Happy with the number of immigrants in Ireland?

Gordon

Do you teach Irish Dancing?

BlitzKrieg

Teneka wrote:

Yes, so if it was hard to teach Irish traditions etc back then with a true Irish population, imagine how difficult it will be to do so now?

why would it be more difficult?

The problem is getting the people off their arse to do it. Immigration has no effect on this. It started failing long before immigration became a noticable factor in ireland.

Irish people still obtained their culture abroad (http://www.irishhamilton.ca/gaa.htm) look! A GAA team in CANADA!!!!! BUT THEY ARE SURRONDED BY FORIEGNERS! yet still they play their cooky little irish sports...in a country which has two national languages by the way.

Do you want to know when the last major rise in general interest in the irish culture? When they formed the GAA. Why? Because it was people being active...(and here's important word) POSITIVE with their culture...what your being, blaming foriegners for your cultures death. IS NEGATIVE

Can you even speak Irish?

Can you tell me what year we became a free state?

Can you even tell me Irelands top 3 most well known myths?

Who's our patron saint?

WHY WHY WHY??? ANSWER THE F*CKING QUESTIONS!

pete

Teneka wrote:

Yes, so if it was hard to teach Irish traditions etc back then with a true Irish population, imagine how difficult it will be to do so now?

Quite.

As part of a team with Dr Helen Kelly-Holmes and Dr Sue Wright of Aston University, England, and Dr Tadhg O hlfearnain of the University of Limerick, O Laoire has researched how non-English speaking immigrants are affecting the learning of English and Irish in schools in Limerick, Clare and Kerry; a significant number of students are now learning Irish whose first language is not English.

http://www.ittralee.ie/NewsEvents/ITTinthePress/InthePress2002/May/Headline,507,en.html

"Glor offers Irish classes to non-nationals"
http://www.galwayadvertiser.ie/dws/story.tpl?inc=2005/01/20/news/55225.html

When people first meet Ilia Snatchev, they don’t believe he’s Russian.
...
Arriving in Ireland as a 12-year-old was tough.

“I remember my first class in school. It was half way through First Year and everyone was asking me my name. At first people were nice; then they got worse. It took a while for people to get used to me, and at first I didn’t have friends outside school.”

But now Ilia has loads of friends both inside and outside school. He loves hanging around with them, and going to discos and the cinema. He’s even learning Irish and is taking it for his Leaving Certificate.

http://www.faceup.ie/magazine/jan05/racism.htm

Zombrex

Teneka wrote:

Yes, so if it was hard to teach Irish traditions etc back then with a true Irish population, imagine how difficult it will be to do so now?

WHat the hell are you talking about??? YOu are just spouting complete nonsense backed up by compeletely illogical jumps of scaremongering. We can't let immigrants into Ireland because then we won't be able to teach Irish to our kids! I mean are you fcuking serious?

Firstly, Irish is taught to anyone in our schools. It doesn't matter if you are from Nigera or Mayo, if you go to school in Ireland you are taught Irish. Most nigerian babies can't speak Irish, but then again most Irish babies can't speak Irish. The nationality of the child has no bearing on what is taught to them in school. Where the hell you got that idea is beyond me. Did you actually go to school in Ireland. Give me one, just one, real reason as to why having non-Irish people in Ireland effects that situtation IN ANY WAY.

Secondly, that bulls**t statement about all the signs are going to be changed to Chinese is so stupid as to display a complete lack of basic understanding to the actual purpose of a sign! A sign is supposed to convey information. Why would the county council remove the English from a road sign post? It would make no sense because no one could understand it. If an Irish person doesn't need to understand a sign, say in a chinese shop in the city centre, they why they hell would they bother writing it in English. I don't care what the sign says out side the Chinese cafe in Dublin because I don't need to read it. Are you honestly saying you are pissed off because you can't understand the signs in Chinese food shops?? Why they hell do you want to know??? I need to know what the road signs say, that is why they would never be changed from English, because it would defeat the purpose of having the fecking sign in the first place.

God you arguments are so riduclous ... I would also like to point out that you, just like Arcade, can only talk in what WILL happen. You have absolutely no evidence that multiculturalism, immigration or refugees are causing any harm to any area of Irish life at all, what so ever, at the moment. None what so ever. ALl you can go on about is these ridiculous worst case senarios that you seem to just make up on the spot, like the idea that if we let in immigrants all our road signs are going to be changed.

Complete nonsense

pete

There's never a Mod around when you need one.

I blame the johnny foreigners.

Teneka

Quite.

Presume you meant 'quiet'. Not your fault.


