Should gerrard go?

Chucky the tree

Saw this is in the shankely thread but felt it deserved discussion on its own.

i feel it would nearly be the best if gerrard left. Especially if we miss out on champions league.We need the money, we could buy 3,4 quality players for the price.

Unless the club gets injection of money i feel its the only way we can actually move forward and have a chance of challenging for the EPL.

Jivin Turkey

No. Liverpool dont need the money and will still spend close to 20M next summer either way.

yop

Gerrard will leave soon especially if pool do not make the champions league, winning a Carling Cup is not or should not be his goal, Chelsea want him and possibly Real or Barca, if he wants to win real medals then he is better to walk away, some how I do not think that it will be the clubs choice

cournioni

If he wants to win big trophies, he should move. Liverpool don't look capable of winning anything other than the Carling Cup which shouldn't be a priority for any Premiership player.

puntosporting

Id love to ba able to answer that question at the moment it looks like he should leave,but personaly id like him to give benitez another season and then see how the club has progressed!

Villain

He'll be gone in the summer unless Liverpool win a cup or begin to challenge the top 3, I think thats widely accepted. What price would they get?? 30 million?

WhiteWashMan

for his own career, a move would be best. he looks a great player in a team full of mediocre players. i think he would benefit more from a move to a better team.

i also think pool could do with a decent amount of spending money to buy in some players. after all, liverpool fans keep telling me they have the smallest squad in the league. hey, everton have done well without rooney. in fact, i think they are better without him

p.pete

What's best for Gerrard is possibly to leave the club - depending on how seriously he wants to win medals as opposed to how seriously he wants to win medals with Liverpool. It's a bit of a romantic idea in this day in age, it's extremely rare for players to spend all their careers in the one club. Ryan Giggs I'm sure doesn't regret it but then again he's won loads with United.

Apart from Chelsea however I think that there isn't that many clubs that he could go to automaitcally presume to win things over the next 5 to 8 years. United look well set for the next few years also (financially and squad) but I'd hope that idea wouldn't appeal to him. Madrid have been a great club and Barcelona are currently fantastic but these are clubs that seem to habitually self destruct so there's no gaurantee.

From a Liverpool point of view the idea of using for money to buy new players can't be discarded but as some pundits say what's the point of building for the future to be a top club if you're going to let the best player go? I want him to stay and I want the money to be there to build the squad also. There's other avenues to achieving that which hopefully we go down...

p.pete

WhiteWashMan wrote:

after all, liverpool fans keep telling me they have the smallest squad in the league. hey, everton have done well without rooney. in fact, i think they are better without him

You're equating Everton losing one player (who they used sparingly anyway) with Liverpool fans griping about size of squad

As I'm sure irish1 will tell you, Dave O'Leary proudly points out that they've the smallest squad (despite having the top youth team who aren't counted as squad, most of youth team are counted as squad and they're crap ). Also Chelsea like to claim their squad is small

Villain

p.pete wrote:

You're equating Everton losing one player (who they used sparingly anyway) with Liverpool fans griping about size of squad

As I'm sure irish1 will tell you, Dave O'Leary proudly points out that they've the smallest squad (despite having the top youth team who aren't counted as squad, most of youth team are counted as squad and they're crap ). Also Chelsea like to claim their squad is small

My Da was at the United v Villa game last week and brought me home a programme, he was laughing at the back page where the squads were listed, United's squad was twice the size of Villa's

p.pete

irish1 wrote:

My Da was at the United v Villa game last week and brought me home a programme, he was laughing at the back page where the squads were listed, United's squad was twice the size of Villa's

And if you bought the programme for the Liverpool match you went to you would have seen the same thing

KdjaCL

How is gerrard a great player? For having the ability to disappear in big games? Or being able to control games vs smaller teams?

If someone offers 30 million take it , buy in a tackling midfielder and with Alonso would be a decent central mid.

Gerrard has been shown up vs Arse Utd and Chelsea as an average player but vs Fulham hes great.

Take the money and get rid imo.

kdjac

Villain

p.pete wrote:

And if you bought the programme for the Liverpool match you went to you would have seen the same thing

Ah ya but most of the liverpool players names were in French or Spanish

WhiteWashMan

p.pete wrote:

You're equating Everton losing one player (who they used sparingly anyway) with Liverpool fans griping about size of squad

As I'm sure irish1 will tell you, Dave O'Leary proudly points out that they've the smallest squad (despite having the top youth team who aren't counted as squad, most of youth team are counted as squad and they're crap ). Also Chelsea like to claim their squad is small

no, im saying that with the money they could get for gerrard, they could increase the size of the squad.
and the fact that rooney (sapringly? well, im not so sure about that) left for utd, didnt do everton any harm at all. in fact they now play better.

is this clear enough?

p.pete

WhiteWashMan wrote:

no, im saying that with the money they could get for gerrard, they could increase the size of the squad.
and the fact that rooney (sapringly? well, im not so sure about that) left for utd, didnt do everton any harm at all. in fact they now play better.

is this clear enough?

