Ms. or Miss

simu

Which do you use?

First of all, I don't see the point of titles at all because my name is good enough to stand on its own but, when forced to chose, I'd always chose Ms. as Miss seems hopelessly outdated and sad. (Little Miss Muppet anyone?)

Amz

Usually Miss.

I was always taught that Ms. is a title usually associated with unmarried older women ... Whatever "older" is ...

I'm not bothered really.

2 Espressi

Technically Ms. is usable by both married and single, and does not infer marital status.
But nowadays it's just a matter of choice, I reckon.

Amz

Oh I know it can refer to both a married or unmarried woman.

pickarooney

If you're married, but with your own name still, I'd say you'd nearly have to use Ms.

steveland?

It's usually women who don't want to admit they're single and aging who use 'ms.'


:cool:

simu

steveland? wrote:

It's usually women who don't want to admit they're single and aging who use 'ms.'


:cool:

Golly! And I thought it meant they were freed from the shackles of sexism etc.

In about a year and a half, I should be "Dr." anyway!

RobertFoster

Dr. simu Medical or otherwise?

simu

Otherwise.

One day I'll be in a theatre and someone will start having a heart attack and someone else will cry out "Is there a doctor in the house?" and technically, I'll be able to say yes but that probably wouldn't make me very popular.

*adele*

miss

Sarky

Miss, but only after 8pm on weekends.

Badly Drunk Boy

simu wrote:

Otherwise.

So you won't be a real doctor then....

Bodan

Miss is for a young woman or teenager to be more exact
Ms is for a youngish woman in here 20's or single women
Mrs is for married women

Married Women who use Ms cant get used to the fact there getting old and not on the market or there deluded and think there in sex and the city . I've seen it in some of my older friends who are married , they think Mrs is some old woman with a scarf on there head and brush in hand .

simu

Usage Note: Many of us think of Ms. or Ms as a fairly recent invention of the women's movement, but in fact the term was first suggested as a convenience to writers of business letters by such publications as the Bulletin of the American Business Writing Association (1951) and The Simplified Letter, issued by the National Office Management Association (1952). Ms. is now widely used in both professional and social contexts. As a courtesy title Ms. serves exactly the same function that Mr. does for men, and like Mr. it may be used with a last name alone or with a full name. Furthermore, Ms. is correct regardless of a woman's marital status, thus relegating that information to the realm of private life, where many feel it belongs anyway. Some women prefer Miss or Mrs., however, and courtesy requires that their wishes be respected.

This is from the www.dictionary.com entry for "Ms".

My view is that is men have long ceased to be divided into Misters and Masters, the same should apply to women. Actually, I would take it further than that and abolish these titles altogether. This isn't always possible as many on-line forms, for example, require you to chose some title. Why should a person depend on a few letters for their dignity?

deRanged

Badly Drunk Boy wrote:

So you won't be a real doctor then....

Quite the opposite. An md isn't a real doctor - that's just their job title. They don't get a PhD at all.

Canis Lupus

I always thought mrs and mr for married.

Then Ms for master ie unmarried bloke and then miss for unmarried woman.

D

I always thought that Master was for unmarried men.

Gossip_girl

I'm part of the miss crowd.

Little Goose

pickarooney wrote:

If you're married, but with your own name still, I'd say you'd nearly have to use Ms.

Yup, Ms. to me implies that you are married but have kept your own surname.. But a lot of people use it in place of Miss.

Miss for short?!? as if it wasn't short enough!

OFDM

I use Ms when unsure of the marital status of the recipient...

Miles

So do I. Seems polite and less likely to annoy anyone by assuming.

The Sweeper

Ack - I always hated the way women had titles that denoted 'availability' - e.g. Miss or Mrs.

Ms seemed to be an answer to that - it was as nondescript as Mr - didn't give status away. I was Ms from the age of about 16!!

stagolee

is there such a title as messer? or was it just me that used to get called that by sarcastic school teachers

ArthurDent

I've always hated the fact that titles differentiate between married and single women, but not married and single men.
In spite of my username, I'm female and try to avoid either Ms or Mrs as much as possible. I never changed my surname after marriage and have a bit of a prob with letters addressed to Mr and Mrs x (but not so much if they're from strangers), the ones I really object to are from my wonderful mother-in-law addressed to Dr and Mrs X (even though it's me who is the Dr) - gotta love the woman - she really loves me!!