So money is gone in to helping foreigners learn the language while we are forgetting about our own people. I'm sure the teaching of this will be far more interesting and all, so it will get the attention. That's why the attention isn't there in the schools. Talking about 'Subh Milis' and silly stories. That's how its being thought at the moment. You start learning Irish when you go to primary school, when you arrive in secondary school, they expect you to have a good understanding of the language when clearly the majority of the population don't. How come people find it easier to learn French or German in 1st year...and then have a better understanding of it than Irish by 6th year?

Teneka

if you go to school in Ireland you are taught Irish

Wrong, as this happened in my school. Get your facts right lad.

Are you honestly saying you are pissed off because you can't understand the signs in Chinese food shops??

Yeah, thats exactly what I said. Yep, thats it. Bang on! Well done. Actually, quote me on that while you're at it.

ALl you can go on about is these ridiculous worst case senarios that you seem to just make up on the spot, like the idea that if we let in immigrants all our road signs are going to be changed.

I like your left wing reactionist stance. Yeah, sounds great. Lets just wait around and see what happens. Who needs to plan for our future generations etc? Yeah, sure whats the point.

pete

Teneka wrote:

Presume you meant 'quiet'. Not your fault.

If I wanted you to shut up i'd say "shut the **** up."

I didn't. I said "quite", I meant "quite".

Your inadequacies in reading comprehension are your problem and i'm not going to ridicule you over it. There's far better material to work with already.

So money is gone in to helping foreigners learn the language while we are forgetting about our own people.

Examples, please.

I'm sure the teaching of this will be far more interesting and all, so it will get the attention. That's why the attention isn't there in the schools. Talking about 'Subh Milis' and silly stories. That's how its being thought at the moment.

Ehhhh, what?

You start learning Irish when you go to primary school, when you arrive in secondary school, they expect you to have a good understanding of the language when clearly the majority of the population don't. How come people find it easier to learn French or German in 1st year...and then have a better understanding of it than Irish by 6th year?

You know, if you bothered to take 2 minutes to read one of the links I posted back up the page you might be enlightened. Not much chance of that I suppose.

BlitzKrieg

So money is gone in to helping foreigners learn the language while we are forgetting about our own people.

they teach everyone so no one is forgetting about our own people!

That's why the attention isn't there in the schools. Talking about 'Subh Milis' and silly stories. That's how its being thought at the moment.

Thats how i learned irish when i was in school...and shockingly at the time there were no black people in my home town. So you cant blame foriegners for that.

How come people find it easier to learn French or German in 1st year...and then have a better understanding of it than Irish by 6th year?

i assume it would be useless to ask you to back that comment up? I found french to be most difficult (and still my most hated language) to ever lay eyes on. Irish was doddle compared to that horror story.

pete

Teneka wrote:

I like your left wing reactionist stance.

Wait.... YOU are accusing someone else of being a reactionary?

ahahahhahaaaaaaaaaa


Comedy. ****ing. Gold.

Can we frame that post, please?

Teneka

Thats how i learned irish when i was in school...and shockingly at the time there were no black people in my home town. So you cant blame foriegners for that.

Not blaming foreigners. Blaming the silly system where money has gone the wrong way.

Zombrex

Teneka wrote:

So money is gone in to helping foreigners learn the language while we are forgetting about our own people.

Your money goes towards teaching people in our schools, be they born here or moved here, about our culture! Are you actually complaining about this now, because a minute ago and a just down the page, are were complaining that we are not teaching our culture!

You are complaining that immigrants are destroying our culture, but now you are complaining that they shouldn't learn Irish in school. You are complaining that their culture will erode our culture, but you don't want to pay to teach them about our own culture. Again I ask you are you French Connection UK (FCUK!) serious!. You are just disagreeing with anything anyone says now, with no actually intelligence in your post at all.

Teneka wrote:

I'm sure the teaching of this will be far more interesting and all, so it will get the attention. That's why the attention isn't there in the schools.

Are you under some disillusion that immigrant children are taught in different schools, with high paid, more interested teachers at the neglect of Irish people?? What exactly are you talking about because that is unlike any situation I have every heard about in Ireland or any where else in Europe or America.

Teneka wrote:

How come people find it easier to learn French or German in 1st year...and then have a better understanding of it than Irish by 6th year?