How many players have Everton actually brought in with that money? One or two spring to mind but I don't think they've added to their squad enormously (probably I should verify that before commiting it to writing but then there'd be a danger of getting accused of being anally retentive if I start quoting stuff).

Yes Everton we're able to splash 6mil on a striker during the window which they probably wouldn't have if Rooney was still there but Liverpool have also just spent 6mil on a striker so I'm actually not getting the Everton Liverpool comparison that you're trying to contrive....

*promptly runs away to stick head back in sand*

WhiteWashMan

ah, you see, im not comparing liverpool and everton.
i merely suggested that everton play better now they have made a bunch of cash on their young starlet.
i see no reason why liverpool may not be able to do the same, and buy some other players, and stop liverpool fans complaining about their small squad.

is it really that hard to understand?

mayordenis

KdjaC wrote:

How is gerrard a great player? For having the ability to disappear in big games? Or being able to control games vs smaller teams?

If someone offers 30 million take it , buy in a tackling midfielder and with Alonso would be a decent central mid.

Gerrard has been shown up vs Arse Utd and Chelsea as an average player but vs Fulham hes great.

Take the money and get rid imo.

kdjac

kd you know your talkin ****e, you must know it,
he doesnt disappear in big games, take the olympiakos match,
take the arsenal match he was immense,
dont come on here and start spouting ****e,
there is a reason why the chelsea's and the real's of this world want to spend 30+ million on him.
but no they are all wrong and little kdjac is right.
Shut up thanks.

BaZmO*

I don't think it's a case of "should he go?" it's more a case of "when he's going?"

B.

KdjaCL

mayordenis wrote:

kd you know your talkin ****e, you must know it,
he doesnt disappear in big games, take the olympiakos match,
take the arsenal match he was immense,
dont come on here and start spouting ****e,
there is a reason why the chelsea's and the real's of this world want to spend 30+ million on him.
but no they are all wrong and little kdjac is right.
Shut up thanks.

The world beating Olympiakios ? Against Arse he was non existent barley got a kick, only people who think he is a great player are liverpool fans and england fans. hes an average player who looks greta vs small te+ams but in every single big game hes gone missing. Man utd last week , played a stormer didnt he looked the 30 million odd player.



Pool should take the money and get rid asap.

kdjac

p.pete

WhiteWashMan wrote:

is it really that hard to understand?

Took a while, think the penny's dropped

Villain

Hold on Kdjac, don't go speaking for us all, Gerrard is a world class player, Ferguson said it lately and Chelsea and Real tried to sign him , and I think Sir Alex and Jose might know a little more about football than either you or me. Sure he has bad games, but he's playing in a side that is struggling at the moment. I went to the Pool-Villa game, and I have to say he was the best player on the pitch by a long shot, in a class of his own.

I wonder would you rate differently if he was playing for United, Arsenal or Chelsea.

p.pete

KdjaC wrote:

Man utd last week , played a stormer didnt he looked the 30 million odd player.

I think the entire team collectively would have struggled to justify a price tag of 30mil based on the performance last week against United. These things happen and I'd be smug if it was the other way round so fair enough.

Point about the Olympiakos game was that we we're 2-0 down and dead in the water and yet again he dragged us kicking and screaming, into the next round of the Champions League on that occasion. Agreed Olympiakos aren't world beaters.

KdjaCL

*I* dont think he is a world class player and if they get 30 million for him take it.

kdjac

WhiteWashMan

took you a lot of posts to get that *I* in there.

BaZmO*

KdjaC wrote:

only people who think he is a great player are liverpool fans and england fans. hes an average player who looks greta vs small te+ams but in every single big game hes gone missing

Speak for yourself there Buddy!
I'm neither a Liverpool supporter nor an English supporter and I think he's class ya big Flamer!!!*

*I was gonna say more until I copped that you're just looking for a reaction. You're just doing what a lot of people do when the general concensus is that a player has got that world class ability.

B.

Villain

KdjaC wrote:

only people who think he is a great player are liverpool fans and england fans.

KdjaC wrote:

*I* dont think he is a world class player and if they get 30 million for him take it. kdjac

Bit of a change in opinion there :rolleyes:

KdjaCL

irish1 wrote:

Bit of a change in opinion there :rolleyes:

Not really most people i know would agree, but this is boards.

Isnt world class meant to be top player in their respective league ,europe and on international stage, or has it been refined to good vs Bolton?

His range of passes is hmmm over the top to Owen , Now Owen gone his assist rate is near halved. His tackling and ball winning abilites are superb when Nolan running at him but if its an actual decent player like Robben Duff Pires Ronaldo he seems to win less tackles. And should it be another combatant mid , gerrard suddenly changes to Houdini on tha back of his jersey.


World class pmidfielders are generally players who in more than half of their league games play superbly well but in every game vs the top teams play better. Gerrard doesnt do that and i have yet to see him be this super duper player everyone says he is vs any of the top 3.

kdjac

Villain

KdjaC wrote:

Not really most people i know would agree, but this is boards.