Gossip_girl

I used to get that too!

2 Espressi

ArthurDent wrote:

...the ones I really object to are from my wonderful mother-in-law addressed to Dr and Mrs X (even though it's me who is the Dr) ...

Is that becaused you're a Dr and a Mrs?

ArthurDent

2 Espressi wrote:

Is that becaused you're a Dr and a Mrs?

Well I am Dr (but only use the title in a work setting) and am married, but probably explained the addressing wrong, the letters are sent to Dr and Mrs Michael X (my husbands name). It's one of those small things that I should probably ignore but it drives me nuts!!!

simu

ArthurDent wrote:

Well I am Dr (but only use the title in a work setting) and am married, but probably explained the addressing wrong, the letters are sent to Dr and Mrs Michael X (my husbands name). It's one of those small things that I should probably ignore but it drives me nuts!!!

Fair enough - that would annoy me too!

BEAT

I stopped using miss when I was out of my teenage years
I always use Ms. when I have to make that choice (which I hate btw, why should my name alone not be good enough?)...to me using Miss now would be undermining?
I feel it is more distinguished somehow to use Ms.

MrPinK

simu wrote:

My view is that is men have long ceased to be divided into Misters and Masters

My bank still call me Master. I hope they never change it.

simu

MrPinK wrote:

My bank still call me Master. I hope they never change it.

But think of those poor unfortunates whose surname is Bates.

Suaimhneach

Miss, seems more lady like. I dunno, never really thought about it in depth.

Esquire means you are a free man, and miss seemingly is the equivalent.

SantaHoe

Thanks for the "I'm usually Mr. but I couldn't resist voting in this poll" option... it reminds me of the seperate birthday cake Marge made for Homer to ruin to stop him ruining the real one.
And there's an "atari jaguar" option... compulsive poll-takers really are spoilt for choice.
Excellent work.

simu

SantaHoe wrote:

Thanks for the "I'm usually Mr. but I couldn't resist voting in this poll" option... it reminds me of the seperate birthday cake Marge made for Homer to ruin to stop him ruining the real one.
And there's an "atari jaguar" option... compulsive poll-takers really are spoilt for choice.
Excellent work.

Thank you. These things are important and it's good to see others who care too.

steveland?

Jesjes wrote:

Esquire means you are a free man, and miss seemingly is the equivalent.

Or you've been watching too much Bill and Ted!

synnic404

I was trying to figure out the difference between Ms. and Miss, so I thought I'd share what I found.

Master/Miss --- usually used for children since Master was replaced by Mr. When I was little, I was always formally addressed as master and can remember asking why that was. Miss is still common, but Master is almost entirely gone these days.

Mr. --- replaced Master, just a formal title for a man, married or unmarried.

Miss --- short for mistress, it was originally just an unmarried woman. Now it's mostly for girls since feminists decided Ms. was the only non-demeaning title for women.

Ms. --- Feminsts wanted a 2 letter title like Mr. and wanted to get rid of Miss and Mrs. They failed and just added a third title. Although, mizz was a colloquial pronunciation of Mrs. in the South.

Mrs. --- A married woman.

Esquire --- a formal title used for the sons of nobles. It gets replaced when you earn a higher title of some sort.

(DeRanged)Quite the opposite. An md isn't a real doctor - that's just their job title. They don't get a PhD at all.

M.D. --- Medicinae Doctor
J.D. --- Juris Doctor (lawyers are 'doctors' too)
Ph.D. --- Philosophiae Doctor
In common usage, an M.D. is the only 'doctor'. I always get annoyed when people who don't have an M.D. use the title Dr. because it creates unnecessary confusion. In common usage, a 'doctor' is a physician. I'm sorry if that offends the Ph.D.'s out there, I know there are a lot of them...but how many J.D.'s do you see insisting that they be called 'doctor'? If you have a Ph.D., congratulations you are 'So-and-So, Ph.D'. If you have a J.D. you are 'So-and-So, J.D.' If you have an M.D., you are 'Dr. So-and-So, M.D.' Unless you're on a college campus, just get used to it because Doctor=M.D. will probably never change.