I don't know but I am pretty sure you are going to blame Nigerians :rolleyes:

billy the squid

Teneka wrote:

So money is gone in to helping foreigners learn the language while we are forgetting about our own

Horse****. have you not noticed the number of gaelscoileanna being opened. there is a new secondary gaelscoil opening here in Limerick in September. all my sisters kids are going to a gaelscoil. as well as that the irish language is still a compulsary subject in the leaving certificate for those who have been studying Irish in first year.

you hardly expect people to learn a language in less than that especially when the majority of the people in this country do not speak it in everyday life.

Talking about 'Subh Milis' and silly stories. That's how its being thought at the moment. You start learning Irish when you go to primary school, when you arrive in secondary school, they expect you to have a good understanding of the language

well you have to start somewhere. the same could be said for the first "Anne and Barry" books in relation to the english language

Anne has a ball

Barry has a ball

The reason it is so difficult for the irish language to take off in this country is because it is not used in everyday life. whereas english is.

If immigration was responsible for this then why are they not ramming romanian, chinese, polish, swahili, down childrens throat in primary school.

what is "sweet jam" in swahili anyway.

How come people find it easier to learn French or German in 1st year...and then have a better understanding of it than Irish by 6th year?

That has more to do with the educational system and its faults and less to do with this "influx" of foreign nationals.

Not blaming foreigners. Blaming the silly system where money has gone the wrong way.

then it is off topic.

Teneka

pete wrote:

Wait.... YOU are accusing someone else of being a reactionary?

ahahahhahaaaaaaaaaa


Comedy. ****ing. Gold.

Can we frame that post, please?

Oh yes, I was deadly serious in comparing the two. :rolleyes:

Not see what I was getting at?

BlitzKrieg

Teneka wrote:

Not blaming foreigners. Blaming the silly system where money has gone the wrong way.

as pete has allready shown
(here:http://www.ittralee.ie/NewsEvents/ITTinthePress/InthePress2002/May/Headline,507,en.html)

the problem is not the funding or who is learning it. Its the system for teaching it. If you feel so emotional about it i recommand you get out there and promote the irish language and offer an effective system to teaching it. French and other llanguages have the same problem but no one really cares about it (except the french person who has to here my terrible pronounciations) but *shock* people do care about our own language and are demanding reform in its teaching...not its funding. Which means it has absolutly nothing to do with governemnts immigration policy.

and why have you ignored all my other questions and posts. I asked many a important question and raised numerous points yet you are ignoring them and saying the same crap. I'm gonna have to start repeating myself here if you continue to ignore these important questions. If you are unsure of them i'll give a recap.

Teneka

If immigration was responsible for this then why are they not ramming romanian, chinese, polish, swahili, down childrens throat in primary school.

Have you noticed how different religions are thought etc?

pete

Teneka wrote:

Oh yes, I was deadly serious in comparing the two. :rolleyes:

Not see what I was getting at?

Being wrong?

Zombrex

Teneka wrote:

I like your left wing reactionist stance. Yeah, sounds great. Lets just wait around and see what happens. Who needs to plan for our future generations etc? Yeah, sure whats the point.

Are you kidding me?? YOu just completely proved the point I was making about you with that sentence.

You have no evidence at all (AT ALL) that any of what you are saying will come true. None at all. All you are doing is scaremongering with completely illogical jumps. You have been asked repeatable to show how immigration effects the teaching of Irish, which you have been unable to do with out your own opinion that teachers will either stoop teaching Irish altogether or want to teach Irish to immigrants so much they will forget to teach it to Irish people (it amazes me that you can't see the riduculous contradiction in those view points).

You just make a silly argument and when people call you on it you move on to the next silly argument. A few post back you were saying the 1916 members were against immigrant or some such waffle. When called on the fact that some of them were immigrants themselve you simply moved on to the next illogical argument, that immigration will stop Irish being taught. You have been asked to show this but instead I bet you just move on to our next illogical point ... immigration effects fish stocks would be an interesting one :rolleyes:

pete

Teneka wrote:

Have you noticed how different religions are thought etc?

Care to elaborate on your thoughts there?

BlitzKrieg

Originally Posted by Teneka
Have you noticed how different religions are thought etc?

Care to elaborate on your thoughts there?

dont worry i think its another one of those illogical jumps

Teneka

I've to release some poo so I'll be back tomorrow at some stage. Hope the bathroom is clean!

billy the squid

Teneka wrote:

I've to release some poo so I'll be back tomorrow at some stage. Hope the bathroom is clean!

take a look at your last few posts, havent you released enough

elivsvonchiaing

Having read this thread - fail to see this debate having any merit after page 7.

