;-)

Anyway, having no real role in how the shops run etc., the best I can do is pass on the info and let you make up your own mind. The SU will not sell Coke etc. as long as Trinity students tell us not to...if they decide otherwise, we'll wholeheartedly sell it again, at least until a ban comes back (with USI membership, this has actually happened).

Nestlé

TCDSU votes to boycott (not to stock or sell) Nescafé or other Nestlé
products in the Students’ Union shops.
We encourage College to do the same. We take this action in the light of
Nestlé’s continuing contravention of the World Health Organisation/UNICEF
International Code of Marketing of Breastmilk Substitutes by promoting
bottle-feeding and undermining breast-feeding

This one's fairly straightforward. On the substantive issue, i.e. that of Nestlé's role in bottle-feeding, here's the brief For and Against...
Nestlé corporate site: www.babymilk.nestle.com
Baby Milk Action (campaign): www.babymilkaction.org

On the other issue of whether or not the SU should take action on this issue, well there's no easy web link but you can probably fill in the blanks yourself on whether you think this is A Good Thing or A Terrible Thing.

Coca-Cola

TCDSU will not sell any products of the Coca Cola Corporation or enter into any sponsorship agreements with the Coca Cola Corporation due to the
current situation in Colombia

Less crystal-clear here. The 'current situation in Colombia' should really have been defined in the proposal (but I'm not responsible for it, and you can pretty much write your policy any way you want, the voters choose whether it makes sense or not). However having been a class rep last year, I can tell you that the situation relates to the dispute between Coca-Cola and the Columbian trade union Sinaltrainal, and it was also quite controversial! The www.killercoke.org site gives most of the pro-ban case, no authoritative source from the company side, although SIPTU's branch in the Coke plant in Ireland did campaign against the proposal. The same arguments for Nestlé (as to whether the SU has a role in this, what the financial consequences are, etc.) apply.

That make things any clearer?

Evilution

crash_000 wrote:

and yes evilution, its my trinity elitism overflowing onto ....wait a minute, no, no it isnt. this is just added cock that you're talking once again. go have a break and sit down when you're not so pissed off at the world.

Hmmmm. Jack Nicholson, whilst playing the joker in Batman 1, had a line that went "I have a name for my pain and it is batman".
I'm getting to think that some of the sensitive little lads on this forum (mods or otherwise) are paraphrasing this with Evilution instead.
I'm not pissed off with the world 000, not in the slightest. I'm a happy camper

Crash

yes, you're my name for pain. want a badge? cus that'd actually be kinda cool

my views on the whole ban thing - i'm totally and utterly opposed to the SU banning anything from the shops. IMO the job of the SU is to tackle things that the student body en masse cannot tackle itself. Banning of products is not one of these issues. People can (and will) vote with their feet, and if they need a ban to help them do that, then they obviously dont believe very ****ing hard in their ideals then do they?
those that care about it wont buy it, those that disagree with them will or wont buy it depending on whether they like the product. a blanket ban is completely counterproductive (especially in the case of cigarettes as i can see it making a fair loss of revenue) and is, IMO, well outside the boundaries of where the SU should operate.

also having two motions for removing bans from books because of lack of effect and including another to ban something else just isnt the best plan all in one sitting now is it?

Evilution

crash_000 wrote:

yes, you're my name for pain. want a badge? cus that'd actually be kinda cool

Nah man, no badges. One of my (many) pet peeves (but not psycho-overkill hates, to clarify!) is people who wear $hitloads of badges in their bags or jackets. They look like they OD'ed on Blue Peter.

crash_000 wrote:

i'm totally and utterly opposed to the SU banning anything from the shops.

Ditto. Next thing you know, and I'm not joking here, is that they'll be banning crisps from the shop because they make you fat!!!!!

crash_000 wrote:

IMO the job of the SU is to tackle things that the student body en masse cannot tackle itself

Aye, and don't they organise one hell of a student protest and complimentary march to government buildings?

Nietzschean

my god that su thingy was boring, 19mins, about all i could hack, hope ye enjoy'd it sophie/donal

Evilution

SkyLynx wrote:

...about all i could hack...

No pun intended, I assume?

Agent Smith

so what happened?

Nietzschean

all motion's defeated

Thrilling stuff really

Crash

Rivetting. me and shane played games

Nietzschean

was that u playing that really old game about 6/7 rows down from the back on the right hand side?

Crash

that sounds about right

xeduCat

Sort of an anti-climax , but good speeches, and a lot of people speaking at Council for the first time. And I'm glad to see that the ISS wireless network in lecture theatres is coming in handy during quiet moments

All the other motions (1-4 and 8) were passed, without any major dispute.