Tommy Vercetti

synnic404 wrote:

I was trying to figure out the difference between Ms. and Miss, so I thought I'd share what I found.

Master/Miss --- usually used for children since Master was replaced by Mr. When I was little, I was always formally addressed as master and can remember asking why that was. Miss is still common, but Master is almost entirely gone these days.

Mr. --- replaced Master, just a formal title for a man, married or unmarried.

Miss --- short for mistress, it was originally just an unmarried woman. Now it's mostly for girls since feminists decided Ms. was the only non-demeaning title for women.

Ms. --- Feminsts wanted a 2 letter title like Mr. and wanted to get rid of Miss and Mrs. They failed and just added a third title. Although, mizz was a colloquial pronunciation of Mrs. in the South.

Mrs. --- A married woman.

Esquire --- a formal title used for the sons of nobles. It gets replaced when you earn a higher title of some sort.


M.D. --- Medicinae Doctor
J.D. --- Juris Doctor (lawyers are 'doctors' too)
Ph.D. --- Philosophiae Doctor
In common usage, an M.D. is the only 'doctor'. I always get annoyed when people who don't have an M.D. use the title Dr. because it creates unnecessary confusion. In common usage, a 'doctor' is a physician. I'm sorry if that offends the Ph.D.'s out there, I know there are a lot of them...but how many J.D.'s do you see insisting that they be called 'doctor'? If you have a Ph.D., congratulations you are 'So-and-So, Ph.D'. If you have a J.D. you are 'So-and-So, J.D.' If you have an M.D., you are 'Dr. So-and-So, M.D.' Unless you're on a college campus, just get used to it because Doctor=M.D. will probably never change.

Excellent first post

I've always been fond of Esq., for some reason my birthday cards always had that or Master on it when I was a nipper.

pickarooney

synnic404 wrote:

Miss --- short for mistress, it was originally just an unmarried woman. Now it's mostly for girls since feminists decided Ms. was the only non-demeaning title for women.

Surely Mrs. is short for mistress?

..but how many J.D.'s do you see insisting that they be called 'doctor'?

Well, there's that guy in Scrubs...

athena 2000

D wrote:

I always thought that Master was for unmarried men.

"Master" has usually been used for boys younger than about age 13. After that age it's "Mr."

I think that Ms. is also the abbreviation for the word 'manuscript'! Scary.

sunbeam

M.D. --- Medicinae Doctor
J.D. --- Juris Doctor (lawyers are 'doctors' too)
Ph.D. --- Philosophiae Doctor
In common usage, an M.D. is the only 'doctor'. I always get annoyed when people who don't have an M.D. use the title Dr. because it creates unnecessary confusion. In common usage, a 'doctor' is a physician. I'm sorry if that offends the Ph.D.'s out there, I know there are a lot of them...but how many J.D.'s do you see insisting that they be called 'doctor'? If you have a Ph.D., congratulations you are 'So-and-So, Ph.D'. If you have a J.D. you are 'So-and-So, J.D.' If you have an M.D., you are 'Dr. So-and-So, M.D.' Unless you're on a college campus, just get used to it because Doctor=M.D. will probably never change.

MD is the the initial (albeit graduate) medical degree in the US but in Ireland and the UK it is something different-a relatively rarely awarded postgraduate research based qualification. Most medical doctors here are not awarded a doctorate, but have two or three bachelors degrees- MB BCh BAO if they are graduates of the NUI for instance. The title of doctor originally meant university teacher and it was extended to medics here as a courtesy. Similarly most dentists here do not hold a doctorate even though they may call themselves one by tradition. Surgeons here traditionally go by Mr/Miss/Ms as surgical training was not originally taught at university, but was a separate trade.

As for me, well I'll go by Ms until such time in the distant future when I get a PhD. NUIG insisted on putting Miss on my registration information for years-made me feel a bit like an ageing spinster or victorian governess....