Isnt world class meant to be top player in their respective league ,europe and on international stage, or has it been refined to good vs Bolton?

His range of passes is hmmm over the top to Owen , Now Owen gone his assist rate is near halved. His tackling and ball winning abilites are superb when Nolan running at him but if its an actual decent player like Robben Duff Pires Ronaldo he seems to win less tackles. And should it be another combatant mid , gerrard suddenly changes to Houdini on tha back of his jersey.


World class pmidfielders are generally players who in more than half of their league games play superbly well but in every game vs the top teams play better. Gerrard doesnt do that and i have yet to see him be this super duper player everyone says he is vs any of the top 3.

kdjac

Head - Sand - Remove?

Thats your opinion, which you are entitled to, but don't go saying things like, only Pool or England fans rate him because I can assure you I am neither, quite the opposite in fact. But in my opinion he is world class and I think that opinion is shared by Real Madrid who tried to have a clause in the Morientas deal that they got first option on him and also by Jose and Sir Alex who have both said they would love to have him in their team.

WhiteWashMan

KdjaC wrote:

World class pmidfielders are generally players who in more than half of their league games play superbly well but in every game vs the top teams play better. Gerrard doesnt do that and i have yet to see him be this super duper player everyone says he is vs any of the top 3.

i think he does.

yop

Gerard not a class player, do I sense someone who knows thats that Gerard will see sense and leave pool so that he can turn around and say "sure he is not that good anyway", when he does
come on lad, he is a top notch player, he was poor against United because he was on his own, none of the other pool players stood up and fought with him.
Who ever gets him either Chelsea or Madrid will get a top class player.

p.pete

yop wrote:

Gerard not a class player, do I sense someone who knows thats that Gerard will see sense and leave pool so that he can turn around and say "sure he is not that good anyway", when he does

Dear God - that's devious. That'd be like ManU putting out there strongest team in the Carling Cup and claiming the next day that the competition doesn't matter. It's sinister I tells thee.

d22ontour

i would love utd to buy him but there is no chance of that happening

i think he is a great player not quite the midfield general like keane or vieira but has more to offer going forward than either of them

career wise he would probably be better off leaving,in fact i would rather him leave it might push liverpool back another few years away from challenging

BKtje

i gotta agree with kdjac to a certain extent. You cant call a player world class till he can consistently do it. I dont deny that hes a very good player but i wouldnt put him up there with the likes of Keane, Viera Zidane etc. They are world class players who can do it week in week out against any side.

Sure Gerrard won Liverpool th olympiakos game and di well vs arsenal but thats 2 big games....theres more than that in a season. He needs to become more consistent. I dont deny that he has a suitcate full of potential talent.
He needs a good manager to bring it out of him tho imo. Houllier wasnt that manager, Benitez (thus far) hasnt done muhc, SVG wouldnt gave a clue.
Give him to Ferguson, Mourinho or Wenger. Then we may see his best.

yop

"Dear God - that's devious. That'd be like ManU putting out there strongest team in the Carling Cup and claiming the next day that the competition doesn't matter. It's sinister I tells thee."

LOL, feck off cup

The Insider

KdjaC wrote:

His range of passes is hmmm over the top to Owen , Now Owen gone his assist rate is near halved. His tackling and ball winning abilites are superb when Nolan running at him but if its an actual decent player like Robben Duff Pires Ronaldo he seems to win less tackles. And should it be another combatant mid , gerrard suddenly changes to Houdini on tha back of his jersey.

ROFL...I think that is the funniest and most ill informed statement that I have read so far on this forum. Have you got any stats to back up these sweeping comments or even better how many times have you watched Gerard this season and be honest.

You can argue about calling someone a world class player. Some people think the term is thrown about to much which may be true. However if you think of central midfield players, Gerard is up there with the best, I would say he is in the top 10 midfielders in the world, for me that makes him world class.

BaZmO*

B-K-DzR wrote:

i gotta agree with kdjac to a certain extent. You cant call a player world class till he can consistently do it. I dont deny that hes a very good player but i wouldnt put him up there with the likes of Keane, Viera Zidane etc. They are world class players who can do it week in week out against any side.

I know what you're saying but we have to be realistic here.

Keane - 33 - (34 in August)

Viera - 28 - (29 in June)

Zidane - 32 - (33 in June)

Gerrard - 24 - (25 in May)

Nobody is comparing him to the proven record of the other 3. It would be impossible to do so. Keane and Zidane have also 10 years on him and Viera 4, but look who they play with, which imo makes a difference.

I personally think Gerrard is a class player but his big test is when he leaves Liverpool, which he will and then when he is surrounded by top class players week in week out he can then be judged. After all, he potentially has his best years ahead of him.

B.

BKtje

Nobody is comparing him to the proven record of the other 3. It would be impossible to do so. Keane and Zidane have also 10 years on him and Viera 4, but look who they play with, which imo makes a difference.

I agree that they got the years and im not saying he wont ever make it . All im saying is that atm he is not. Giving him some decent players to play along side would help