This thread was fueled/and prolonged by a threat to ban anyone who names a racist in the thread- think this made the thread keep going - I'm not going to name the racist - but there's one there somewhere! :mad:


This is just my opinion - I expect others to contradict me - or echo this - I just can't handle apathy! :eek:

BlitzKrieg

i asked a question on page 4 i think it was repeated again in pete's round up and it still remains unanswered, if we stop proving him wrong or lock the thread (without proper merit) he will declare himself right by default. which will have no effect on anyone or anything beyond the poo in his *clean* toilet but for the sake of my respect for humanity and hope for the future i am not going to allow him to have that hollow victory.

so yes this topic has been dead for a very long time.


just a quick question. If someone has definiatly made racist comments does that merit a lock (or ban ) cause i can find 2 on the last page alone.

pete

This recent thread on stormfront should be borne in mind when reading the guff from these clowns

http://www.stormfront.org/forum/showthread.php?t=180177

Re: Irish dignitaries will mark the liberation of Auschwitz with poignant tributes

---

might be godo to start a revionist campagin coming up to this ....get messages on all irish based boards , sites , flyers in the citys etc

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=2319421&postcount=67 Who's with me?

therecklessone

Teneka wrote:

In my former school, the foreigners didn't have to learn Irish. Does that make them less Irish than anyone else? Of course.

I know of two people (the only two I am personally aware of) who benefitted from this is school. Both are Irish, born outside this country and schooled in their country of birth for a number of years. Both born to at least one Irish parent. What's your point again?

Teneka wrote:

You are forgetting the whole 'sympathy' feeling in this country towards foreigners. Romania, China, Russia, Nigeria...the list is endless, all are countries that are coping well. Yet, people from such countries pass through numerous nations to reach a small island in west europe. Wonder why.

What are you talking about here? Immigration, or asylum?

They are not one and the same!

I'll make this clear and concise for you. Regarding asylum, we are required by international convention to give asylum to those who arrive in this country and qualify for asylum.

1948 Universal Declaration of Human Rights

Article 14.
(1) Everyone has the right to seek and to enjoy in other countries asylum from persecution.

(2) This right may not be invoked in the case of prosecutions genuinely arising from non-political crimes or from acts contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations.

Teneka wrote:

And where is my freedom of speech, when I mention that our immigration policy is a joke I'm suddenly branded a racist?

Has anybody denied you the right of free speech? You're free to say what you say, and we're free to poke holes in your feeble arguments (and if necessary point out your racist rhetoric)

therecklessone

Question for Teneka:

If you're so concerned about Irish culture, where did you get your username from?

therecklessone

Teneka wrote:

Believe me, I can. I have a Chinese friend in my class, it wouldn't be that hard.

Given your constant interchanging of the terms immigrant and asylum seeker, I doubt you have the ability to tell your ar*e from your elbow.

Teneka wrote:

I don't feel the need to allow them in to our country. The wages they earn in are way in excess of the normal wage in their home country. Money earned here is sent home via Western Union and the like. I've seen this happen.

Sound familiar?

During the second half of 19th century, annual remittances from Irish migrants in the United States exceeded $8 million in some years. Considering those sums, the historian Patrick J. Blessing concluded, "large-scale Irish peasant movement to the New World, therefore, was not a mindless flight from intolerable conditions, but, within the limited range of alternatives, a deliberate departure of generally literate individuals who were very much concerned with the survival and well-being of family and friends remaining at home."

Source

The counterflow of remittances and information from the United States to Ireland played a vital role in the lives of the Irish at home and abroad. Contemporary observers in the United States noted with amazement the large share of American earnings sent home, while accounts of rural life in Ireland described the vital role remittances from America played in the maintenance of the family farm.

Source

Those dastardly Paddys eh? Should have been thrown back from whence they came eh?

ArthurDent

Teneka wrote:

?

Of course you're prevented from learning Irish. You are outnumbered in your school. Think the foreigners are going to learn Irish? In my former school, the foreigners didn't have to learn Irish. Does that make them less Irish than anyone else? Of course.

Teneka

The only two people I have personal experience of being excused from learning Irish in school are my sister and my niece, both Irish, and both chronically dyslexic. They were both given exemptions from learning Irish because it is very difficult for them to learn to write a language that isn't written phonetically. Does this make them less Irish?

Also I'm involved in a school that currently has over 40% of pupils for whom "english is not their first language" (ie "foreign") and not one, I repeat not one of them is exempted from studying Irish. Care to expand on how this prevents any of the other pupils from learning Irish?

BuffyBot

I'll just do what you did by saying that FROM MY OWN EXPERIENCE, the number of Chinese in Dublin is higher than any other foreigner.

And of course, you wouldn't be biased in any way now, would you...?